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  1. #51
    Player
    Velaethia's Avatar
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    Mar 2016
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    193
    Character
    Velaethia White
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Bonbori View Post
    I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you on the fact that, realistically, MMO development is a balancing act aimed at retaining the largest possible playerbase month to month.

    However, I feel you grossly underestimate the amount of resources SE has at its disposal. It's not even conjecture - we have seen clear evidence that they have the resources and manpower to commit to short-lived and catered to niche audiences (by Yoshi's own admission @ Eureka) content like Diadem, Eureka, Verminion and Rival Wings, just to list a few off the top of my head.

    They can do that, time and time again, without compromising any of the core content that retains the majority of the playerbase, that being MSQ and casual 4-, 8- and 24-man content as well as, to a much lesser but still comparatively substantial extent, Savage and Extreme.

    So... no. I do not buy for even a nanosecond that SE would have to sacrifice a noticeable segment of their playerbase if they decided to skip another iteration of Diadem for one expansion and instead reassigned those resources towards perfecting the game's glamour system (and resolving any related server or engine-side issues in the process).

    TL;DR: If SE can waste their employees' time on Eureka, which was intended for a small subset of players and relevant for only a limited time, they could just as well waste it on finishing the half-baked glamour implementation, which would add lasting value to the game as a whole.
    BRB need to go make 20 more accounts, pay for sub just so I can upvote this comment.
    (5)
    Let's get one thing straight, I'm not

  2. #52
    Player
    Velaethia's Avatar
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    Mar 2016
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    193
    Character
    Velaethia White
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Xbob42 View Post
    It's really not a server capacity thing at all. At least it isn't in WoW, because they designed their glamour system sensibly. Instead of keeping track of each individual item and its stats and what storage system it currently has to exist in and all that jazz, the thing basically functions... hmm, let's say like an achievement system, but even simpler. There's a big list of items on the server, and you either have a 0 if you've never obtained an item, or a 1 if you have. That's it. No need to store individual item data and have it in a storage locker or some nonsense like that. It's basically a small .txt file filled with what I assume is "item id 902=1" or "item id 14=0" rather than whatever crazy shenanigans FFXIV is doing.
    That is literally how WoW does it and do not see any reason why that can't be applied to FFXIV. I bet summer interns could finish it before their break was up.
    (2)
    Let's get one thing straight, I'm not

  3. #53
    Player
    Krotoan's Avatar
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    May 2013
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    3,591
    Character
    Krotoan Argaviel
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Reaper Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Velaethia View Post
    BRB need to go make 20 more accounts, pay for sub just so I can upvote this comment.
    Then you fundamentally don't understand what's required for the requested upgrade.
    (1)
    WHERE IS THIS KETTLE EVERYONE KEEPS INTRODUCING ME TO?

  4. #54
    Player
    NessaWyvern's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    1,920
    Character
    Nessa Goddessly
    World
    Ravana
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 96
    Quote Originally Posted by Xbob42 View Post
    This is one area where WoW kicks the absolute crap out of FFXIV. It's not even close. And WoW is older, so FFXIV has no excuse. This game is way more cosmetic-focused, too. So it's extra bizarre. They need to stop making excuses and buckle down to remedy this. I dunno what's going on with this dev team or server infrastructure where adding features seen in other games will somehow light the servers on fire, but I'd rate that as a critical issue, because it's very abnormal.
    haven't you heard? Squeenix is a small indie company that doesn't have the funds
    That was a joke, considering how much money FFXIV has funneled into Square Enix, I don't know why all the resources seem to be so tight, and their devs so overworked. Surely they can hire more people, and put the money from subs/mogstation back into the game, so it's better and even more people play, thus raking in more money afterwards.
    (3)

  5. #55
    Player
    Velaethia's Avatar
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    Mar 2016
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    193
    Character
    Velaethia White
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Krotoan View Post
    Then you fundamentally don't understand what's required for the requested upgrade.
    What has been recommended would work for all past and future additions to the game. However alternatively they can work on it on a separate server. Away from normal testing and dev. The game will progress as normal. And when they finish up to the patch when the server was separated then they continue on to the current patch, and line it up with the next update patch. Thus they implement it without delaying any content. Boom. am I genius or what?
    (2)
    Let's get one thing straight, I'm not

  6. #56
    Player
    Krotoan's Avatar
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    May 2013
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    3,591
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    Krotoan Argaviel
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Reaper Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Velaethia View Post
    What has been recommended would work for all past and future additions to the game. However alternatively they can work on it on a separate server. Away from normal testing and dev. The game will progress as normal. And when they finish up to the patch when the server was separated then they continue on to the current patch, and line it up with the next update patch. Thus they implement it without delaying any content. Boom. am I genius or what?
    Decidedly "or what". You do understand that Triples the work necessary? What about all the new things they develop for the "live" serverswhich then need to be remade because they don't work with the new inventory system? Hiring an entirely new team to run this "side server" and purchase all the equipment necessary to run that?

    What needs to be fixed isn't just the glamour system. The limitations are in the core systems. The way the servers constantly keep track of what we have, what its status is (color, soulbinding, damage, materia..etc) and its relation to our character needs to be redone. That's the fix. Not scrapping the dresser, not "just make a log", not "just give us more storage". A full teardown and rewriting of the way the entire game deals with items. From their awarding to their storage to their selling and deconstruction and synthesis. The way they reference their appearance and how that appearance interacts with other items (which items overlap which other items and which outright cancel appearances).

    I will agree immediately that this is what we need, but I constantly see people say things like "well just skip a patch/give it to one guy/spend some money on it" and despair because they do NOT understand what they're asking for or how woefully short their solution falls of the actual problem. I am telling you this isn't a quick or easy fix and unless people are ready to sacrifice quite a bit of new content for a while it isn't going to happen. I think SE doesn't have the faith in us necessary either. They're balancing possible profits against what it will cost to actually meet player requests and I'll bet dollars to donuts they're coming up with a big negative to the cost of performing a full undercarriage rework on the game.
    (3)
    Last edited by Krotoan; 04-28-2019 at 10:50 AM.
    WHERE IS THIS KETTLE EVERYONE KEEPS INTRODUCING ME TO?

  7. #57
    Player
    Velaethia's Avatar
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    Mar 2016
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    Velaethia White
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 80
    I still think in the meantime the best bandaid until they can come out with a real overhaul is to increase the capacity to the maximum the servers can reasonably handle. The dresser itself needs to go up to 1-2k minimum.
    (0)
    Let's get one thing straight, I'm not

  8. #58
    Player
    Nabril's Avatar
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    May 2018
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    352
    Character
    Dorion Borstein
    World
    Halicarnassus
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Kurando View Post
    And like I said, this isn't WoW and what Blizzard may have done cannot be so easily replicated by SE, and besides players may not want the same exact thing in another game. If it was so easy to add this they would have done it a long time ago, but considering how long it took for the glamour dresser to be added to begin with, a glamour library is just a pipedream. Also WoW doesn't have platform restrictions considering XIV is on PS4, so that's another thing that can delay big changes (see PS3 history).
    Why is it that every single time someone asks for an upgraded system, the response is always "Coding nightmare. Too hard. Can't be done. Would break the game."

    If those responses were actually true, then we'd never ever see a new expansion. Nothing would get patched or updated. Anytime anything in this game is changed, it takes massive rewrites, but the creators do it and we get new content and updated features. They do it because they know how to do it. Programming is time consuming to learn, but it's not that hard once you do learn it. It can always be changed, added to, patched, overwritten, or bypassed.

    Now, rewriting the graphics engine is perhaps the most difficult thing to do in a game, but that's not what we're talking about, is it? No. Rewriting the graphics engine would take years, but upgrading the glamour system is nowhere near that complicated. And the coders in charge of FFXIV are not amateurs. They know what they're doing. Now, if they don't think it's priority then fine. They don't have to give us an updated glamour chest, but the reason we don't get one will never ever be because "It's too hard."
    (7)

  9. #59
    Player
    Krotoan's Avatar
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    May 2013
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    3,591
    Character
    Krotoan Argaviel
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Reaper Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Velaethia View Post
    I still think in the meantime the best bandaid until they can come out with a real overhaul is to increase the capacity to the maximum the servers can reasonably handle. The dresser itself needs to go up to 1-2k minimum.
    We don't know what the maximum they can handle is though. They probably have a pretty good estimate but chances are the absolute maximum they can handle varies with the ebb and flow of active players. Considering they started with 200, I'm thinking 2k per user is a bit ambitious. It HAS been quite a while since they last mentioned upgrading any of the glamour numbers though. The last we heard back at implementation was they were looking at increasing the amount of plates.. and now silence. Would be nice to hear or see at least something happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nabril View Post
    Why is it that every single time someone asks for an upgraded system, the response is always "Coding nightmare. Too hard. Can't be done. Would break the game."

    If those responses were actually true, then we'd never ever see a new expansion. Nothing would get patched or updated. Anytime anything in this game is changed, it takes massive rewrites, but the creators do it and we get new content and updated features. They do it because they know how to do it. Programming is time consuming to learn, but it's not that hard once you do learn it. It can always be changed, added to, patched, overwritten, or bypassed.

    Now, rewriting the graphics engine is perhaps the most difficult thing to do in a game, but that's not what we're talking about, is it? No. Rewriting the graphics engine would take years, but upgrading the glamour system is nowhere near that complicated. And the coders in charge of FFXIV are not amateurs. They know what they're doing. Now, if they don't think it's priority then fine. They don't have to give us an updated glamour chest, but the reason we don't get one will never ever be because "It's too hard."
    We are , however, talking about rewriting the way the game manages inventory, which is just as deeply rooted in the game as the graphics engine.
    By that same "they're professionals" card , don't you think if it was as easy people seem to propose they would have done it already if they're so experienced? Someone would have piped up and said.. "hey uh.. give me 10 guys and some hours and we'll have a log style glamour book like everyone is asking for"
    (3)
    Last edited by Krotoan; 04-28-2019 at 10:54 AM.
    WHERE IS THIS KETTLE EVERYONE KEEPS INTRODUCING ME TO?

  10. #60
    Player
    Kurando's Avatar
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    Mar 2017
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    Character
    Ku Rando
    World
    Alpha
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Nabril View Post
    snip.
    If someone else said those things fine, call them out on it, pretty sure I never said any such quotes; "Too hard", "can't be done" or "would break the game".
    But I'll clarify so it's better understood, it is not easy to bring changes so quickly to the game hence why some additions/upgrades take quite some time to be added, although this seemed lost on the OP and I guess on yourself a bit as well. Further improvements to the dressers definitely possible, but a glamour library just like WoW, don't see it happening for many reasons.
    (1)

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