A complaint from a whiny healer

[Lyth]

If your only point is that tanks shouldn't feel bad about using tank stance when they need to, then you'd be in complete agreement with me. I think that I've stated that point explicitly in pretty much every post that I've written in this thread. Even the very best tanks use tank stance in situations where they can't safely predict what the incoming damage will be, such as during progression. Even the tank in your example felt no shame in using tank stance for part of the dungeon (nor should they). You only seemed to take issue when they didn't.

The limits aren't where you say they are. And the only way to find those limits is to push them.

But that's a decision for the individual tank in question to make, based on their own comfort level with the content. I don't personally put up with backseat tanking, nor should anyone else here. I suppose that enforcing my personal boundaries makes me a bad person. But I'm prepared to live with that.

"Serve... Save... Slave... Slay... I've sins aplenty, aye, but regrets? Not so much."

[ArianeEwah]

snip

Yeah, I forgot about Bane. That would be 1 for Excog, 1 for Bane and 1-4 stacks for Energy Drain. Depending on how long the fight drags on I even consider sacrificing my fairy for more mana... since at that point you can't expect any help from your DPS mates if it already takes that long...

About Defiance: Every tank should pull in tank stance, an enhanced Adlo should be a given. If said tank decides to pull in off stance, they should at least know how to migitate and properly hold aggro without any great damage loss. But that is almost impossible unless they strive for that big tank deeps only run, which is not healthy for the whole party - I guess everyone here agreed on that.

That being said, Defiance should indeed be active for every pull, and should only be turned off during the fight, if they know how to not increase the burden on healer or rest of the party.

Which brings me to your OP. The tank you got there was indeed in the wrong. Their gear was not up-to-date, and they didn't know how to mitigate properly. Their decision made your life harder for the worse. I guess they didn't even know their DPS rotation which made the whole point 'out of tank stance' obsolete.

But I want to clarify... that no reasonable person in this sub-forum ever said that 'only bad tanks use tank stance'. And I don't mean times where some might've wrote it as a joke, a troll, sarcasm or because they were lazy, but 'true' arguments.

I am not denying that we (tanks) loathe the current tank stances. We strive to use it as less as possible, still with one crucial fact in mind: Without sacrificing any DPS, and not just for us, but for healers and DPS too.
It's absolutely necessary that tanks have know-how, and skill, as well as good decision-making to be able to utilize DPS- and tank-stance. To weigh up gear differences, dungeon/duty design, skill of the party - in most cases between tank and healer - that's what a true tank is made of.

Unfortunately, there are people who can't or don't want to read between the lines. They reduce whole statements and arguments down to oversimplified sentences like the ones you mentioned in your OP... and I'm sorry that you encountered one of them.
They don't make an effort to learn or actually really read, and stay lazy... on your cost...

But we all have seen DPS not using aoe in trash pulls, healers not dps'in at all and tanks taking tons of damage in tank stance and not holding aggro...

It's not us telling them not to use tank stance, but them interpreting it as such.