SMN 5.0 Wishlist

[Cled-cat]

Personally I think it’s time to get rid of the egi’s and fully commit to the Demi-Primal route. Not only is it immensely more satisfying then the little chicken nugget egis we currently have, but it would fit the classic FF Summoner fantasy so much more, and likely draw a lot of people to the job.

Maybe add a series of traits that “evolve” our egi’s to Demi versions of their corresponding primal.

Consolidate DWT/Deathflare and Demi-Bahamut/Ahk Morn into the same buttons, would free up room for potentially more summon based actions for the new Demi primals.

Maybe even do a whole rework of Aetherflow actions and instead tie them to the Primals. Just as there’s 3 aetherflow gauges to fill, assign each to the 3 main Primals we have (Ifrit, Titan, Garuda) and allow us to gain them by summoning each corresponding primal and using their ultimate move. Fester, Bane and Painflare could either be removed to free up buttons, reworked into the new primal ultimates, or made OGCD’s. Just spitballing ideas, I would seriously love it if they really consolidated and doubled down on the new Summoner identity with Demi Primals.

[Lauront]

I would love this. It would make me more enthusiastic about SMN. I'd also like an ability (for PVP as well) that allowed you to swap places with your egi, demi or otherwise. As long as they let you control the placement and movement of the demi-egi, I think it's a good route to go down.

[Grimoire-M]

I'd rather see Bahamut, DWT, and Rouse merged into one button, with Bahamut only appearing once every 3 min as opposed to 2, with the aetherflow lockouts removed. Basically a 90% revert to Heavensward with the only stuff we keep being Bahamut himself, Devotion, the lack of a timer on Aethertrail, and Ruin IV existing as a button.

If you want pets to feel meaningful, make the demi versions the regular Egi instead, and treat them as a part of the core rotation. We'd be better off asking for the Egi to work as a mix of how they currently work and Bahamut. Shadowbringers should rework their cooldowns and buttons so they're all uniform, so that traits can be added that allow you to use them more often. That could be stuff like making Fester/Painflare reset certain cooldowns, or using Tri-Bind to force an AoE Autospell out of them, or using the pets to charge resources for Ruin III/IV outside of DWT, while DWT itself would allow you to use them innately, or flat out reducing Enkindle to 1 minute instead of relying on that random proc (as that would let it be used outside of Bahamut easily and Enkindle Bahamut could share a cooldown with it with little conflict).

[Lauront]

The prospect of making the Aetherflow spell set and various others like Tribind, which is currently very lacklustre, and maybe Shadowflare, interact with the pet abilities would be brilliant. Honestly, it's how the job should function.

[Cled-cat]

Yeah I’d love to see some more synergy with the abilities in Summoners toolkit. It feels like there’s 4 main themes going on with Summoner right now: DoT’s, Egi’s, Burst and now Demi-Primals. Whilst the job is fun to play it’s definitely becoming a bit confusing with where the job presentation is meant to be focused on here. I’d rather they double down on the Demi primal route and rework some of the existing abilities to synergise more with the Primals to go with that theme more.

[Dyvid]

* Rework pet A.I. Make all spell into abilites with increased range. Also pet should prioritize using ability over movement when commanded. This will stop a lot the misfire because pets are moving around.

* Rework pet abilities to something that makes sense in actually combat. We don't need knockback, stun, silence, heavy, or any other garbage status debuff. 90% of the time will be fighting bosses that are immune anyway.

* Rework Demi-Bahamut A.I. and abilities. Change to Wyrmwave to a 2.5s auto attack and add a trait to Summoner that any spell has a chance to upgrade summons auto attack to a more powerful spell (Akh Morn for 220 potency?) Change Enkindle to Tera Flare that can only be cast once during summoned phase for larger damage (think combining the damage of both Akh Morn into one).

* Rework DWT to Evokers Trance. During this phase the current Egi will be buffed in size, shape, and A.I (Demi-Egi). It would grow larger and more closely resemble the primals form. A.I. would be similar to mentioned D-Bahamut change above where it would have an auto attack that is upgraded to something strong. Deathflare and Enkindle will be combined into the Egi enkindle ability.

*Change Radiant Shield / Contagion to a summoner command similar to Devotion rather than an ability on the egi's hotbar.

* Egi glamour divided into two categories: Melee and Ranged. This will allows the devs to develop glamour more easily and help players know which pet style their teammates have. (Note: Summon II, tank, would fall under melee).

* Build upon the physical and magic preference of egi so players have a choice in summoning.

* Add another DoT, Virus, into the mix?

[Kalise]

On the idea of giving us Demi's over Egi's:

Aetherflow reworked:
* Each DWT used turns 1 Aetherflow slot to become a Primal Aspected Aetherflow
* Demi-Ifrit can only be used with at least 1 Primal Aetherflow
* Demi-Titan can only be used with at least 2 Primal Aetherflow
* Demi-Garuda can only be used with 3 Primal Aetherflow
* Summoning a Demi while at 3 Primal Aetherflow causes Aetherflow to become Dreadwyrm Aether
* Demi-Bahamut consumes Dreadwyrm Aether and resets Aetherflow back to its normal state

Rouse/DWT
* Rouse's is removed and is instead having its effect merged into Dreadwyrm Trance
* If a Demi is active while in DWT Ruin is replaced by Burning Strike/Rock Buster/Wind Blade/Wyrmwave which is functionally the same but has higher potency

Tri-Disaster
* Ruination debuff now instead decreases the targets Magical Resistance by 10%

Demi-Ifrit:
* Using DWT replaces his auto attacks with Incinerate, causing high damage in a cone in front of him.
* Casting Tri-Bind causes him to use Eruption on the target.
* Upon casting Ruin IV he will cast a Radiant Plume on the target.
* Enkindle causes him to use Hellfire dealing massive AoE damage.

Demi-Titan
* Using DWT replaces his auto attacks with Landslide which is a line AoE attack (No knockback though).
* Casting Tri-Bind causes him to use Weight of the Land on the target.
* Upon casting Ruin IV he will use Mountain Buster on the target.
* Enkindle causes him to use Earthen Fury dealing massive AoE damage.

Demi-Garuda:
* Using DWT replaces her auto attack with Friction which deals damage to the target and enemies around them.
* Casting Tri-Bind causes her to use Great Tornado on the target.
* Upon casting Ruin IV she will use Slipstream on the target, which is a line AoE skill that also stuns targets hit.
* Enkindle causes her to use Aerial Blast which deals massive AoE damage and also sends out a group of Razor Plumes which fly into enemies hit by Aerial Blast and explode dealing additional damage.

[Sylvain]

On the idea of giving us Demi's over Egi's:

Aetherflow reworked:
* Each DWT used turns 1 Aetherflow slot to become a Primal Aspected Aetherflow
* Demi-Ifrit can only be used with at least 1 Primal Aetherflow
* Demi-Titan can only be used with at least 2 Primal Aetherflow
* Demi-Garuda can only be used with 3 Primal Aetherflow
* Summoning a Demi while at 3 Primal Aetherflow causes Aetherflow to become Dreadwyrm Aether
* Demi-Bahamut consumes Dreadwyrm Aether and resets Aetherflow back to its normal state

Rouse/DWT
* Rouse's is removed and is instead having its effect merged into Dreadwyrm Trance
* If a Demi is active while in DWT Ruin is replaced by Burning Strike/Rock Buster/Wind Blade/Wyrmwave which is functionally the same but has higher potency

Tri-Disaster
* Ruination debuff now instead decreases the targets Magical Resistance by 10%

Demi-Ifrit:
* Using DWT replaces his auto attacks with Incinerate, causing high damage in a cone in front of him.
* Casting Tri-Bind causes him to use Eruption on the target.
* Upon casting Ruin IV he will cast a Radiant Plume on the target.
* Enkindle causes him to use Hellfire dealing massive AoE damage.

Demi-Titan
* Using DWT replaces his auto attacks with Landslide which is a line AoE attack (No knockback though).
* Casting Tri-Bind causes him to use Weight of the Land on the target.
* Upon casting Ruin IV he will use Mountain Buster on the target.
* Enkindle causes him to use Earthen Fury dealing massive AoE damage.

Demi-Garuda:
* Using DWT replaces her auto attack with Friction which deals damage to the target and enemies around them.
* Casting Tri-Bind causes her to use Great Tornado on the target.
* Upon casting Ruin IV she will use Slipstream on the target, which is a line AoE skill that also stuns targets hit.
* Enkindle causes her to use Aerial Blast which deals massive AoE damage and also sends out a group of Razor Plumes which fly into enemies hit by Aerial Blast and explode dealing additional damage.

Sounds a bit like the BRD song system.


I would personally remove AetherFlux from the summoner. They just add Nothing to the job, they could Simply make Fester and Painflare on a shared CD of 15-20s and it would achieve the same result (the only main difference would be the unability to quickly enter trance on pull)

With a short enough cd perhaps that kind of egi rotation could work quite well.

Anyway, I raelly hope they'll continue with the Demi path (surely, it only received positive feedback (beside the clunkiness of pet AI aspect))

[Grimoire-M]

-snip-

I disagree with going ahead on the Demi-Primal route because of that clunkiness. They need to resolve that first via tweaks to Bahamut before implementing it onto the Egi. The only thing that makes sense to me in regards to Bahamut's behaviour is the way he attacks with Wyrmwave, and even that has notable issues (making it proc off of oGCDs in general makes the rotation an utter mess, for example). Shurrikan touches on the fact that he tries to stay on you, but biggest issue with that is Akh Morn isn't prioritized over that movement. Regardless, the fact of the matter is Turrets and Fairies operate a whole lot better. Let Egi be horrible until SE figures out an alternative that isn't a giant mess.

With that in mind, Aetherflow is the reason to play the class at all atm. We're the only dps class with a resource that actually gets flexed around based on the situation. Taking that away for what would be an even bigger rush job than Bahamut is not a good idea. Part of the reason I advocate for returning to HW is because doing so would consolidate everything SE has given to us so far into a standard 15-20s window every minute, leaving room for SE to find other ways to make our filler rotation interesting in a way that doesn't come off as forced, like the Aetherflow lockouts are. That filler can be done by making the current egi work better, or applying a global egi rework, but either way it opens up room for that to be possible without discarding the other aspects of SMN that make it good.

I'd rather stick with the current warlock clone with some thought put into improving what's there than risk another BLU fiasco or pushing more on BRD's niche for no good reason.

[Flana]

I'm going to be odd one out. I actually like the Egi's and what they are supposed to represent in the world of XIV, so I'd rather see the focus shifted back towards them. So as for my personal wishlist:

Removing demi-bahamut entirely. I don't like this mechanic and I don't like Bahamut, so that's all I have to say on it.

Adding an ability much earlier on that allows you to kill your current pet and instantly summon a new one for free. This bypasses the mana drain and use of swiftcast to change pets if the situation calls for it.

More abilities for the Summoner that originate with the primal or are respective of the themes of that primal. I'd like to a button that allows you to call an ability from your egi and cast it. Like if you have Ifrit-egi out, you can place down an Infernal Nail that increases the damage you and your allies do as long as your near the nail. Or Titan can plop down a damage-absorbing barrier since they want him to be the protector of the trio.

I'd also like to see a bigger rework of abilities to more accurately reflect their origins from the primals. Give Tri-Disaster a new set of 3 debuffs that reflect balance, growth, and infinity. Balance can be something shared between summoner and egi. Growth could be a debuff that causes your pet to increase in size (slightly, no /bahamutsize large shenanigans) and damage as long as it attacks the target. Infinity I have no idea. Maybe healing the summoner and egi for a percent of damage done, or restoring mana, or whatever. Something to really convey this skill is supposed to reference the Warring Triad.

Lastly, something a little more interesting in the base rotation so we're not just spamming ruin waiting for the next aetherflow refresh. I actually feel like the changed Ruin IV is a great example, because it ties the pet and summoner together in a mechanical way while giving you something to look out for and plan around in your default gameplay.

Obviously I expect none of these things to happen in the expansion. It would require a massive overhaul to the entire system and mostly likely be horribly received by the playerbase at large. Oh well, they will probably fix pet responsiveness at least a little more so that's something to look forward to.