Add ilv requirement please in ShB[Dev Request]

[Dark_Lord_Kuro]

Ok but they need ti give the revelent gear in the msq or some side quest of the assosiated town/village a t that point of the msq so people who just want to do quest can

[HyoMinPark]

People supposed to run the dungeon to get the gear, so mostly will have a little lower gear than the dungeon...

Healer just get used to heal over geared tank too much that they think anything bellow that is undergeared

Why are people wearing i200 in a dungeon that drops i260 where there are myriads of other gear options between level 60 and level 61? A person in Sirensong wearing i200 gear or gear from 2 expansions ago is undergeared. No ifs, ands, or buts.

I feel like you missed the point of the thread. We aren't talking about "a couple pieces here and there" or "maybe a couple item levels below what they should be for the dungeon" - we are talking about people coming into dungeons still wearing gear from ARR.

Ok but they need ti give the revelent gear in the msq or some side quest of the assosiated town/village a t that point of the msq so people who just want to do quest can

The game already does this - MSQ and sidequests from HW onwards drop level appropriate gear, including weapons. Only thing they could do was place gear coffers in the MSQ directly and remove the extraneous pieces from sidequests, since people either ignore sidequests or save them for alt jobs.

[linay]

On dungeon bosses, usually one diversion at the beginning of the fight should be enough to carry you until the end of the boss fight. Regular enemies usually don't need diversion unless tank is undergeared compared to DPS and or if DPS is single targeting one enemy that the tank isn't giving enough attention.

And it's OGCD, and all role actions can be used now, plus it has a nice animation, so just use it.

Tactician is really a freebie.

On recent occasions, I've asked my fellow BRD/MCH to please give me that, but they refuse. (I know TP is going away, but we still have 3 months!)

[HyoMinPark]

On recent occasions, I've asked my fellow BRD/MCH to please give me that, but they refuse. (I know TP is going away, but we still have 3 months!)

Is this on a melee DPS or tank? Melee DPS have Invigorate, so you should use that first in the event the BRD/MCH had to use Tactician for an aggro dump (MCH typically is fine with just Refresh, but a BRD bursts every 80 seconds and fairly heavily; so they may have had to use it to prevent themselves from ripping after a Minuet/RS window). I know SAM AOE is TP heavy, so they should use Tactician for AOE if you have already used Invigorate and it's still on CD.

On tanks, the only one that should have issues is PLD. In which case, they need Goad/Tactician. DRK AOE is MP related, and WARs can Equilibrium in Deliverance for a free 200 TP every 60secs. Baby, but unless you're spamming Overpower non-stop and not trying to build for Decimates, you shouldn't have too many issues with TP.

But keep in mind I'm referring to optimal play against single targets. The only TP issues you should have on a single target is a death... in which case, there should be Invigorate available upon Raise, or hopefully another melee with Goad.

[linay]

Is this on a melee DPS or tank? Melee DPS have Invigorate, so you should use that first in the event the BRD/MCH had to use Tactician for an aggro dump (MCH typically is fine with just Refresh, but a BRD bursts every 80 seconds and fairly heavily; so they may have had to use it to prevent themselves from ripping after a Minuet/RS window). I know SAM AOE is TP heavy, so they should use Tactician for AOE if you have already used Invigorate and it's still on CD.

On tanks, the only one that should have issues is PLD. In which case, they need Goad/Tactician. DRK AOE is MP related, and WARs can Equilibrium in Deliverance for a free 200 TP every 60secs. Baby, but unless you're spamming Overpower non-stop and not trying to build for Decimates, you shouldn't have too many issues with TP.

But keep in mind I'm referring to optimal play against single targets. The only TP issues you should have on a single target is a death... in which case, there should be Invigorate available upon Raise, or hopefully another melee with Goad.

On my SAM, I would use invigorate, but from time to time, especially on bigger pulls, that 400 extra TP will run out quickly.

I would use goad when the PLD ask for it because I'm bad at paying attention to others (another reason I don't do healing well).

[Crushnight]

People supposed to run the dungeon to get the gear, so mostly will have a little lower gear than the dungeon...

Healer just get used to heal over geared tank too much that they think anything bellow that is undergeared

a little is not the issue we talking about here it's the fact anyone can enter these leveling dungeons too undergeared these dungeons were designed with a minimum ilv in mind yet it is not enforced within the game when it should be and this is what this request is about

[Kuroka]

Ok but they need ti give the revelent gear in the msq or some side quest of the assosiated town/village a t that point of the msq so people who just want to do quest can

No. You are supposed to work for your stuff and put effort, the game is not about gettin free loot. Tbh i wished quests would never give gear or just one catch up set on release.

We dont get free gear during endgame stuff either, so why should it be any different during leveling?

I believe its part of the problem ppl use way outdated gear, the game teaches it way too late...

[Gula]

If you can't be bothered to use Diversion (or any agro management tools) when needed, then don't be surprised if the healer can't be bothered to heal you or the tank can't be bothered to Provoke.

Or the tank could, you know- not lose aggro.

[JBee]

I've been strongly in favor of minimum ilvl requirements for all dungeons for a long time. Don't make them too strict - shouldn't be required to be overgeared to run something, but should be able to positively contribute to the run.

A lot of people use the Deep Dungeons to level their DPS jobs now - it's brainless, repetitive, and something you can fill 15-20 minutes with... and you don't have to spend gil or time gearing your jobs up through the process. Run PotD until 60, get poetics gear at 60, run a couple roulettes until 61, and then back into HoH you go...where gear still doesn't matter. But sometimes, the DDs get to be a little much and people want to sprinkle in some roulettes. Or maybe they had no intention of taking "Job Alt #7: into a dungeon at all and a friend was leveling their tank or healer and asked them to join... well sure, I have this job close in level.... And bam. You're in a dungeon woefully undergeared. There was no laziness or ill intent involved - just something that never came up until it did, and it was too late.

Or you could do like I did myself - gear up at 60 in Augmented Shire on your next to lass job to cap out, into HoH you go, mixed in with MSQ Roulette, and you had no intention of stepping foot in content where your ilvl was so low that it could be argued you "didn't belong" there. And when you get to level 69 you're just trying to finish it out before the end of the night so you jump in a trial roulette for a hit of exp - and oops, Lakshmi.

But if there had been a minimum ilvl for Emanation, it wouldn't have stuck an i270 in a level 67 trial.

Additionally, to expand on what I was meaning earlier on Diversion... If you have an overgeared high dps player going against a newer tank (maybe undergeared, maybe not), that tank is going to have to put some effort into holding agro. Not just one different button here and there but likely it will mess up their whole rhythm, which is pretty frustrating for anyone in any role. If I am on RDM and the DRK pulls the boss - and I immediately hit my melee combo, Embolden, VerFlare, Contre Sixte, and Fleche.... of course I am taking agro. If any high burst dps throws the kitchen sink at the boss right out the gate it's going to work the same way. It's not hard to hit Diversion before the fight even starts to try to take some edge off of that. Or learn some of your skills - and maybe toss in a Lucid Dreaming to lower your agro, since you wont be needing mana for a while anyway.

I've had the conversation with many players - players who think that enmity is only the tank's job when that is absolutely false. Enmity is a group effort. Problems happen when 1) the Non-Tanks refuse to use their abilities to manage their agro when necessary and 2) the Tank is unable to keep agro, regardless of reason (skill, gear, competence, etc). And a sorely undergeared Tank will struggle to keep agro off the overgeared dps, most of the time... Which leads to smaller pulls... Which leads to antsy dps/healer.... Which leads to just a bad time overall.

[Kalise]

Or the tank could, you know- not lose aggro.

Or the DPS could, you know- not gain aggro.

Same logic.

Optimal play is everyone pushing out maximum DPS. This includes the Tanks.

As such, for Tanks to push out optimal DPS, they have to minimize Enmity gain, because enmity gain tools are net DPS losses in most cases.

Thus, the use of enmity reduction tools from DPS and Healers becomes very important. As this facilitates the Tank to need to produce less Enmity and thus focus more on DPS.

Advocating for inoptimal play is a terrible suggestion.