What is a "bad player" to you?

[Woffy]

I just want to piggyback on this and ask the name of the MMO where you're a healer that JUST heals because I want to know where people got this weird idea you're supposed to do nothing but spam HP restoration skills. I've played; Asheron's Call, Everquest 2, Tera, Aion, Asheron's Call 2, Dungeon and Dragons Online, Neverwinter, Champions Online, Guild Wars 2, Wakfu, Ragnarok Online, Vanguard, Wildstar, Archeage, and at least a half-dozen other MMOs I've forgotten the name of. In not a single one of them was the 'healer' expecting to do nothing but heal. It's driving me insane, where is the idea that 'I play a healer I should only heal' come from!?

In terms of the topic itself, first thing that comes to mind are people who refuse to use no-cost (as in an ogcD that doesn't reduce their output at all) aggro-reduction skills and strip aggro from the tank like you're proving a point that you're outdamaging their aggro generation.

Just wanted to answer your question: Everquest.

And concerning Vanguard, yes you could play Disciple or Bloodmage (both healed through dps). But if you played Shaman or Cleric in a raid you didnt do more than buff/debuff and heal/shield. And if a raid depended on the dps of a cleric? That raid was doomed from the beginning.
Archeage you chose 3 different skill sets so no pure healer. Guild wars 2 didn't even have a decent healer until ranger, and that is still not a pure healer.
Tera Ive played Mystic so offcourse I dps:ed.

Anyway I played most of those games and then some and this is the first game I've heard healers must dps. In most (at least in older games) healers usually have dps for soloing xp, the healer is usually expected to heal/shield, buff/debuff, summon, rezz, aka your basic healer duties.

That said, I do dps as a healer in this game since there is to much dead time otherwise. But that is me, I wouldn't complain about a healer just healing.

As far as topic is concerned I'd say a bad player is someone who doesn't want to improve or doesn't care (no I don't place non-dps healers in this category).

[hydralus]

Anyway I played most of those games and then some and this is the first game I've heard healers must dps. In most (at least in older games) healers usually have dps for soloing xp, the healer is usually expected to heal/shield, buff/debuff, summon, rezz, aka your basic healer duties.

I want to start off with saying that I don't bother healers or tell them what to do in the game (unless they are missing a mechanic). When I see a healer who's just standing around I'll either drop or just keep going because I imagine if they're standing around at 70 they simply don't care to utilize half of their skill kit. That's their choice, I accept it. (Heck, it's half the reason I play a healer so often is because then I know the healer will be as active as possible. The other half is because I enjoy it so much) That said it's clearly a better option to use the spare time to increase outgoing damage than to do literally nothing but wait. Unless you're fearing that there's going to be the tankbuster of all tankbusters approaching then you're just slacking it. (Also I'd like to add that I'm talking specifically about standing around and doing nothing waiting for a heal to matter)

I don't think we should be basing things off what you 'must' do but what you 'can' do. I try to improve my damage as a DPS and using the right mitigation skills at the right time for a tank as well, but there are plenty of people who won't and things will still work out just fine.

As for the games brought up, I understand there's no pure healers in a lot of them. A lot even have builds (In RO I played a semi battle cleric/support so I recall doing damage plenty). There's also MP limitations or simply not having the ability to damage certain creatures. But if you DO have the methods and ample opportunity, why wouldn't you take it? I imagine the answer is 'because I don't want to', which is definitely an answer although a pretty selfish one.

Hell I play a PLD. They're a tank. Do you know how many times I've healed someone else because both healers were dead or simply not paying attention? If I had the mindset that I should be doing my primary role then I should be using that MP to spam flash s'more. Then that person would be dead because while I had the means and the opportunity to assist and greatly help with the completion of the duty, I decided 'nah'.

[Bright-Flower]

I want to start off with saying that I don't bother healers or tell them what to do in the game (unless they are missing a mechanic). When I see a healer who's just standing around I'll either drop or just keep going because I imagine if they're standing around at 70 they simply don't care to utilize half of their skill kit. That's their choice, I accept it. (Heck, it's half the reason I play a healer so often is because then I know the healer will be as active as possible. The other half is because I enjoy it so much) It's clearly a better option to use the spare time to increase outgoing damage than to do literally nothing but wait.

I don't think we should be basing things off what you 'must' do but what you 'can' do. I try to improve my damage as a DPS and using the right mitigation skills at the right time for a tank as well, but there are plenty of people who won't and things will still work out just fine.

As for the games brought up, I understand there's no pure healers in a lot of them. A lot even have builds (In RO I played a semi battle cleric/support so I recall doing damage plenty). There's also MP limitations or simply not having the ability to damage certain creatures. But if you DO have the methods and ample opportunity, why wouldn't you take it? I imagine the answer is 'because I don't want to', which is definitely an answer although a pretty selfish one.

Hell I play a PLD. They're a tank. Do you know how many times I've healed someone else because both healers were dead or simply not paying attention? If I had the mindset that I should be doing my primary role then I should be using that MP to spam flash s'more. Then that person would be dead because while I had the means and the opportunity to assist, I decided 'nah'.

Same, been plenty of times in dungeons as a paladin or occasionally raids where the healer(s) were down. Or heck if one healer's down and the other has to hard cast a res to get healer 2 up I may toss out a clemency or two during that cast. Though if you're spamming flash to the point of running out of MP you're doing something wrong either way. Nobody needs THAT much aoe enmity and it would take a good while.

When I heal, which admittedly isn't that often, I like to throw out damage, just because a lot of the time I'd be bored. Pure healing for me, when things are going normal, is just boring. It's a lot more fun to say, throw excog on the tank, put up my dots, broil, miasma 2, shadowflare then touch up the tank if he needs it during a dungeon pull than to just spam heals. I can understand a new healer needing to give it their full attention until they get used to the role. Or when things hit the fan, especially in raids, needing to spend more time healing and raising etc. But in general when things are going well? I'm bored out of my mind if I just heal.