New Player Experience Sucks! - Impending Expansion Problems

[Miles064]

Actually nearly every player in WoW played through the story content at least once if not several times. All those quests in the open world are the story content. Yes those massive walls of text in the small window given to you mostly by very forgettable mannequin-like npcs that you were unlikely to ever see again after you left their location, that's the story content. But because it's presented in such a bland way, people don't often seem to consider that it is.

So even though it doesn't gate you like FFXIV's msq does, most players ended up playing it anyway. Often multiple times from trying new classes.

WoW has incredibly rich lore. But at least up until WoD (which is when I quit) it wasn't presented very well, so a huge amount of players just don't bother with it. They only care that they have to kill 10 wolves. Not why. WoW had (still has?) nothing resembling the msq and the central characters to the stories are all npcs. The story isn't about you at all. It's about how you aid these people by being one of many talented soldiers. You're not a major plot device because anything you didn't do, some other talented soldier (another player) did it. You're a face in the crowd.

In FFXIV you're the central character to the story. That alone means the story needs to be told very differently to something like WoW. You are even represented by a character in the expansion trailers.

While both games have very complex and wonderful lore, it is clear that the player's roles in them greatly differ, and that Blizzard and SE don't have the same ideas as to how a story should be told.

In short: they're different games by different studios.

Its been a while but was the player anymore then just a random adventurer till ifrit? That's when it was found out you were immune to being tempered right? I do agree the way Wow told the story in the past for a lot of things mad it seem like you were helping out important npcs rather then being the important one yourself. That changed after a while though. Even in Mists you were somewhat well known by faction npcs as being important. WoD and onward you were center stage too(commander in WoD, class leader in Legion, etc.)

As for the msq, Legion had a max lvl story that needed to be done to unlock things(broken isles,that one dungeon i cant remember the name of with the Naaru, the class quests.). BFA has something like msq as well now with the faction campaign. both of those you play a large part of the story. Both will be skip able in future expacs(legion's story already is skip able). Still, WoW quests and npcs mention how much you have done/how important you are but WoW has no cut-scenes with the player in it. Always thought that was one of those famous server limitations though.


Again. All I want is past expacs max lvl stories to be skip able. Keep the lvling stuff,keep the current expac lvling and max lvl stuff, don't get rid of anything. Right now in SB I think players should get the option to go to HW lvling quests without doing ARR max lvl quests. Then go to SB lvling quests without doing HW max lvl quests. Have the dungeons and stuff be unlocked when you hit 50 and 60 keep the quests i case you want to know what happened. That alone i feel would make it feel less overwhelming to new players and even veterans that just want an alt with a different look or something.

[Iscah]

Its been a while but was the player anymore then just a random adventurer till ifrit? That's when it was found out you were immune to being tempered right?

No, we were already working with the Scions at that point.

We'd been on their radar since the Lv5 quest where, variably for each city quest, we get attacked by something-or-other and the local Scion comes to our rescue, and we have our first vision of Hydaelyn. We describe it to them, and (while it isn't explained at this point) they realise we must have the Echo.

Then we get officially recruited to the Scions at Lv17 after clearing the first three dungeons and then coming to the rescue of a woman being bullied by some thugs, at which point the Scion we'd previously dealt with comes up to us and invites us to join their secret society. Investigating Ifrit is our first assignment with them.

[Miles064]

No, we were already working with the Scions at that point.

We'd been on their radar since the Lv5 quest where, variably for each city quest, we get attacked by something-or-other and the local Scion comes to our rescue, and we have our first vision of Hydaelyn. We describe it to them, and (while it isn't explained at this point) they realise we must have the Echo.

Then we get officially recruited to the Scions at Lv17 after clearing the first three dungeons and then coming to the rescue of a woman being bullied by some thugs, at which point the Scion we'd previously dealt with comes up to us and invites us to join their secret society. Investigating Ifrit is our first assignment with them.

Ah, thank you for the refresher.

[Penthea]

Again. All I want is past expacs max lvl stories to be skip able.

Sorry but I feel like if you want to skip the most central element of the game then maybe this game isn't for you. I would say the same thing to players who want a msq similar to FFXIV in WoW.

If you disagree with the most prevalent and fundamental way a game leads you through its content, then you need to play something else if you can't find a way to deal with it.

When I could no longer deal with how WoW was I just left it behind. I didn't demand change that would have turned the player progression into something very different to how it was before. I didn't go to the forums and ask for a msq, because I enjoyed it in FFXIV. I accepted that WoW didn't have one and turned my attention to the game that does.

[Miles064]

Sorry but I feel like if you want to skip the most central element of the game then maybe this game isn't for you. I would say the same thing to players who want a msq similar to FFXIV in WoW.

If you disagree with the most prevalent and fundamental way a game leads you through its content, then you need to play something else if you can't find a way to deal with it.

When I could no longer deal with how WoW was I just left it behind. I didn't demand change that would have turned the player progression into something very different to how it was before. I didn't go to the forums and ask for a msq, because I enjoyed it in FFXIV. I accepted that WoW didn't have one and turned my attention to the game that does.

So what you are saying is that FF14 is a single player game with mmo elements tacked on? That the focus is not the group elements but the single player? What does forcing you to go through the story add to this game? What would making it optional hurt? And not all of it optional, just the stuff for previous expacs. I enjoyed the story and would have done it if it was optional because I enjoyed it. Is someone else skipping past the old stuff supposed to hurt me in some way? "This isn't the game for you"? Should I just say "welp I really enjoy the classes,music,bosses,dungeons, etc but because I feel this thing should be adjusted I guess I'll have to drop the entire game"?

Sorry, it sounds like you want everyone else to go through the story because you did. The story in this game is one piece of the puzzle. Some care, some dont. You can enjoy playing a game without caring about whats going on.

[Penthea]

Sorry, it sounds like you want everyone else to go through the story because you did. The story in this game is one piece of the puzzle. Some care, some dont. You can enjoy playing a game without caring about whats going on.

No I'm saying accept the game for what it is. I accepted WoW for what is was and when it became unacceptable to me I left the game. Asking for a msq to be inserted into WoW is just as ridiculous as asking for FFXIV to have the msq become removed or optional. I would have loved to have seen a msq in WoW but I recognised the game wasn't designed for that sort of storytelling. Players like you need to recognise that FFXIV is designed for it.

If you can't handle the main way the game leads you through content, well you're in luck because there are other games you can play that make you progress differently.

[Miles064]

No I'm saying accept the game for what it is. I accepted WoW for what is was and when it became unacceptable to me I left the game. Asking for a msq to be inserted into WoW is just as ridiculous as asking for FFXIV to have the msq become removed or optional. I would have loved to have seen a msq in WoW but I recognised the game wasn't designed for that sort of storytelling. Players like you need to recognise that FFXIV is designed for it.

If you can't handle the main way the game leads you through content, well you're in luck because there are other games you can play that make you progress differently.

You didn't answer my question. What would the max lvl msq of old expacs being optional(not the old expac lvling stuff) hurt?

[Penthea]

You didn't answer my question. What would the max lvl msq of old expacs being optional(not the old expac lvling stuff) hurt?

Oh I don't know, the way the game is designed to make you progress through it? It would change how the game feels just as much as inserting a msq into WoW would.

At this point you're just asking for WoW. Go play WoW if you want a lvling experience like WoW. Don't go to a game made by a completely different company on the other side of the planet and be annoyed that it's somehow not the same thing.

I didn't ask for WoW to change its lvling experience to be more like FFXIV. If I had I would have been very rightly told to buzz off.

[Miles064]

Oh I don't know, the way the game is designed to make you progress through it? It would change how the game feels just as much as inserting a msq into WoW would.

At this point you're just asking for WoW. Go play WoW if you want a lvling experience like WoW. Don't go to a game made by a completely different company on the other side of the planet and be annoyed that it's somehow not the same thing.

I didn't ask for WoW to change its lvling experience to be more like FFXIV. If I had I would have been very rightly told to buzz off.

If I wanted the lvling experience like WoW id say for it all to be optional yes? Have I demanded FF14 do everything WoW does? No. I don't remember demanding anything really. The fact that you keep going back to the "go back to WoW" thing makes it seem like you don't have anything to really say. I already said I like the game enough to pay for it. Turning FF14 into a WoW clone also does nothing for me as I'm not currently playing WoW because I don't enjoy it. Some random player skipping some of the story doesn't do anything to you and yet you feel the need to make sure everyone does it just like you did it in the past. Even with max lvl of previous expac msq being optional the lvling in FF14 wouldn't be the same as WoW. Not even close.

[Physic]

Oh I don't know, the way the game is designed to make you progress through it? It would change how the game feels just as much as inserting a msq into WoW would.

At this point you're just asking for WoW. Go play WoW if you want a lvling experience like WoW. Don't go to a game made by a completely different company on the other side of the planet and be annoyed that it's somehow not the same thing.

I didn't ask for WoW to change its lvling experience to be more like FFXIV. If I had I would have been very rightly told to buzz off.

so, if they actually do decide to let new players opt out of old msq in shadow bringers, will you be upset?