Why are standards seen as a crime in this game?

[Crystal_Raven]

I see this often, and personally I find this whole thing rather disgusting and obnoxious.

Having standards for players seems to a crime among this community and you will only be met with insults and overall terrible and toxic behaviour.

For example, it's rather standard to expect a level 70 tank player to understand Enmity and how it works. Yet I meet an insane amount of level 70 tank only players that do not understand the basics of enmity and how to hold aggro.

Another example is with the AoE mechanics aka the orange markers. I encounter many people that stand in them at levels 50+ because they don't realize that orange marker = bad.

It's completely mind boggling that this is considered acceptable by a large part of the community.

Those same people, if you criticize their actions because they don't understand basic game mechanics at pretty high levels if not max level itself, respond with insults, toxicity, "you don't pay my sub", "i'm new so i'm entitled to wiping raids because im learning", "i play how i want to", "you don't control my account" and so on.

And if you don't say anything to them, you get called a toxic elitist for choosing not to help them.

In the vast majority of other MMOs, if you are a bad player, you will be called a bad player, people will try to help, you are given the opportunity to improve and stop being a bad player.

In FF14, if you are a bad player, you cannot be criticized because the other person can report you for harassment and you'll probably get a warning under the new rules they implemented, and if you don't help them you get called a toxic elitist anyway.

Why is it such a crime to have actual STANDARDS in this game? No one is asking anyone to be the top 1%, or outright the top player in the world, however I would say it should be a very normal and common thing to expect high level players to understand at least the BASICS of combat and their class. Currently this fact is treated by the community like you just committed a war crime.

Why are standards a crime? Why do people think it's acceptable to waste everyone's time by wiping a raid repeatedly and when offered advice they respond with toxicity? This is a pretty common thing, and i find it mind boggling.

[YatoShishi]

preach sister !

[Gula]

How one offers advice plays an important role. "Lmao learn 2 tank [insert slur here]" is different from "Can you please get this mob off of me?"

On the other end, some people are just toxic jerks who don't want to be told how to play. It seems to differ by data center because on Aether- wew, there are some hot messes I get in DF over Primal.

Every community since ever has its stinkers. It's not a high crime, it's just the types of mentality that gets exposed with tens of thousands of people who get awfully stupid when they forget there's another person on the other end of their monitor. XIV has them in droves because it's T for Teen, meaning haughty high schoolers are getting home and being idiots online. Nothing new.

[Neoyoshi]

How one offers advice plays an important role. "Lmao learn 2 tank [insert slur here]" is different from "Can you please get this mob off of me?"

On the other end, some people are just toxic jerks who don't want to be told how to play. It seems to differ by data center because on Aether- wew, there are some hot messes I get in DF over Primal.

Every community since ever has its stinkers. It's not a high crime, it's just the types of mentality that gets exposed with tens of thousands of people who get awfully stupid when they forget there's another person on the other end of their monitor. XIV has them in droves because it's T for Teen, meaning haughty high schoolers are getting home and being idiots online. Nothing new.

Very well said. This game can be very pleasant once we are all on the same page and can communicate with each other.

[Rockette]

Because despite the calls of "toxic elitists" - in reality, there is no one more toxic than the casual playerbase.

Especially on this forum.

[Drayce1]

My opinion: this has a lot to do with the game's design.

The first fault is that the game's basic content is just really easy. People like to meme about ice mages in duty finder, but the thing is that the game pretty much lets you get away with that. Yes, ice mages are annoying. Yes, tanks that can't hold enmity right are inconvenient. But guess what? Unless everyone is just really bad, you can still beat your roulettes despite these annoyances because the game's difficulty - in regards to duty finder content at least - allows it.

The second fault is the duty finder. You aren't required to socialize with people to initiate non-savage content, hell even party finder tends to lack socialization. Most people just que for their duties and just idle until it pops, once it does pop they then do the bare minimum until Duty Complete comes across their screen and they instantly leave without saying a single word. Anybody criticizing them for doing the bare minimum (that the game allows them to due to lack of difficulty) is seen as some sort of elitist and no-lifer that's forcing others to live up to a supposed unrealistic expectation. They themselves suffer no consequence for being bad since, if someone has a problem with them, they can just que up with more randoms.

Know whats also annoying?

Healers wearing right side all 100 ilvs lower or worse o.o. Then complains when tank dies....or wont double pull....

[GenericMagus]

People are attracted to negativity and with constant exposure thinks it's a bigger problem than it is.

People do have standards, and they so play to it and if you clear content via DF you're bound to clear it most of the time.

Why not for EX Primals+? Different fight structure, 1 death often = snowball to wipe and you have to play team jump rope a lot of the time to a strict rotation.

[Skivvy]

I think I have a higher tolerance for varied skill levels, , so perhaps I don't speak up quite as often as others might - but when I have felt the need to actually say something I've never been called out for being an ass or had it tossed back at me in a negative way. Phrasing can make a world of difference when trying to offer suggestions.

I'm not saying those types of people aren't out there, I've just seen far too many chat logs where people think they are giving "advice" in an OK manner, and they just come off like a prat.

[Crystal_Raven]

How one offers advice plays an important role. "Lmao learn 2 tank [insert slur here]" is different from "Can you please get this mob off of me?"

On the other end, some people are just toxic jerks who don't want to be told how to play. It seems to differ by data center because on Aether- wew, there are some hot messes I get in DF over Primal.

Every community since ever has its stinkers. It's not a high crime, it's just the types of mentality that gets exposed with tens of thousands of people who get awfully stupid when they forget there's another person on the other end of their monitor. XIV has them in droves because it's T for Teen, meaning haughty high schoolers are getting home and being idiots online. Nothing new.

I've seen and been in many situations when a player was politely asked to do something, and I mean politely. As in "Can please do X instead of Y?" only for the other person to respond with insults and usually "you don't pay my sub" and a long list of excuses as to why they perform far below the average. Every community has it's bad players, that is a given. However, in FF14, the list of bad players seem to be significantly larger than any other MMO I have ever played, and the way SE coddles them and prevents anyone from criticizing them certainly doesn't help.

My dad knows how to play better than the majority of the people I meet in this game. And he's almost 60.

The main problem is that in FF14 it's not just a few that are incredibly toxic and refuse to learn to play and expect everyone else to carry them, it seems to be true for the overwhelming majority.

I think I have a higher tolerance for varied skill levels, , so perhaps I don't speak up quite as often as others might - but when I have felt the need to actually say something I've never been called out for being an ass or had it tossed back at me in a negative way. Phrasing can make a world of difference when trying to offer suggestions.

I'm not saying those types of people aren't out there, I've just seen far too many chat logs where people think they are giving "advice" in an OK manner, and they just come off like a prat.

That swings both ways, I've seen far too many chat logs where people are giving polite advice in a good manner, only to get insulted back.

For example, a person is trying to farm Leviathan for horse.
Person A: If you want to do it faster you can use Party Finder.
Person B: You don't pay my sub -censored- off you elitist -censored-

Person A promptly left the area very confused and asked us if we can explain what just happened.