Baldesion Arsenal and new ToS Combo

[Eloah]

First, let me state, I have not done Eureka. As more of a solo player I was unable to get into it, plus I am not a Zerger. That being said however, I feel...

SE cannot change their Terms of Service and then create an environment that perpetuates continuous infractions against the players knowledge. I'll try and explain.

Basically, I watched this video on YouTube by Meoni talking about the recent issues with the Baldesion Arsenal and the portals needed to enter it. There are two sides, premade who wish to do the dungeon with other premade, and solo players who just want to try the dungeon. Both sides are right and yet both are wrong too.

On the one hand the premade players are entering Hydatos and basically shouting that this is "their" instance, and join up with other premades to defeat the NM that spams the portals. They then divide the map and head towards specific portals. Then once the portals are stabilized they enter them, maybe. On the other side there are the solo/pug players who will see a portal and click on it when it stabilizes, regardless of someone camping out or not.

Both are effectively forms of "sniping". The premades don't have the right to claim an entire instance as there own. Nor do the solo/pug players have the right to steal a portal from someone who was waiting there first. But thanks to the new ToS both could be punished for doing nothing at all. Both could claim the portal was "sniped" but the other might not even have been aware. And that presents a serious issue.

One of the things mentioned in the video is how someone reset an NM to prevent portal spawning. Now alone that is a douchey move, but why did he do it, regular troll, solo/pug not wanting the premades to get the portals, or a premade buying time for everyone to get into place? Yes he'll probably be punished, but why? SE created that environment in the first place.

What are other peoples thoughts on this? I have no issues with the new ToS, yet, but you can't create an environment that is contradictory to the rules you've laid out.

[ElazulHP]

I personally like going to pre-made route you're more likely to either succeed or at least get farther into BA, but playing devil's advocate here Public dungeon means nobody really owns the portals. Meaning first come first serve imo. TBH I wish they would just remove the limit on number of players entering so the entire instance can theoretically join. Or at least make it so one party uses one portal. Granted this could destroy the balance of the dungeon, but worth it imo when considering how much toxicity is surrounding this topic atm.

[Krojack]

Short answer to all this is, no one owns anything. pre-mades don't own the instance or portals nor do solo people. It's first come first serve. No one can report no one else for so called portal sniping.

That said, if someone is already standing next to a portal waiting for it to go red, don't be a jerk and take it.

[Myon88]

That said, if someone is already standing next to a portal waiting for it to go red, don't be a jerk and take it.

This is true, and it never feels good to have a stare down with someone for 5 minutes next to a portal. However, consider the fact that the only reason many people get there 'first' is because they abandon the Ovni fate early once they're certain they'll get gold, often as high as at 50% hp. You can be on the other end of the map and you will still get credit and the portal buff.

Sometimes, this causes the fate to reset if it tries to target a faraway player with the rock aoe, wasting everyone's time. It's also just plain rude in general as you're fobbing off the work to complete the fate to the rest of the players. If everyone behaved like this to get to the portals 'first', the fate would not get done at all and no one would get to go in.

Given that you can't guarantee that someone at the portal before you was as courteous as you, the unfortunate reality is that you have to assume everyone is potentially guilty. I'd say you're fully justified in competing for a portal with someone who only got there first because of greed. I would expect no different from a latecomer to my portal if I were there first. It logically follows that the only outcome is that all portals are fair game regardless of who arrived there when. It's not pretty, and it'll cause a lot of bad faith between players, but I cannot fault people for acting in their best interest when it is the system to blame for creating discord.

[LeoLupinos]

What's the real problem into starting a pre-made at the BA discord and stop screwing others attempt to clear BA? The guide is there, the video is there. Why keeping defending solo players that don't understand that "claiming" the instance is the only way to clear BA with proper organization? That's 56 players. That's a full lack of respect for others imo. The BA discord is OPEN for everyone, and nobody will get the clear screwing others pre-made attempts.

Do anyone need ToS to follow common sense and help others? I don't.

[Alucard135]

The thing is, premades go through a lot to organize and make sure their parties are in the instance. And if someone deliberately takes a portal from one of them, he literally may cause the group to wipe if it was against AV or Ozma. So many times I've heard that one sniped a healer's spot or a tank's spot (and good luck doing the rooms if you don't have 6 tanks). What's the point of going with a group of 50+ that don't even want you with them? Of course mistakes can happen and that's fine.

And furthermore, you rarely see a group attempt BA when there isn't a premade group in the instance. So should it be OK for someone to disrupt the group that spent a lot of time organizing just so that they can do the dungeon with people that don't want them? without them, the snipers wouldn't bother going into BA to do it. At least the premades would leave the instance if another group is there and won't forcefully try to take it.

Here's a sad story that happened to my group. We were the support group and our BLM portal got sniped by a WAR. And that WAR was alone with Cure logograms and barely helped in killing AV and Ozma and got the mount. While our BLM that was waiting for hours got nothing.

[Celef]

What's the real problem into starting a pre-made at the BA discord and stop screwing others attempt to clear BA? The guide is there, the video is there. Why keeping defending solo players that don't understand that "claiming" the instance is the only way to clear BA with proper organization? That's 56 players. That's a full lack of respect for others imo. The BA discord is OPEN for everyone, and nobody will get the clear screwing others pre-made attempts.

Do anyone need ToS to follow common sense and help others? I don't.

Yes you are right, we should not allow peons to walk the BA alongside the elite.
I mean, come one, why on earth do they want to do the content now, when it's alive ? Can't they just wait for it to be dead to try and get that mount ?!

[LeoLupinos]

Yes you are right, we should not allow peons to walk the BA alongside the elite.
I mean, come one, why on earth do they want to do the content now, when it's alive ? Can't they just wait for it to be dead to try and get that mount ?!

Can't they group up on the BA discord? Come one, they created a amazing tool for organization but no, the neanderthal way is the best, invade the BA and expect to get carried, and blame the people that are striving to get the clear.

It's like as if the BA discord is a complete secret and selective group that only accepts players that cleared Ultimate.
It's easy to group up there. Don't invade others BA just because you can.
If the game allowed you do invade others savage pre-made like BA would it be right? No? Then why invading BA is right? It's not.

[KaivaC]

Can't they group up on the BA discord? Come one, they created a amazing tool for organization but no, the neanderthal way is the best, invade the BA and expect to get carried, and blame the people that are striving to get the clear.

It's like as if the BA discord is a complete secret and selective group that only accepts players that cleared Ultimate.
It's easy to group up there. Don't invade others BA just because you can.
If the game allowed you do invade others savage pre-made like BA would it be right? No? Then why invading BA is right? It's not.

I agree that the BA discord was a good idea for tackling the BA. The community knows how to come together to overcome challenges such as this public dungeon. But vice-versa, not everybody can or wants to create a discord account, and some players coming into Hydatos currently may not even be aware because they may not follow the various resources online like we do. The center of the problem is that SE created something and did not anticipate that there would be massive problems, especially given the limitations (only 56 players in a 114 max instance) and the heavy penalty for failing. I agree, those players who are aware of premades for BA and/or lack basic etiquette are a pain in the rear to deal with and perhaps they deserve the anger if they snipe.

But not everyone falls under that scope.

[Celef]

Can't they group up on the BA discord? Come one, they created a amazing tool for organization but no, the neanderthal way is the best, invade the BA and expect to get carried, and blame the people that are striving to get the clear.

It's like as if the BA discord is a complete secret and selective group that only accepts players that cleared Ultimate.
It's easy to group up there. Don't invade others BA just because you can.
If the game allowed you do invade others savage pre-made like BA would it be right? No? Then why invading BA is right? It's not.

They are different reasons that can make someone not getting on discord, the obvious one beeing the langage.
for some of us, english is not a mother tongue and joining a discord can be very difficult considering it's easier to understand a sentence when it's written (we can re read it several times) than to get what others a saying (may be beaucse of accent, expressions taht are only used when spoke etc etc).

I'll take myself, a "baguette du fromage", as an exemple : I can read english, no problem (except with some shortcut) and I think my writing is not THAT bad, people usually understand me but I have real issues when i speak with Americans cause they speak very fast and tend to "eat" some words. On the other hand, I can easely understand someone from the UK because their prounonciation is more clear to my ear.

Does that mean I'll never have a chance to get into BA because of that ? caus if I join the discord :
1. If they ear speak, they'll just loose their focus with my accent ^^"
2. I'll need the RL to repeat very slowly what he says because I might not be abble to catch it the first time