Needs to be asked.....on Male Viera

[Gwenorai]

No, no no no no.

If i recall correctly the chain of events was: bunny men would be weird -> artwork of bunny men (i forgot the context of it and if it was something some people did in their free time which is not uncommon) -> Yoshi P saying that if people really want Viera he had to create a male only race since Viera are female

this was all years ago and people conveniently keep forgetting the bit Yoshi said Viera would be female only.

Over time I've been aware of a lot of requests for Viera. Not male or female Viera. Just Viera which lore-wise up until now... it's been exclusively female. I'm still wondering where this whole male thing came from.

This is why Yoshi P says we don't even know what we want. We as a community are terrible. We asked for Viera, we got it and still we're not happy because we want the males too.

I believe this spins off from the fact there has always been males. They have been mentioned in each game, if I recall - with more information being given to us in FF14. The only game that stated them as strictly female was a fault in one of the guides. The males always existed, we just didn't see them. So I believe the logic that was followed was a series of events that transpired from comments from Yoshida. While people voted for Viera a portion of them assumed that Yoshida would not go back on his word regarding the gender lock. His two comments contradicted one another, as it were.

When he stated that he would have a male-only race to balance out Viera, there was a time gap - after that, his team produced concept art of a male Viera - which we saw. Add this to the fact that we obviously got a large amount of lore about the males that yet again solidified that they do indeed exist.

Now, we know that it isn't lore that's the issue here. The original creator of Viera has already basically stated that lore isn't the reason - they were never female only, you just didn't see the males.

So no...

Honestly, the same issue would have transpired even if they didn't add in Viera and instead gave us Lupin. We've only seen Lupin males so far, yet we know females exist. If they added in Lupins instead of Hrothgar - Lupin's being the race that was asked for most after Viera - we would still have this complaining.

Assumptions were made; we shouldn't have done that. I was one of them, but ah well. That's the explantion of it all.

[WhiteArchmage]

Over time I've been aware of a lot of requests for Viera. Not male or female Viera. Just Viera which lore-wise up until now... it's been exclusively female. I'm still wondering where this whole male thing came from.

Final Fantasy XII Ultimania. Page 62. Viera are so isolationist that Men and Women live in different villages. They're not female only. I'll be glad to link you the Viera request thread when people were asking for males and females.

Also, on your comment about the artwork: it was shown because Viera were considered as HW's new race, but Au Ra beat them out. So at one point it was considered that Male and Female Viera would feature in XIV.

[Senn]

Over time I've been aware of a lot of requests for Viera. Not male or female Viera. Just Viera which lore-wise up until now... it's been exclusively female. I'm still wondering where this whole male thing came from.

Not true. I've been requesting male and female viera for years.
Here is my original viera thread where I requested both males and females twice in my OP. The OP is not edited.

[CoolDad]

If i recall correctly the chain of events was: bunny men would be weird -> artwork of bunny men (i forgot the context of it and if it was something some people did in their free time which is not uncommon) -> Yoshi P saying that if people really want Viera he had to create a male only race since Viera are female

this was all years ago and people conveniently keep forgetting the bit Yoshi said Viera would be female only.

Over time I've been aware of a lot of requests for Viera. Not male or female Viera. Just Viera which lore-wise up until now... it's been exclusively female. I'm still wondering where this whole male thing came from.

This is why Yoshi P says we don't even know what we want. We as a community are terrible. We asked for Viera, we got it and still we're not happy because we want the males too.

No, he said "a rabbit male might weird" and that they might have to make another counterpart in 2013 (Source: https://www.siliconera.com/2013/02/2...baby-behemoth/). Then the heavensward artwork including the bunny men was shown (however Yoshi said he didn't like how they looked and was hesitant to show it off because of that, iirc).

People expected male Viera partly because of the concept art that came out for Heavensward as well as the widespread belief by the community in general that this game wouldn't have races locked to certain genders because of the change from 1.0 to 2.0. If you look through the gender locked races thread (which was created when the female Viera were shown but not the males in the second fan fest) you'll see a fair bit of this.

Truthfully there wasn't any more reason not to expect male Viera than to expect them at the time. In fact many people were reading that dramaturge lore dump pretty hopefully, believing that they gave so much information to set up an event that would finally make male Viera visible or something, or that they wouldn't lore dump anything related to male Viera if they weren't going to add them (I believe this discussion happened mostly in the original Viera support thread?). People only started getting worried after the second fanfest and a little more so after the Hrothgar name drop bug in the French version.

omg why dont you all wait for tokyo fanfast? what the heck is your problems? Overreactions, y'all gonna look super dumb later.

Edit:

I still haven't found any information regarding that artwork though. was it something someone did on their free time? were they just brainstorming ideas?

Like I said. it's not the first time they show us stuff they have done for fun + on their free time. Why is everyone taking it as gospel? or is it just because if fits their view?

The artwork was official concept art created during the production of Heavensward, shown during a FATE in Tokyo event. It also included earlier designs for Au Ra that caused a bit of controversy as well.

[Canadane]

They’re almost always idle threats. Not all mind you, but this is also why nobody (SE included) takes such posts seriously.

[SahreeYurblu]

From what I have seen it looks to fall into the spectrum of double standards and feeling under represented. Many LGBT ( not all ) people feel like the exclusion of male viera was an attack on a more fem male model or at the very least the fact that girls are allowed to be sexy but boys have to be a burly and manly. Along with comments about male bunnies being "weird" in a interview, the dev team feeling uncomfortable making the gold saucer bunny outfit for men and using "lore" as an excuse at fan fest but then immediately admitting it had more to do with time and variety. It helped push those feelings of being mislead and not valued as a demographic along. I am not going to quit but I can see why they may feel that way but Yoshi has stated the reasons and I truly believe he wanted to make everyone happy.

I have no idea from the concept art for HW how anyone got the idea we'd have this super feminine male Vieras. Also in a fantasy world, how the hell do people get the idea that any of them are LGBT or trans? They're pixels. Here's the original concept art.

[dustdjinn]

I have no idea from the concept art for HW how anyone got the idea we'd have this super feminine male Vieras. Also in a fantasy world, how the hell do people get the idea that any of them are LGBT or trans? They're pixels. Here's the original concept art.

I am just telling you what I heard not that I believed they would be and I didn't say SUPER fem but I think many envisioned more soft features. I think the fact the females are beautiful people assumed the males would have to be too and the idea of being a smaller segregated group that wasn't truly understood resonated with the LGTB. (Maybe it has something to do all women living together and all men living together only getting together to reproduce.) The community didn't assume the race was full of gays but we related to them and could have projected a rejection of them as a rejection of us.

You may argue being gay has nothing to do with male viera but it was the first insult used to discredit them so it seems like everyone sees a connection on both sides.

[SahreeYurblu]

I am just telling you what I heard not that I believed they would be and I didn't say SUPER fem but I think many envisioned more soft features. I think the fact the females are beautiful people assumed the males would have to be too and the idea of being a smaller segregated group that wasn't truly understood resonated with the LGTB. (Maybe it has something to do all women living together and all men living together only getting together to reproduce.) The community didn't assume the race was full of gays but we related to them and could have projected a rejection of them as a rejection of us.

You may argue being gay has nothing to do with male viera but it was the first insult used to discredit them so it seems like everyone sees a connection on both sides.

Again, the only image we ever had was the one I posted, how in the world did anyone imagine them that way? If the community didn't assume the race was gay or trans, why would they see the rejection of the race as a rejection of themselves? This makes no sense to me at all. I have quite a few friends and family that are in the LGBT community, I just don't see any connection between gay or trans people and male Viera whatsoever. It's a fantasy race in a video game, it's pixels on a screen. I don't look at ANY FFXIV race and assume their sexuality, so don't understand why this is even a question here.

At what point was the male Viera discredited for being gay? I'm completely unaware of the gay male Viera that was ever promised or hinted at. Please enlighten us.

[kidalutz]

I am just telling you what I heard not that I believed they would be and I didn't say SUPER fem but I think many envisioned more soft features. I think the fact the females are beautiful people assumed the males would have to be too and the idea of being a smaller segregated group that wasn't truly understood resonated with the LGTB. (Maybe it has something to do all women living together and all men living together only getting together to reproduce.) The community didn't assume the race was full of gays but we related to them and could have projected a rejection of them as a rejection of us.

You may argue being gay has nothing to do with male viera but it was the first insult used to discredit them so it seems like everyone sees a connection on both sides.

See that is the problem with several things anymore. People read they comprehend to an extent but fail when it comes to context and content discernment this is a fault of the school educational system because they don't encompass a thorough reading comprehension program anymore.They accept that literate is good enough and hang the rest. The result is we have have unhoned critical thinking skills and thus will use our passion rather than our logic to sort through things. Logically thought through we can see that no actual insult or harm was ever intended. However passionately thought through with the information we received it looked as if it was a slap in the face.

This is why when we receive information we absolutely have to start sorting through it rationally and with as much critical thinking as we can hone ourselves become better informed gain new insight into things and from there break down the context of the content in as scientifically dispassionate regard as we can. Information has no intent it is simply an accumulation of data. Literature as in books or ebooks of the Fictional Sort, Fantasy, Mystery, Etc. Are there to be mixed with passion when read. Non Fiction: Information, Biographies, True Crime stories. Read with logic and thought through rationally.

[zeylos]

There are many threads discussing this topic I know, but Ive noticed that people are so upset about this that they say they will stop playing the game, and start talking about FFXIV's budget and say things like FFXIV's future looks bad.

Out of any and all other Reasons........why is it Over Not having a playable Male Option for the Viera?

I get that people are upset about not getting something they want, but why literally ragequit an entire game over it?

I myself reeeally want to play as a male Viera, and I think it makes ZERO sense to unsubscribe because they're not here for a variety of reasons. First of all, un subscribing means se gets less money, which equals to less chances of male Viera. Then, while it is important for me, the game is still very fun and I live my FC. Finally, I'm quite positive we will see them sometime being added, and I feel like ppl should be more patient.
As a side note, I would appreciate if ppl who don't want male Viera for whatever reason could be a bit more respectful towards those who want them (and the same for the other side ofc)