Thread: Astrologian 5.0 Discussion

Originally Posted by Rahspdoy

*apparently it wouldnt let me make a new post, so adding to this one*



If no one cared about, or wanted any of the other cards at all, then why even have Astrologist in the game?

Just buy 99 of these: Braised_Pipira and your all set!

Instant Astrologist. +8% damage that lasts for 30 minutes, and with the added benefits of not disappearing when you die. Instant cast time, You didnt have to wait for them to get a tripple set of Signs... and frees up a extra place for another DPS in the group!

Because that is exactly what i feel Astrologist are now. A walking Food buff.

Again, this comes as a surprise to me that this is such an epiphany for many of you. I mean, why do you think your parties always preferred you over WHM since late HW? Did you think it was because you feel you can heal better than they can, or somehow bring more pDPS? Did you think it was because of Synastry, Lightspeed, Essential Dignity, Earthly Star, or Collective Unconscious? Did you think it was because of your access to the Bole, the Spire, the Ewer, or the Arrow?

This is why earlier I said the core concept of AST has not changed with these 5.0 job actions, and that you're still going to be able to do what you've been doing for an entire expansion: Increase rDPS. Despite the ridiculous amount of utility AST currently has, this is the sole reason why you are chosen over WHM and will continue to be. If it was taken away in 5.0, you would be replaced by WHM because at least they will be able to increase damage reduction for the raid, and also very likely bring more pDPS.

The complexity of the current card system that is going away will only be missed by the AST's who enjoyed the fishing. You feel like the job has been disemboweled yet it will still have a warm seat waiting for them in the meta. Would you like to take a guess why? The answer is in your closing statement.

Originally Posted by Punslinger

Yes, the fishing was a big part of what made AST engaging. It certainly wasn't the healing, because every healer's toolkit is absurdly powerful relative to the pitiful amounts of incoming damage in FF14's fights. It certainly wasn't our mindless DPS "rotation" consisting of one button we push over and over and over and over and over and over and over. The ONLY unique and even remotely engaging thing about AST was the card system and the tools (TiDi, CelOpp) it had for playing with buffs. Otherwise, it's just a WHM reskin.

I understand that frustration, and know how it feels to have your job gutted. Thing is though a lot of those card buffs were going away one way or the other. We simply could not continue with AST and SCH being able to increase dmg, crit, and speed. Those are all variations of a rDPS increase. Plus they can also increase rDEF on top of that. What truly makes zero sense is they didn't give at least AoE haste to WHM, or AoE cleanse from SCH to WHM? These stay in the realm of their 'pure healer' concept and they just blasted them into space.

You said that "cards aren't jobs" and that we can't just have all BLMs because not everybody likes the BLM playstyle. Yet you see no problem with all three healers playing exactly the same way in 5.0? Having exactly the same "one DoT, one spammable nuke" DPS rotation that AST currently suffers from?

This is a separate issue. I know it is relative to your statements, but answering the questions would veer things off topic. However, I did brush over my thoughts on AST DPS in my initial post in the thread.

There is a vast middle ground between the status quo and the "everything's a Balance" abomination that is Nu-AST. Maybe, just maybe, Balance should have been nerfed instead of copy/pasted onto the other five cards?

The problem IS the Balance. It's a virus within the card system. I actually think letting healers have any form of rDPS is implosive for the healer role in general. The balance is ironically preventing the balance. I think the cards should have different effects too, but none of them are a rDPS increase. Leave that for the DPS. They should get healer related buffs: MP refresh, AoE cleanse, mDEF increase, increased healing from healing magic, ogcd heal, self-haste; there are all kinds of effects they can give to those cards, even if they wanted to keep the 3-seal system they're going with. But I can't emphasize or repeat enough that rDPS increase from healers needs to go away completely.

Originally Posted by Gemina

The problem IS the Balance. It's a virus within the card system. I actually think letting healers have any form of rDPS is implosive for the healer role in general. The balance is ironically preventing the balance. I think the cards should have different effects too, but none of them are a rDPS increase. Leave that for the DPS. They should get healer related buffs: MP refresh, AoE cleanse, mDEF increase, increased healing from healing magic, ogcd heal, self-haste; there are all kinds of effects they can give to those cards, even if they wanted to keep the 3-seal system they're going with. But I can't emphasize or repeat enough that rDPS increase from healers needs to go away completely.

On this, we can agree.

There's a lot of design space for meaningful buffs that allow for interplay with healing abilities, and that the dev team chose not to pursue any of these possibilities is maddening. Maybe they'll eventually rework healers into something awesome in 6.0, but for 5.0, they've left everything gutted and half-finished.

Sometimes, it honestly feels like DPS is the only role Square actually cares about. They get well-designed classes with complex rotations, while healer job design seems like it's an afterthought undertaken with the least possible effort.