Male Viera... Unsubbing for now.

[Villa101]

I’m not insulting anyone, if anything I’ve seen lots insults coming from the unsub crowd calling the devs names like sexist, idiots, homophobic, etc. YouTube commenter level of toxicity isn’t going to get people what they want.

Saying someone is being sexist or homophobic is not an insult, its a criticism, you can choose to ignore or look into . But uh yeah, the fact that you view that purely as an insult instead of someone might be calling you that possibly for a reason, might be an issue.

[Senliten]

Saying someone is being sexist or homophobic is not an insult, its a criticism, you can choose to ignore or look into . But uh yeah, the fact that you view that purely as an insult instead of someone might be calling you that possibly for a reason, might be an issue.

Bullshit, if you can't back the claim up due to how loaded those terms are, then it is not criticism and it is flat out insulting. Show us where this sexism is? With unbiased, logical, and critical thinking taken into mass account.

[Villa101]

Bullshit, if you can't back the claim up due to how loaded those terms are, then it is not criticism and it is flat out insulting. Show us where this sexism is? With unbiased, logical, and critical thinking taken into mass account.

Sure

The women locked race is sexy lingerie ladies and the dude locked race are giant power fantasy muscle dudes. And that plays into "gender norms", only serve to eliminate options for those people who want to express themselves in game who might not fall in these gender norms. Like say a tall lithe sexy lingerie man bunny. Or a Giant hulking muscley lion lady.

So that's where it is

Those terms are criticism and meant to inspire introspection, you purely taking it as an insult and not a claim that is made because of an issue. Is a problem

[Senliten]

Sure

The women locked race is sexy lingerie ladies and the dude locked race are giant power fantasy muscle dudes. And that plays into "gender norms", only serve to eliminate options for those people who want to express themselves in game who might not fall in these gender norms. Like say a tall lithe sexy lingerie man bunny. Or a Giant hulking muscley lion lady.

So that's where it is

Those terms are criticism and meant to inspire introspection, you purely taking it as an insult and not a claim that is made because of an issue. Is a problem

And why do you think it even is about 'gender norms'? Like others have mentioned, it can easily be trying to appease to two bases with what development time possible, where do you and everyone else claiming these 'gender norm' 'power fantasy' introverted thought processes come to just this one conclusion?

Using loaded terms for introspection is still not criticism, you can in fact, avoid using those words and still provide an adequate response. Those two terms are nothing more than agenda pushers and only serve to divide and harm.


Honestly, everyone that hates these announcements cling to this one thing, just this one bloody thing, and fail to even see the possibility or other rationales. I do hope you can see that, but I sincerely doubt it.

[Physic]

Sure

The women locked race is sexy lingerie ladies and the dude locked race are giant power fantasy muscle dudes. And that plays into "gender norms", only serve to eliminate options for those people who want to express themselves in game who might not fall in these gender norms. Like say a tall lithe sexy lingerie man bunny. Or a Giant hulking muscley lion lady.

So that's where it is

Those terms are criticism and meant to inspire introspection, you purely taking it as an insult and not a claim that is made because of an issue. Is a problem

male power fantasy being bulky is questionable at best. The idealized male in most cultures and history is not traditionally bulky. Vierra were vierra since ff12, they were always going to look like that.

also i would question whether either thing is "sexist" being that they exist in a game with many other options. Hrothgar specifically is closest to roe, which is the least popular, and kinda throws your male fantasy to appeal to the masses thing in the garbage.

also, you talk about people that want to express themselves on way as if they have more right to a race than the other groups.

there is one bulky male race, 2 athletic male races, and 3 that are average/slim. it sounds like hrothgar is actually giving people more male options rather than less. And bulky male is far from a gender norm in ff.

[ScarboroughFairy]

Sure

The women locked race is sexy lingerie ladies and the dude locked race are giant power fantasy muscle dudes. And that plays into "gender norms", only serve to eliminate options for those people who want to express themselves in game who might not fall in these gender norms. Like say a tall lithe sexy lingerie man bunny. Or a Giant hulking muscley lion lady.

So that's where it is

Those terms are criticism and meant to inspire introspection, you purely taking it as an insult and not a claim that is made because of an issue. Is a problem

Why do people keep pretending masculine female representations don't exist with the races? Don't we have Thighlanders and Roegadames? Why do people keep pretending that cutesy and graceful males don't get representation like Lalafellas and Manquo'te? I get wanting to go against the status quo, appeal to variety, but this horsecrap about FFXIV being P R O B L E M A T I C because there's one more race where the women are feminine and the males are masculine needs to fucking end. It's not a problem--especially since the other varied representations of women and men already exist in the game.

Please stop.

[Darkplanet]

I can understand why people are upset. And it’s valid, you wanted something and were looking forward to it and it didn’t come through, we all feel that sometimes, it’s ok. I would definitely agree I would prefer not to have gender-locked races.

But I guess personally I would play female viera anyway, although it would be cool to see some buff Hrothgar females. So idk maybe one day they’ll add the opposing genders? Idk likely no but who knows, we never expected to get 2 races tho yea?

I also understand their argument of, we wanted to create more races so we had to scarifice this other thing. It’s like you can’t win either way, if we got male viera we wouldn’t be getting hrothgar and the people who like hrothgar would be upset. But then again we were expecting male viera so the disappointment is stronger there.

So idk, I’m sry you are un-subbing, I won’t shame anyone for that, it’s a tricky situation and lots of excitement and disappointment all around. The light and darkness, and if we have found anything out about the story the balance is good! Lol...

[SerLuke]

The point of the temper tantrums is to let the devs know that people are indeed unhappy and would like to see this stuff changed rather than stop playing a game they might've enjoyed a lot otherwise.

Unfortunately the devs have proven that with these kinds of decisions the only way you can even get them to notice the problems the community has with them is to throw a continuous temper tantrum, otherwise it's probably just a vocal minority who can never be pleased right? :^)

I can promise you tantrums aren’t going to have the effect you desire, if you present your grivneces in a calm cilvilized mater then yeah that might get some consideration. A tantrum however is just going to make people go “okay wow this person is crazy” and make any legimate point you might make invalid because you won’t be taken seriously.

[Alleo]

I can promise you tantrums aren’t going to have the effect you desire, if you present your grivneces in a calm cilvilized mater then yeah that might get some consideration. A tantrum however is just going to make people go “okay wow this person is crazy” and make any legimate point you might make invalid because you won’t be taken seriously.

There will always be people in discussions that take overdo it but where exactly did the OP throw a tantrum? He even said that he is happy for those that wanted the other race but that this and other points have disappointed him and that he will now unsub. That is a reasonable post. He did not call the devs or anyone else names and yet quite some posters have answered quite rude. I mean there is even a thread where someone is quite happy that the people who want to now unsub will be gone because they are bad for the game and not a FF fan at all. That was imo one of the worst threads I have read today and it was from someone of the other side. (Again not that there arent some that are overdoing it either)

There are no surveys when you dont sub anymore, the only way to give feedback is the forum. Thus why people post that and on top of that give even a reason why. That is far away from a tantrum.

(Lets not forget that the forums were quite heated after the shirogane desaster too and thanks to that and some negative PR on other sites, they gave us way more houses)

[ScarboroughFairy]

Then, when there is a large demand, they talk about limitations of ressources, but then later announce something that ate up even more Ressources that nobody asked for.

This is one of those things where I think it should be pointed out that devs, in any videogame franchise, don't typically sit around and wait for players to tell them what should the focus their resources on. Some of that stuff was planned out months or even years before players start clamoring about what they'd like to see next. Some of that stuff takes a higher priority than the addition of something that would chew up more time than something that would offer more to the experience in terms of gameplay, bar the flavorful stuff you can experience from the dialogue in the story.

I remember how Diadem 1 failed and how people went to the "pls make the Dungeons more interessting. Diadem was horrible, please focus on good Parts of the Game to make them better.".
And then they again talked about ressources and limitations and later announced Diadem 2.

I don't have a response for this as I wasn't around for Diadem 1.

I think my main point is, though, is that the people genuinely upset to the point where they'd unsub kinda already missed the boat two expansions ago. Viera was absent for 4 years and no one got what they wanted, yet these people still kept playing. Fastforward to yesterday: Viera is slotted to be added to the game, some people got everything they asked for with the mere addition of the race, some didn't get everything they wanted. It's hard not to see those who unsub because they didn't have things exactly the way they wanted it as anything other than a tantrum, really. A tantrum thrown 4 years too late.