Removing Tank Stance Argument

[Seraphor]

"Also "Rage of Halone effects changed" uhh... Wasn't one of the above points that enmity combo's are going? Or is this supposed to be some other skill?"

She said "Rage of Halone is something that was asked about, um.. while it has not been completely removed, it might be swapped out for something, um.. quite powerful"

I'm thinking it's that big gold sword animation, and to rival WAR's "more powerful than Fell Cleave" ability.

[Jandor]

Okay. It's one of the better solutions to the Stance problem.

Remove the penalty, and basically just make its use simply be based on what position you're in. Similar to how I suggested stances be done, just without the interesting gameplay shift, it's now just "Do enmity" or "Don't do enmity"

I wonder if this might just trivialize Enmity though? Or will circle-shirking still be a thing?

Probably just trivialize enmity tbh. They're removing NIN aggro tools too, aggro as something the party has to work together to manage seems a dead concept.

Also, I'm curious about that whole sentence about HP Bonus and damage dealt increase bonus? Is it suggesting more stuff like Upheaval? Is Vitality going to be indirectly a DPS stat again?

I reckon they get a boost to damage from STR and a boost to HP and/or armor from VIT. Doubt VIT as damage stat is coming back.

Well... RIP level 1-29 Tanks.

Presumably tank stance is a very early skill, like level 10 or something.

Wait... Sheltron duration increased? Wut? Like it already lasts 10s... If you're not taking a hit within 10s then wtf are you using the skill for?

Guessing it just blocks everything for the duration. Bulwark appears to be gone too.

[whiskeybravo]

Tank Mastery trait

Hmm... More passive mitigation...

I hope that Warriors still get to have fat stacks of HP though. Like, more fat stacks of HP than other Tanks. But with less DR in return.

Also, I'm curious about that whole sentence about HP Bonus and damage dealt increase bonus? Is it suggesting more stuff like Upheaval? Is Vitality going to be indirectly a DPS stat again?

To me it seemed like they just rolled the best of all tank stances into 1 trait - 20% DR (Shield Oath/Grit), HP Boost from Vit stat (Defiance), Damage boost from Str stat (Sword Oath/Deliverance/Darkside)

I think that's pretty awesome, but I do wonder if it will end up being a bit to much. Healers are getting their healing kits boosted and it sounds like tanks are going to be tankier and have more damage mitigation support for party members. We'll have to see how this all shakes out, but overall it's a pretty nice direction to take tank stances.

One thing I noticed that's somewhat lingering concern.. It looks like GNB had Rampart and Reprisal on it's skill bar when Yoshi-P was showing it off. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

[shao32]

Presumably tank stance is a very early skill, like level 10 or something.

yep level 10 ^^

[Seraphor]

One thing I noticed that's somewhat lingering concern.. It looks like GNB had Rampart and Reprisal on it's skill bar when Yoshi-P was showing it off. I'm not sure how I feel about that.

They mentioned that they've only trimmed a few role skills away, and that tanks still have the most of all the roles, at 7 I think.
They're no longer 'customisable' so you don't tick them off before you can use them, they're just learned automatically like job skills.

[whiskeybravo]

They mentioned that they've only trimmed a few role skills away, and that tanks still have the most of all the roles, at 7 I think.
They're no longer 'customisable' so you don't tick them off before you can use them, they're just learned automatically like job skills.

I wonder if they are tied to the new "Role Quests"

But in regards to Rampart/Reprisal.. I thought we as the community had expressed enough opinion that they should've looked into that, or designed the new/changed abilities in such a way to compensate for their adjustment. Like, will WAR have Rampart AND on-demand IB now? That was one of the major points of contention. Or maybe they changed Rampart to a 2 min CD or something.. Certainly not enough info, I just thought they would've realized simple things like DRK's wanting shadow skin animation back, or that reprisal could go back to being DRK exclusive without too much issue. It's looking like we have uber mitigation at this point.

[Kabooa]

I wonder if they are tied to the new "Role Quests".

I don't think so.

From the sounds of it, we don't get individual Class Quests anymore, just a big one at 80 for each job.

Hitting breakpoints on any tank unlocks the 'Role quest' for example, but at level 80 you'll get your Gunbreaker, Paladin, Dark Knight, or Warrior variant.

[whiskeybravo]

I don't think so.

From the sounds of it, we don't get individual Class Quests anymore, just a big one at 80 for each job.

Hitting breakpoints on any tank unlocks the 'Role quest' for example, but at level 80 you'll get your Gunbreaker, Paladin, Dark Knight, or Warrior variant.

That's why I'm connecting those dots. We won't have class/job quests which means we'll get our skills from leveling up instead (well, outside of the uber lv80 skill we'll be learning). What we will have is Role Quests, and since every quest has to have a reward, it makes some sense to obtain role actions from them.

[Big-Isaac]

So they literally turned tank stances into a skill Paladins used to have in WoW. Until either Warlords of Draenor or Legion, they had a toggle-able skill that did nothing but increase the amount of threat they generate.
It was removed, ultimately because there's little to no point to dedicating a button to a free buff with a 100% uptime that you have no reason to not want up 100% of the time.
This rework is heading in the same direction. You just put it up, because why the heck not, and forget about it. At most, you might turn it off if you're OT and your MT either sucks or is severely undergeared.

As much of a half measure as this is, I'm still really happy to see it. The stance dancing and all the toxicity surrounding it will finally disappear.

[Bright-Flower]

I doubt they're tied to role quests. Keep in mind that SB scaled back learning spells from quests a LOT. Sure the level 70 capstone spell was tied to a quest, but the rest of our abilities were not.

I assume it will be like that again.