Thread: 5.0 Combat changes: What do you expect?

Monk= Hadoken.
Sam= Spin Dash
War= Sonic boom.

Jokes aside I like the idea of giving the jobs an unltimate move taking all their meter back to 0. Kindof like giving a monk a Shinko-Hadoken or something. SQUARE.. I REALLY want an actual Ki blast PLEASE. T.T

Originally Posted by MrKimper

No but that's part of the loop many combos split off into separate combos. Take Samurai for example, hakaze not only generates 5 kenki it can branch off into jinpu/shifu both that give a unique buff as well as kenki. So essentially without literally making the hotbars the exact same as they are for pvp(which would require dumbing down a lot of the weaving of the job by a lot) you'd have to hakaze before every combo anyway to efficiently generate kenki. I believe the same thing happens with DRG's heavy thrust combo.

You would need hakaze > jinpu > gekko + hakaze > shifu > kasha + hakaze > yukikaze on three separate buttons. I'm all for consolidating skills but I think a lot of it should just be bloated skills, like gap closers and such. Have them be the same skill but activate when you get within a certain range of an enemy.

You could argue that ninja and mch and MAYBE BLM would play the exact same but it would effect a lot of jobs.

Speaking as Paladin who also plays with a game pad:

One Button with the icon of Rage of Halone press it once - you use fast blade. Press it again you execute savage blade, execute it a third time you do RoH.
Same goes for RA and Goring. Those as combo icons and you're done.

There i just compromised 3 combos, one of them unique and one with a splitting path in 3 buttons instead of 6.

Originally Posted by Nominous

For Dancer to be their solution to the DRG monopoly on "Synergy with ranged physical DPS", through nature of Dancer being Slashing damage and relying on SAM/NIN.

We should probably stop thinking of Dancer as being "Slashing" ASAP, they made a big point out of saying it's weapons are THROWING WEAPONS not Chakram's specifically, with mentions of Shuriken and Throwing Knives being about. Even your standard bladed on all sides Star type Shuriken is still a piercing weapon with the primary purpose of sticking into the target, simply has fewer bad angles than say darts and knives. Chakrams even traditionally are thrown slashing weapons though, but they are also far close to the size of bangles than bucklers. But with the classification as Throwing Weapons not Chakrams even things like Throwing Axes/Hammers remain on the table.

It's still possible for DNC to be considered Piercing Damage, and the possibility of Pierce/Slash/Crush Resistance Down debuffs being removed is still decent. The possibility of it being dropped to Physical/Magic, Melee/Ranged, or Melee/Ranged/Magic isn't 0 either. It's a wait and see. We know at least the idea of core dmg type is still around based on the mention that Gunbreaker is said to do Slashing Damage, and it's possible that Pierce/Slash/Crush Damage Up Personal Buffs replacing Resistance Down Debuffs hapening isn't bad either. This is quite important for the "Impure" damage dealers in the game. Things like WAR, SAM, BLM, SMN this is noteworthy, but when it comes to jobs with more duality to their kits like NIN, RDM, PLD, DRK it could very well make limited chunks of their kit better. DRG, MNK, BRD, MCH I left out since they have a limited amount of non-physical damage that is there, but I'm not willing to dedicate them to it either side atm.

I do not expect things about the combat system in itself but more in the content where you fight. Like dungeons which should be designed to be more challenging and not rushable (with more rewards accordingly).

And I'd love to try the Dancer but I really don't like how they did the new jobs. I want to start at lvl 1 with a real story job quest. I want to learn little by little and not be thrown away at lvl 60 with dozen of skills.

Originally Posted by OcieKo

We should probably stop thinking of Dancer as being "Slashing" ASAP, they made a big point out of saying it's weapons are THROWING WEAPONS not Chakram's specifically

The indication that they're throwing weapons is less about gameplay elements, and more about design. It's like telling people that it's not impossible to give DRK Scythes and Katanas. Just flavor to let people know that they can expect a wide variety of glamour opportunity.

I think their ability animations, particle effects, and sound design tell us that it's meant to be slashing. If it's not, the next runner up would be blunt. The stretch case is piercing. It's possible that Dancer being "Throwing weapons" IS vague enough to be a hint at consolidating all resistance types into one "Physical" category. Doubt it though.

And I doubt it just based on how they usually approach things like this. Usually it's a roundabout solution that doesn't really fix the problem. And I think Dancer being slashing damage sounds exactly like a XIV team solution to piercing damage being so imbalanced. Give more options instead of nerfing outright. Guess we'll see!

Originally Posted by MrKimper

That doesn't address issues of muscle memory in players that raid however, a lot of learning a job is familiarizing yourself with your opener and rotation through constantly doing it over and over again even for expansions. Although many jobs get skills pruned that prune and adaptation is often minimized to only those jobs effected. For example, WAR is basically the same through ARR, heavensward and stormblood with some minor effect changes, DRK got an entire combo button pruned from it and a host of it's skills crunched. There're a lot of things you have to consider when you do something like this.

Imagine doing this on multiple jobsm it would throw off the flow of some of them, and I agree with Yoshida that the current set up allows some expression of individual skill. There's no reason to oversimplify it further, especially with the SB changes bridging the gap between low and high skill players by removing cross class buff timers out of the equation and allowing jobs to focus on gauge/resource management gameplay.

I ve been playing with the same core set up for years (yes also raiding) and I'd take that system in a heartbeat because after an adjustment period it guarantees me quicker access to more skills and Makros + SE can add more without worrying about controller players.

Expression of individuality doesn't exist in an 1 2 3 combo. That's just playing wrong.

Condensing the combos of some skills via the PvP combo system allows more skills to be added that allow for more variation

Originally Posted by SunAurel

I ve been playing with the same core set up for years (yes also raiding) and I'd take that system in a heartbeat because after an adjustment period it guarantees me quicker access to more skills and Makros + SE can add more without worrying about controller players.

Expression of individuality doesn't exist in an 1 2 3 combo. That's just playing wrong.

Condensing the combos of some skills via the PvP combo system allows more skills to be added that allow for more variation

Not particularly and it's not individuality it's about skill, it's satisfying to learn and get the order you play your skills in in a rhythm and slowly get that rhythm in tune with a fight the more you bash your head into it. Getting your rotation and oGCD's to perfectly line up with the raid timings is rewarding.

I don't think condensing skills adds or fixes skill bloat inherently as part of the new skills is learning how they mesh with your old GCD and how to fit them in there, again to harken back to WAR, popping inner release JUST before your GCD is off cooldown is a way of expressing this. I just don't think macro gameplay is good for the long run, literally turning some jobs into mash one button for combo will just make things even more repetitive than they are right now in the long term, the only way I could see it being beneficial is a complete overhaul that basically turns this into an action game. I just don't think the game needs to be even more easy, any consolidation should be done to oGCDs the GCD right now is fine.