Thread: Revelations from Patch 4.56

Originally Posted by Fenral

More MSQ thoughts:

Thinking about it a little more, what if the anticlimax this time around is the point? War is terrible (but ultimately necessary; join the Army today!), and we were getting built up to take some serious losses, but then out of nowhere our friend Enigma starts interfering with the course of events, ultimately destabilizing things to the point where we only fight Elidibus to a draw, preventing the worst-case scenario where either of us comes out on top.

The climactic events that should have occurred didn't, both sides are too tired to continue for the moment, and now we're on a road trip to Third Optionville. For whatever reason, the plot has been hijacked.


Unrelated note, I did the instance as Ninja and cleared it first try. It was tight but certainly not impossible for melee.

about this part

I get the feeling that they wanted us to be defeated in the solo trial by EliduZenos, but then went with us having a small victory, if you think about it everyone is talking about how we were defeated by Zenos and that is suspicious since the circumstances were not exactly that. If Elidubus didn't just rewill himself back but just defeated us like Zenos did the message might've been passed better.
All the prelude to this MSQ honestly felt like that it was pointing to us being defeated to essentially bring us low for the next step and give a reason for us to go beyond light and darkness but who knows now.
Though maybe the problem is that now we don't have spare auracites to end ascians so there's also that

About the MSQ

I am honestly not sure how they will ever get the power scaling right. On one hand we do defeat old Zenos who was powered up by Shinryue and afterwards we are also able to defeat Omega and Prime Middy. Yet somehow we are now leaving our world and friends behind to travel to the first to get the scions back because we suddenly need them to defeat Elidizenos?

Anyway the only one we probably need is Urianger since he likes to make some strange plot devices...

Originally Posted by Alleo

About the MSQ

I am honestly not sure how they will ever get the power scaling right. On one hand we do defeat old Zenos who was powered up by Shinryue and afterwards we are also able to defeat Omega and Prime Middy. Yet somehow we are now leaving our world and friends behind to travel to the first to get the scions back because we suddenly need them to defeat Elidizenos?

Anyway the only one we probably need is Urianger since he likes to make some strange plot devices...

Regarding "power levels"

It's nowhere near as simple as you make out.
First, Zenos was a man with a pseudo-Echo, so maybe comparable to us, and he had the power of a primal, Shinryu. But the WoL is experienced in defeating primals, that's exactly what we do.
Elidizenos is not the same. he's an Ascian, and he has Zenos's body. Defeating a Ascian is much harder than defeating a Primal, it's taken very specific circumstances, and immence amounts of aether, to kill an Ascian, and this is apparently the top Ascian, stronger than all of the others.

Then we account for the fact that we didn't defeat Zenos one-on-one the first time, it was a group effort.
Then we add in the fact that we're currently weakened by the fact that we're periodically being called to another plain of existence.

Originally Posted by Alleo

About the MSQ

I am honestly not sure how they will ever get the power scaling right. On one hand we do defeat old Zenos who was powered up by Shinryue and afterwards we are also able to defeat Omega and Prime Middy. Yet somehow we are now leaving our world and friends behind to travel to the first to get the scions back because we suddenly need them to defeat Elidizenos?

Anyway the only one we probably need is Urianger since he likes to make some strange plot devices...

On "needing" our friends:

I'm pretty sure that's meant non-literally. Tataru's simply scared of us going in alone without backup, and the Scions are the best backup possible when facing an Ascian. The power scaling seems clear enough: we have the strength to overcome Elidizenos, but we need a new weapon to finish the job since we don't have access to Tupsimati or a dragon's eye, and especially because Elidibus seems to have extra weirdness going on. Giving us the right tools is basically what the Scions have always done, and that's why we need them (and also because they're our friends, of course).

ABout the power levels remember what Gaius told us about our black robed friends

"Vegeta! What does the scouter say about his power level?"

I think it's worth noting that Elidibenos mentions how surprised he is at our power levels during our fight with him.

This, with the fact that Ascians power is mostly just the Echo, as we've been told time and time again about how much potential there is with the Echo by Ascians.

In addition, to the fact that, Shadowhunter is a mere mortal without the Echo (I think?) and has been able to defeat Ascians, including some Red Masks.

With the icing on the cake being Elidibenos' reaction when Gaius taunts him for how cocky he was before the fight talking about how beating us would be "As easy as swatting a fly"

This all suggests that, we actually might be reaching the point where we might be able to destroy Ascians by ourselves, without need of stuff like Auracite or the like. Which would be a HUGE problem for the Ascians where they can no longer hide behind their jiggery pokery and have to deal with the fact that the WoL is coming for them. That Gaius' constant reminders to "Not underestimate mankind" actually hold a lot of weight. Essentially, to quote JARAXXUS, EREDAR LORD OF THE BURNING LEGION "Trifling Gnome Ascian, your arrogance will be your undoing!"

Which would be an interesting twist on things, pushing Ascians out of their comfort zones so they have to try and rely on other tactics, such as weapons like Black Rose. Heck, maybe they might end up trying to summon a primal of Zodiark, possibly also fusing with it a la Megazord Ascian Prime.

Originally Posted by Kalise

"Vegeta! What does the scouter say about his power level?"

I think it's worth noting that Elidibenos mentions how surprised he is at our power levels during our fight with him.

This, with the fact that Ascians power is mostly just the Echo, as we've been told time and time again about how much potential there is with the Echo by Ascians.

In addition, to the fact that, Shadowhunter is a mere mortal without the Echo (I think?) and has been able to defeat Ascians, including some Red Masks.

With the icing on the cake being Elidibenos' reaction when Gaius taunts him for how cocky he was before the fight talking about how beating us would be "As easy as swatting a fly"

This all suggests that, we actually might be reaching the point where we might be able to destroy Ascians by ourselves, without need of stuff like Auracite or the like. Which would be a HUGE problem for the Ascians where they can no longer hide behind their jiggery pokery and have to deal with the fact that the WoL is coming for them. That Gaius' constant reminders to "Not underestimate mankind" actually hold a lot of weight. Essentially, to quote JARAXXUS, EREDAR LORD OF THE BURNING LEGION "Trifling Gnome Ascian, your arrogance will be your undoing!"

Which would be an interesting twist on things, pushing Ascians out of their comfort zones so they have to try and rely on other tactics, such as weapons like Black Rose. Heck, maybe they might end up trying to summon a primal of Zodiark, possibly also fusing with it a la Megazord Ascian Prime.

Just to make sure, you meant Varis each time you wrote 'Gaius' yes?