Male Viera as a playable character! show your support

[REPROBEAN_CHILD]

Noooo, you kinda are white knighting. I think a good majority of us do understand the development cost and work that goes into new races. But guess what? It's still important to me, so I'm still gonna talk about it. YoshiP said they will consider adding the Male Viera and Fem Hrothgar after looking at feedback. No promises, but at least we feel we will be heard. We're giving feedback.

Yeah, it is about gimme gimme. If something is important to you, you also have the right to make a thread and ask for it, that is what the forums are for. Just so happens that this topic seems to be more important than a lot of the other topics that have popped up, or they'd be getting the 1400 likes.

Listening to feedback doesn't mean they will actually do it. Yoshi-P didn't confirm nor deny the possibility of fem Hrothgar and male Viera, because he knows there'll be another backlash if he says there's no current plans. Look at what happened with the healer situation. Me white knighting would be me saying they could do no wrong and no one should ever argue with them. There's A LOT that I disagree with some of their decisions. But in terms of them making four new base models and making sure the entire game runs with them, is another story. This is including making them compatible EVERYTHING already in the game, as well as what's in the expansion. So no, I don't think you really understand, since you admit this is a 'gimme gimme' situation, rather than understanding what the dev team could actually do.

[MrKimper]

Listening to feedback doesn't mean they will actually do it. Yoshi-P didn't confirm nor deny the possibility of fem Hrothgar and male Viera, because he knows there'll be another backlash if he says there's no current plans. Look at what happened with the healer situation. Me white knighting would be me saying they could do no wrong and no one should ever argue with them. There's A LOT that I disagree with some of their decisions. But in terms of them making four new base models and making sure the entire game runs with them, is another story. This is including making them compatible EVERYTHING already in the game, as well as what's in the expansion. So no, I don't think you really understand, since you admit this is a 'gimme gimme' situation, rather than understanding what the dev team could actually do.

There's multiple things the devs could have done.

1. Announce viera as genderlock before pre-orders went through.
2. Announce hrothgar beforehand.
3. Do a secondary poll to gauge interest on how a beast like/partial beastial race.
4. Delay Viera and implement full hrothgar.
5. Delay Hrothgar and implement full viera.
6. Not implement either race and double down on fixing current races and subraces.

Multiple multiple things, except they chose for resource and time management to release two races with more customization to try and appeal to both demographics, those that wanted viera, and those that wanted a beast like race. It obviously did not pan over well, and this isn't an issue of "gimme gimme gimme" whether the reason for yoshida adding male miqo'te, female roe's and female highlander was because at it's impetus the game had much less gear to manage, the locking of genders has historically been ill received by the community.

Male mithra existed and were long asked for during XI lifespan with the devs essentially trolling everyone and releasing a male mithra as an npc only race. Galka basically needed to be written as asexual to keep people from asking for female Galka, again whether you believe people are "whining" or being "un-realistic" the dev team realized there would be backlash yet did not prepare for it.

Also keep in mind the "Stop asking for things it'd be too much on the dev team" is just a fallacy, players and consumers should be allowed to voice requests and it is not silly or harmful to do so. I believe no one here is asking the dev team to work themselves to death, no one wants that, stop framing this as such people are voicing their desire for a feature not in the game, whether that be QoL fixes, BLU being unlocked or Furnishing designs, that is part of why these forums exist, for feedback.

[VyelChuChu]

It looks like 1400 people have no concept of development time, cost, time it takes to make content, or budget. It's already explained why they've reached this decision and why the Fem Roe and males Miqo'te was doable 5 years ago, unlike now. But I guess people just hear the "let your voice be heard," without really thinking about what comes with it.

I've also been hearing something along the lines of "they've had two years to do ------." You don't really know what goes behind closed doors. They're killing two birds with one stone with this move (giving people both Viera and a beast-like race). Now these races need to have tens of thousands of gear pieces remade for each of them. That's literally double the amount. Now imagine if they had to do the same for both genders. Every race and gender uses a different model. So, this idea that Midlander, Highlander, Miqote, Elezen, and Au'Ra are somehow using the same base model is an outright lie. Hrothgar are not "basically Roes." And no, I'm not white knighting. I'm just being realistic as to what the dev team can do. But it's all about gimme gimme smh.

I mean, this sounds exactly like what Yoshi P said when he described and explained their decision making over the genderlock! We know, we literally all know! It's okay! Yoshi P asked us for feedback anyway! If you look through many of the posts in this thread, and the Hrothgar female thread, there are a lot of people willing to wait so as to not over-tax the dev team because of the amount of work YoshiP said it took.

Adding the two genders later on and over time ((maybe over an expac or two?)) could very possibly stretch out the work of fitting all that gear to a manageable level! It really appears that Square is rushing the devs very hard right now, but we all have seen they're capable of managing time. Not to mention once that work is done they won't be adding more races anyway!

They need time. Both time to make their decision looking over the feedback and time to figure out how it would be best to give what they decide based on that feedback.

It's not impossible for them to do this wisely.

[Anarnee]

Listening to feedback doesn't mean they will actually do it. Yoshi-P didn't confirm nor deny the possibility of fem Hrothgar and male Viera, because he knows there'll be another backlash if he says there's no current plans. Look at what happened with the healer situation. Me white knighting would be me saying they could do no wrong and no one should ever argue with them. There's A LOT that I disagree with some of their decisions. But in terms of them making four new base models and making sure the entire game runs with them, is another story. This is including making them compatible EVERYTHING already in the game, as well as what's in the expansion. So no, I don't think you really understand, since you admit this is a 'gimme gimme' situation, rather than understanding what the dev team could actually do.

I legitimately said they were not promising us anything, I understand it doesn't mean they'll do it, but if we don't say anything about it they for sure won't because it will appear that no one wants it.

Just because I still want something despite the amount of work that will go into it, doesn't mean I don't understand. It means I want them to find the resources to make it happen. They can do it. It will be a lot of work. But they can do it, and instead of the resources going into something else, I want this to be considered as a priority.

[Kazran]

Every race and gender uses a different model. So, this idea that Midlander, Highlander, Miqote, Elezen, and Au'Ra are somehow using the same base model is an outright lie. Hrothgar are not "basically Roes." And no, I'm not white knighting. I'm just being realistic as to what the dev team can do. But it's all about gimme gimme smh.

Unfortunately you are quite provablely wrong here! Those of the TexTools committee have shown to us that the in fact alot of races share gear models. (Males share with males) (females share with females) all the gear models for the the most part share textures too!

Let's say a modder (mods are against the rules btw) wants to edit a gear piece they only have to edit one model (for the gender they want) for it to effect midlander, elezen, Aura, and Miqote (for males at least, fem highlander shares with fem midlanders) only Roe, Male highlander and Lalafell have their own gear models. Really they only have to work on helmets!

I would never model, but the info is out there!

[MrKimper]

It looks like 1400 people have no concept of development time, cost, time it takes to make content, or budget. It's already explained why they've reached this decision and why the Fem Roe and males Miqo'te was doable 5 years ago, unlike now. But I guess people just hear the "let your voice be heard," without really thinking about what comes with it.

I've also been hearing something along the lines of "they've had two years to do ------." You don't really know what goes behind closed doors. They're killing two birds with one stone with this move (giving people both Viera and a beast-like race). Now these races need to have tens of thousands of gear pieces remade for each of them. That's literally double the amount. Now imagine if they had to do the same for both genders. Every race and gender uses a different model. So, this idea that Midlander, Highlander, Miqote, Elezen, and Au'Ra are somehow using the same base model is an outright lie. Hrothgar are not "basically Roes." And no, I'm not white knighting. I'm just being realistic as to what the dev team can do. But it's all about gimme gimme smh.

Realistically they won't ignore player feedback, feasible implementation or not.

[username1234]

A niche race like hrothgar is worth the cost but a missing gender with much higher demand isn't? SE isn't lacking in funds they should stop siphoning profits into vaporware like FF7R and reinvest back into their actual cash cow.

[Anselmet]

It looks like 1400 people have no concept of development time, cost, time it takes to make content, or budget. It's already explained why they've reached this decision and why the Fem Roe and males Miqo'te was doable 5 years ago, unlike now. But I guess people just hear the "let your voice be heard," without really thinking about what comes with it.

And yet the dev team did not necessarily rule out they would never be willing to add male viera. As far as they are concerned and we here in the forums are concerned, male Viera are still in the realm of possibility. They may have explained why the did not implement male viera but many of us do not agree with their decision. Just because it does take quite a bit of resources to do something also does not mean we cannot request for it to happen. If they see how much we want something then the dev team can then decide if they want to listen to us or not. If they do, then they have to open up their resources to grant us what we want. We are consumers who pay for a subscription. I'm pretty sure they want to appease us even if it is only looking at our feedback.

I've also been hearing something along the lines of "they've had two years to do ------." You don't really know what goes behind closed doors. They're killing two birds with one stone with this move (giving people both Viera and a beast-like race). Now these races need to have tens of thousands of gear pieces remade for each of them. That's literally double the amount. Now imagine if they had to do the same for both genders. Every race and gender uses a different model. So, this idea that Midlander, Highlander, Miqote, Elezen, and Au'Ra are somehow using the same base model is an outright lie. Hrothgar are not "basically Roes." And no, I'm not white knighting. I'm just being realistic as to what the dev team can do. But it's all about gimme gimme smh.

Where is your proof that they are not 'essentially Roes'. Do you know what people mean by this statement? Because I hate to break it to you the dev team are notorious for reusing assets. For example Omega M and Omega F are made off of the Elezen skeleton. Another example? Kefka was also made off of the Elezen skeleton. Hell many Garleans such as Nero use the Elezen skeleton and some of them use a Hyur skeleton. What I am saying is that they have many bases to work off of and have done so in this game to make short cuts. I would not be surprised if Female Viera were originally made off the female elezen skeleton and just modified into a new race. And as someone has mentioned already, modders when they mod gear can often do so easily because many races share gear assets. Now imagine if they did use a male Elezen model (cut down the neck etc.) and made male Viera. The gear would most likely easily work on both races and require little resources other than helmets.

Like I am sorry, this game does have a lot of great diversity in races and gear but its all smoke and mirrors. The dev team know how to reuse what they have and only make something new when it is necessary.

[REPROBEAN_CHILD]

And yet the dev team did not necessarily rule out they would never be willing to add male viera. As far as they are concerned and we here in the forums are concerned, male Viera are still in the realm of possibility. They may have explained why the did not implement male viera but many of us do not agree with their decision. Just because it does take quite a bit of resources to do something also does not mean we cannot request for it to happen. If they see how much we want something then the dev team can then decide if they want to listen to us or not. If they do, then they have to open up their resources to grant us what we want. We are consumers who pay for a subscription. I'm pretty sure they want to appease us even if it is only looking at our feedback.



Where is your proof that they are not 'essentially Roes'. Do you know what people mean by this statement? Because I hate to break it to you the dev team are notorious for reusing assets. For example Omega M and Omega F are made off of the Elezen skeleton. Another example? Kefka was also made off of the Elezen skeleton. Hell many Garleans such as Nero use the Elezen skeleton and some of them use a Hyur skeleton. What I am saying is that they have many bases to work off of and have done so in this game to make short cuts. I would not be surprised if Female Viera were originally made off the female elezen skeleton and just modified into a new race. And as someone has mentioned already, modders when they mod gear can often do so easily because many races share gear assets. Now imagine if they did use a male Elezen model (cut down the neck etc.) and made male Viera. The gear would most likely easily work on both races and require little resources other than helmets.

Like I am sorry, this game does have a lot of great diversity in races and gear but its all smoke and mirrors. The dev team know how to reuse what they have and only make something new when it is necessary.

Ok. Let's say I'm wrong about the resuing model. We already know the game has a ton of reskins, recolors, and recolors of reskins. For instance, I know the Vanu Vanu is based off the Amalj'aa model. But that doesn't mean they're going to do the same for Viera and Hrothgar. Also, would you even want that? Let's say the devs, use Elezen models for Viera and Roe for Hrothgar? Then you're going to get people saying this work is lazy. People were already criticizing the Vieras for their emotes. But they're still going to have to work with A TON of gear pieces to apply to the new races. Why else do we still not have the various hemp sets?

[Halivel]

Let's say the devs, use Elezen models for Viera and Roe for Hrothgar?

That's what they most likely already did for females Viera and males Htothgars. Actually, there are only three bodies in this game right now. Lalafels and Roe have their own, and everything else are adjusted to different conditions Hyur body. Every race has its own texture pack though but it's not the worst. There is still a lot of work to do.

For armor - no one here say that they have to release missing genders on 5.0 launch, it's physically impossible. If it will be somewhere in 6.0 or even later - it's fine. People can be very patient when they will know if they will get something. Anyway, it's up to SE to decide if it's worth to work on counterparts or not, not to us.

As for Viera emotes - I personally think they were not finished at EU fanfest so just wait until the launch to see how they going to look in game.