Why are standards seen as a crime in this game?

[Krotoan]

The "I'm new so I'm entitled to wiping raids because im learning" is embellishment. What usually gets said is "I'm new", the embellishment is mostly there to point out how unbelievably disgusting and entitled that sounds. Being a max level player and having purchased the game recently doesn't entitle you to wiping raids and wasting everyones time because you are new. State you are new, so people can help you. I meet a lot of sprouts in lvl 70 content and I ask who is new and doesn't know what to do, naturally, nobody says anything. And then we wipe. Again. And again. And again. And again.

Leave (the instance) . Your experience is in your hands. Expecting others to perform to your standards (even if they're reasonable) is still entitlement. People buy the game and buy boosts, or their friends run them through PoTD till they're 70. Lot's of people have neither time nor inclination to learn to your standards. This isn't a job. Nobody is forcing you to experience anything you don't want to. You want standards then as someone else said, gather like individuals. You do roulettes then expect casual sprouts. Also I rarely experience someone who is nearly as bad as you say. Sure there's some dead weight out there, but people who do bloody edge extreme content and don't know basics are quite rare.

This is not acceptable. You being new does not entitle you to wiping a raid repeatedly because you are learning. No, you were OFFERED the chance to learn from someone who knows more than you do, you were ASKED if you are new so people can help you. You decide to stay quiet and wipe the raid. How some people in this community consider this type of behaviour acceptable is far beyond me. If you do this type of stuff in other MMOs you would likely get hit over the face and immediately kicked from the majority of dungeons/raids because people will spread the word that you are a time waster and someone who refuses to learn. In FF14 i've seen this behaviour encouraged way more than I've seen it punished. Which is something that needs to stop..

You are not who gets to decide what's "acceptable" by yourself. If the majority of the playerbase is OK with it, why do you need to bring intolerance into the dungeon? Who's the odd man out when you're the only one tearing their hair out over it? People play this game for many reasons that don't align with yours. You get to customize your own experience and the fact you think you have the right to dictate how others enjoy it any further than a helpful suggestion or removing yourself from the situation shows a certain degree of selfishness and entitlement in itself.

[kidalutz]

Actually, in Mists of Pandaria, WoW actually did lock the LFG tool behind completing Silver difficulty in a set of solo trials for each role you wished to use.

Where Bronze was so simple that it was basically checking that you had the game installed.

Silver was still pretty simple and was checking if you had an IQ with a positive integer.

While Gold was sort of challenging and required a little bit of thought (But was ultimately not necessary)

Though, this ended up being scrapped because it turned out that the majority of the playerbase was complete trash and found it too hard to beat Silver trials, because concepts like "Hit the bad guy" and "Don't stand in the fire" are too complex...

That was Warlords of Draenor they did that and it was for Heroic Dungeoun unlock and in case you cant remember clearly that failed bigtime and lost them more subs. It wasnt because the content was too hard it was because it was forced outdated content in order to do something current. At least get your facts straight before you start dropping narrative.

[Kalise]

That was Warlords of Draenor they did that and it was for Heroic Dungeoun unlock and in case you cant remember clearly that failed bigtime and lost them more subs. It wasnt because the content was too hard it was because it was forced outdated content in order to do something current. At least get your facts straight before you start dropping narrative.

The trial was implemented in Mists of Pandaria.

That's why it was considered "Forced outdated content"

Also, yes, it failed because it was too hard. People whined that they couldn't do current content because spending 2 minutes to go complete this trial, if they hadn't already done so, was too difficult to do.

[VirusOnline]

Actually, in Mists of Pandaria, WoW actually did lock the LFG tool behind completing Silver difficulty in a set of solo trials for each role you wished to use.

Where Bronze was so simple that it was basically checking that you had the game installed.

Silver was still pretty simple and was checking if you had an IQ with a positive integer.

While Gold was sort of challenging and required a little bit of thought (But was ultimately not necessary)

Though, this ended up being scrapped because it turned out that the majority of the playerbase was complete trash and found it too hard to beat Silver trials, because concepts like "Hit the bad guy" and "Don't stand in the fire" are too complex...

MoP ? Past WotLK WoW's system became disgustingly more and more broken. They attempted to implement challenges after the fact that they had dumbed down mechanics along with the fact that add-ons are rampant in WoW. They found that they had to dumb everything back down to the lowest performing player. WoW's downfall of player mechanics and performance is a result of such a system that allows players to be told what to do rather than thinking for themselves.

word count

Teaching players an intermediate level of play alludes to a level of the game's handholding rather than the player's self learning. Teaching basic levels of play is ok and that is what the healer/dps/tanks course (which also rewards gear) does. You learn much more when you actually understand why you are using the abilities you are using rather than a game telling you 'use this ability' now. This is what dungeons are for. Trials. HoH. PotD. Practice dummies. These 'playgrounds' exist for a person to test their abilities and receive feedback from the group they are with.

[HarryTipper]

Play this game around 4 years with pauses of 3 months extend in between those years due to external factors.

During one year did made the roulette's every week some weeks 5 days a week with no exaggeration ALL PLAYERS who came across with during all this time warned when they were learning the mechanics and asked for help to know, when there was 1st time players understood and didn't adopt any condescending behavior over those who did not knew the mechanics.

All along players in their majority knew how to play their roles with the exception of a really, really like 1% few healers who would only heal, but even that didn't bother the team that much.

If there were wipes in raids it was not object for detrimental rage much less delinquent behavior towards others, on cases that were understood there were friends playing with friends and messing with them just for fun other players would leave duty without any dumb comment because like myself understood there were parties made of real life friends playing together and having fun with each other they were not there to waste anyone's time they were just having fun.

So not sure if have been lucky with the players who meet with or if you are making a generalization of the few different cases you have found.

"My generalization/anecdote is better than yours "

So if you please can cut the B.S. it would be great.

Practice what you preach, please.

[Ilan]

Play this game around 4 years with pauses of 3 months extend in between those years due to external factors.

During one year did made the roulette's every week some weeks 5 days a week with no exaggeration ALL PLAYERS who came across with during all this time warned when they were learning the mechanics and asked for help to know, when there was 1st time players understood and didn't adopt any condescending behavior over those who did not knew the mechanics.

All along players in their majority knew how to play their roles with the exception of a really, really like 1% few healers who would only heal, but even that didn't bother the team that much.

If there were wipes in raids it was not object for detrimental rage much less delinquent behavior towards others, on cases that were understood there were friends playing with friends and messing with them just for fun other players would leave duty without any dumb comment because like myself understood there were parties made of real life friends playing together and having fun with each other they were not there to waste anyone's time they were just having fun.

So not sure if have been lucky with the players who meet with or if you are making a generalization of the few different cases you have found.

So if you please can cut the B.S. it would be great.

Its a nice fairytale.

[Ceasaria]

That + the fact you can enter in dungeon undergeared, it doesn't help at all.

[Crystal_Raven]

Leave (the instance) . Your experience is in your hands. Expecting others to perform to your standards (even if they're reasonable) is still entitlement. People buy the game and buy boosts, or their friends run them through PoTD till they're 70. Lot's of people have neither time nor inclination to learn to your standards. This isn't a job. Nobody is forcing you to experience anything you don't want to. You want standards then as someone else said, gather like individuals. You do roulettes then expect casual sprouts. Also I rarely experience someone who is nearly as bad as you say. Sure there's some dead weight out there, but people who do bloody edge extreme content and don't know basics are quite rare.

I encounter people like this daily. I play a mix of tank and healer, as you are probably aware, healers have a better overview of the entire team. It's easier to see who is messing up, who is dead weight.

There is a massive difference between casual and dead weight. No one is expecting every player to be the 1% ultimate god that can clear the game by playing with one foot and a missing eye on a 800x600 resolution while being 500 meters away from the screen. However it is pretty standard to be level 70 and understand YOUR own class that YOU have been playing to get to max level. The fact that people like you genuinely believe that dead weight players who know nothing and refuse to learn is perfectly acceptable is just mind boggling. You say people who don't know basics are rare, no, they really aren't, they are extremely common. I don't hold any player to any insanely high standards, all I expect from you as a level 70 player is to understand your class and the basics of the game.

According to some, that is too much to ask for.

You are not who gets to decide what's "acceptable" by yourself. If the majority of the playerbase is OK with it, why do you need to bring intolerance into the dungeon? Who's the odd man out when you're the only one tearing their hair out over it? People play this game for many reasons that don't align with yours. You get to customize your own experience and the fact you think you have the right to dictate how others enjoy it any further than a helpful suggestion or removing yourself from the situation shows a certain degree of selfishness and entitlement in itself.

You are not who gets to decide what's "acceptable" either. Why do YOU need to waste my time into the dungeon and be dead weight? Why do YOU get to wipe the raid repeteadly and no one says anything because of fear of ban? Here's a bit of news that you don't seem to be familiar with, I encounter a lot of players that get mad at people who cause wipes, they get frustrated, and they don't say ANYTHING.

Why? Because SE will ban you. If you say anything, you're putting your account at risk because you dared to criticize. The fact that you think you have the right to waste my time and break my enjoyment and believe that your time is worth more than mine shows a massive degree of selfishness and entitlement.

I see a lot of people such as yourself throw around the sentence "you don't have the right to tell others how to play."

Why do YOU have the right to waste MY time? Why do YOU have the right to cause ME frustration because you refuse to learn and constantly wipe the raid which also wastes my time? Why do YOU have the right to waste the time of everyone else in the party because YOU refuse to learn and get better?

How exactly does this seem normal to you? One side has the right to waste the others time and patience but the other side is not allowed to criticize you for doing exactly that. This doesn't make any sense at all, this is the most selfish and entitled thing I've ever heard in any MMO.

I have never ever heard anyone outside FF14 that believes they have the right to waste other peoples time by refusing to learn, and to add to that, if you call them out on it and criticize, they can get you reported and banned. This is a completely backwards system. Instead of bringing the lowest person up and get him to improve, we are bringing everyone else DOWN. Half the people I know are actively refusing to talk with anyone random just out of fear of them getting offended and putting their account at risk.

[AnnaRosa]

Its a nice fairytale.

That is your problem if you don't believe fortunately that's how things have rolled so far to me and sorry if you do not lived the same experiences as we did.

[AnnaRosa]

"My generalization/anecdote is better than yours "



Practice what you preach, please.

But do practice what is stated there can't do a thing if you don't believe is your problem.

If you have your head stuck in the few cases that you met with that were not examples on how to play their roles versus the amount of players who give you a good example it's your problem.

Noone of the b.s. described by the OP and along within the threads we lived so far do you want me to pretend that we lived to be accordingly your will? Isn't that insane?