Letter from the Producer LXII

[MomomiMomi]

Did you expect that people would be satisfied and not ask for the other race if just one was released? "WE DIDN'T NEED MORE CUTE RACES, WE NEEDED BEASTS! SE WASTED THE CHANCE TO MAKE THIS GAME DIFFERENT!11!", or "I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY AREN'T GIVING US VIERA BECAUSE OF A BEAST RACE THAT NO ONE WILL PLAY!!111one!!"

I know the story because there was a huge and annoying drama back when Au Ra was released. Please do not think that this wouldn't be the same. People are going to complain no matter what the outcome is, so SE's choice wasn't bad or good. It just wasn't your personal favourite.

My personal favourite would be Viera only and no beasts races, but I have enough of a brain to understand that my tastes aren't the very core of what makes the world go round. Many people wanted Viera, many people wanted beasts -or at least did create a HUGE drama back in the day because of it-, SE had resources to make just a single race -male and female-, and made the choice that would include both races. As much as I wanted male Vieras, this sounds reasonable to me.

Only problem with that is that before, we knew about Viera for quite a long time. We didn't know about Hrothgar. The expectation, then, was that there weren't going to be any beasts, and I'd say reasonably, people expected to be able to make a male Viera.

Now we're in a situation where people want male Viera, and on top of that, people want something they didn't know they wanted: female Hrothgar. So the amount of people left wanting is more than if they had just given us Viera.

[Kaedan]

Only problem with that is that before, we knew about Viera for quite a long time. We didn't know about Hrothgar. The expectation, then, was that there weren't going to be any beasts, and I'd say reasonably, people expected to be able to make a male Viera.

Now we're in a situation where people want male Viera, and on top of that, people want something they didn't know they wanted: female Hrothgar. So the amount of people left wanting is more than if they had just given us Viera.

No, this really isn't the case. I can pretty much guarantee that the number of people who wanted to play bunnybois is smaller than the number of people that wanted a beast race at all.

Yoshida did the best thing he could by satisfying as many people as possible. There were ALWAYS going to be disappointed people. But if they had only made one of the races, there would be far more people disappointed.

This can be observed after they datamined Hrothgar coming out. There were almost as many people hoping to play Hrothgar as there were wanting Viera, even before the announcement.

If they had released just Viera, then the beast race playerbase would be pissed because Yoshida has said they aren't going to add anymore races. If they had just added Hrothgar, the Viera playerbase would likely be pissed that they'd never get Viera. At least this way, even if they don't add the missing genders, they still satisfy the majority of the respective bases. If they had just picked one race and not ever done the other, there would be far more people upset.

[MomomiMomi]

This can be observed after they datamined Hrothgar coming out. There were almost as many people hoping to play Hrothgar as there were wanting Viera, even before the announcement.

If you are saying that it can't be observed before they datamined Hrothgar, then you are only reinforcing my point. The amount of people who want a beast race has increased after there was information about them. By creating Hrothgar, they have created demand. It was nowhere near what it's at now before they existed.

[PangTong]

Did you expect that people would be satisfied and not ask for the other race if just one was released? "WE DIDN'T NEED MORE CUTE RACES, WE NEEDED BEASTS! SE WASTED THE CHANCE TO MAKE THIS GAME DIFFERENT!11!", or "I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY AREN'T GIVING US VIERA BECAUSE OF A BEAST RACE THAT NO ONE WILL PLAY!!111one!!"

No doubt that would have happened, but I still think it would have been easier to swallow than this compromise decision where neither side is really satisfied. For the record I believe that if it was coming down to Viera and Hrothgar, Viera was the obvious choice without a doubt. You only need to take a cursory look at player feedback and general character statistics to see that it's what most people would have preferred. Indeed, the thought of genderlocked races didn't even seem to cross anyone's mind until Paris fanfest where male Viera were conspicuously absent and the topic was so bluntly avoided. I understand their reasoning of wanting to offer a wider variety, but from the perspective of what the most players wanted, the choice should have been a foregone conclusion which is why I can't accept their decision.

But that aside, whether they had gone with only-Hrothgar or only-Viera, either of those decisions would have resulted in less backlash than this genderlocked solution simply because you're not presenting people with this situation where they only get half of what they want; it's all-or-nothing. Now that people have been made aware of the obvious "missing halves", the demand for those halves will intensify more than if they just had gotten one whole. It is essentially creating a problem where there would otherwise have been none.

To present it in another context, let's say they decided to add some other feature, like increasing customization options for existing races. But because of workflow constraints and creative reasons, they decide to split it up. Male characters get more face options, female characters get more hairstyles. Do you see the issue this causes? Even though there is currently no real expectation that customization options will be increased at all, now people will simply wonder why both genders didn't get both sets of options, and openly ask to get the other options for their preferred gender. If they had simply chosen one or the other, more hairstyles for all, or more face options for all, few people would be thinking "why didn't they add [the other choice] instead", because the expectation didn't exist. They would simply be pleased by the new options. The way they chose to implement the feature created the sense of the feature being incomplete, which is naturally going to ruffle people's feathers.

Likewise, people couldn't have expected Hrothgar, male or female, because they literally didn't exist to us until the moment they were revealed as a new playable race. But now that they do exist, the demand for their missing gender also exists, and it's never going away until the incomplete feature is completed.

[reivaxe]

You missed the point entirely.

The point is you're trying to explain someone's "I didn't read!" post with a terrible, nonsensical example.

Guess I'll answer that guy's post to show how silly it is ..

I acknowledge the reasoning behind the choice of what races to add as truthful and legitimate, but I still don't accept it as the right decision. Me: That's opinion. Objectively this gives people who wanted Viera the depiction of Viera that's been in the games and it gives us a beast Race. Going all into either completely screws over the other group. If this truly is the last opportunity they had to add new races then they really just painted themselves into a corner by doing two half-races. Did they expect that people would be satisfied and not ask for the missing half? Me: ... He literally talks about how yes, they expected this out come. They talked/ thought long and hard about this before making the decision. They really ought to have just picked one or the other and saved themselves the headache. They definitely wouldn't be suffering the same criticism they are now if they had. I don't buy the reasoning of "there was a lot of demand for a beast race" either when past polls have shown that a mammalian beast race was by far the -least- popular choice for a new player race option. Me: He clear as day points to player's response to Lupin as the demand for a beast race. Get outta here with your outdated poll from around the time when this game was doing so poorly it was in danger of getting canned. O_o

Yes, I said very few people wanted a beast race. Wanted. Past tense. NOW they do. That's... the whole point of what I was saying in my first post you replied to. They didn't want it before. NOW they do. They have disappointed more people than would have been disappointed had they not created Hrothgar at all. Because now they want it, and they aren't getting it.

Ya see, there's a fundamental problem here. You seem to think "likes" mean something they don't.

let me get this straight, you refuse to accept Yoshi's study on the demand for a beast race in favor of pointing to a 6 year old outdated poll from back when this game was tiny and trying to recover from failure ... right?

BUT you think that the addition of Hrothgar makes people "want" a female beast race because of some "likes", because you think these people intend on playing it when all it takes is some lite reading on either of those threads to realize that people don't actually want to convert to them?

And you also seem confused on how "likes" for Viera can be so out numbered by "likes" for Viera male ...

On a side note this is why I like Reddit.

[Kaedan]

Ya see, there's a fundamental problem here. You seem to think "likes" mean something they don't.

let me get this straight, you refuse to accept Yoshi's study on the demand for a beast race in favor of pointing to a 6 year old outdated poll from back when this game was tiny and trying to recover from failure ... right?

BUT you think that the addition of Hrothgar makes people "want" a female beast race because of some "likes", because you think these people intend on playing it when all it takes is some lite reading on either of those threads to realize that people don't actually want to convert to them?

And you also seem confused on how "likes" for Viera can be so out numbered by "likes" for Viera male ...

On a side note this is why I like Reddit.

Well, she thinks that self-select forum polls are statistically valid, so it would reason she would also think that "likes" on a forum are valid data as well. It's unfortunately a pretty common misconception people make. What I dislike the most are the people who like to say things like, "but it has a sample size of 1000+, so it's valid", but that only goes to show they slept for half of their statistics class rather than the entire class. Large sample size is great and all, but it's worthless when your sampling method is terrible.

[Eloah]

The point is you're trying to explain someone's "I didn't read!" post with a terrible, nonsensical example.

Guess I'll answer that guy's post to show how silly it is ..





Ya see, there's a fundamental problem here. You seem to think "likes" mean something they don't.

let me get this straight, you refuse to accept Yoshi's study on the demand for a beast race in favor of pointing to a 6 year old outdated poll from back when this game was tiny and trying to recover from failure ... right?

BUT you think that the addition of Hrothgar makes people "want" a female beast race because of some "likes", because you think these people intend on playing it when all it takes is some lite reading on either of those threads to realize that people don't actually want to convert to them?

And you also seem confused on how "likes" for Viera can be so out numbered by "likes" for Viera male ...

On a side note this is why I like Reddit.

My guess is you don't play Bard. But you tried, that's all that counts.

Also upon paying a bit more attention to your picture I notice you are a Femroe. Now while it has nothing major to do with the current issue, remember that at one point you were this issue.

[Alucard135]

I think you are missing his point. Try thinking of it this way, lets say you go out to eat, you're a very picky eater by the way, but you go out and only have a choice between a chicken or pork dish. You are told or its hinted to you by advertisements that you can get either fried or grilled/roasted. Perfect you like both chicken and pork, but think grilled chicken is too dry and fried pork too oily, so you can just choose from the other two options. However, once you get to the restaurant you find out that they only fry their pork and grill their chicken, which baffles you because how hard could it be to do, the other method. You get told "reasons" that admittedly make sense, but ultimately if this restaurant doesn't have any options for you you're probably going to find someplace else to eat. Granted this is a bit of an oversimplification but does present a similar expectation and dilemma. The two meat options are nice, but it's better to have the one option cooked two ways over the two options cooked only one way. It's this wierd dynamic where by limiting the options, you're creating a wider variety of options.

What you're saying makes sense for the restaurant, since the main reason your going to it is to eat those dishes. But it doesn't for FFXIV case since the new races aren't the main reason people are going to play the expansion. That's the core difference between the two cases.

[Eloah]

What you're saying makes sense for the restaurant, since the main reason your going to it is to eat those dishes. But it doesn't for FFXIV case since the new races aren't the main reason people are going to play the expansion. That's the core difference between the two cases.

Exactly, that's why I said it was an oversimplification. There are definitely other factors, but it's the expectation of getting one set of options only to find out you have a slightly different set available, which seems to contradict the original set in a way.

Personally, I doubt I would change to another "given" race, but I feel bad for people who don't have the option now; especially a friend of mine who wanted to be a bunnyboi, lol. Now I'm caught up in this whole loli/shouts debacle. I would like more options for cuter males. Let me be a Ivalician moogle please, lol.

[Agaziel]

Personally, I doubt I would change to another "given" race, but I feel bad for people who don't have the option now; especially a friend of mine who wanted to be a bunnyboi, lol. Now I'm caught up in this whole loli/shouts debacle. I would like more options for cuter males. Let me be a Ivalician moogle please, lol.

But you have cuter males already with miqo-te, elezen, Au ra all you are requesting you already have I can understand you or your friend want to play male viera and that motive is indifferent to me in game because its not that I will play but I agree the more diversity in game the better.

To add diversity doesn't imply a use of the same models would be more interesting in game concept perspective to do something from the scratch, since for males you already have Roes and Hrothgar for that difference.