Thread: Post mortem on relics from 4.0

Originally Posted by Lambdafish

I would challenge someone to tell me that atma, anemos books, or crafted turn ins are better than Eureka

They are ALL better than Eureka for the simple fact that they don't last the entire Relic cycle. Were they a massive pain? Yes. Did they over stay their welcome? Absolutely. But don't confuse the scale with the content itself; there is nothing wrong with FATE farming, in moderation; there is nothing wrong with the books, in moderation; and there is nothing wrong with crafted turn-ins, in moderation.

There would also have been little wrong with Eureka, in moderation. But Eureka isn't just one instance; just one grind to get through; it's a series of instances, each of them their own grind, but also each of them largely the same (grind trash mobs to spawn NMs), and each one gated behind the last. Throw in the fact that Eureka is unfriendly to friend groups (i.e. no party level-sync, no reason to return to older instances), works best with a large population (i.e. will only get worse as the population lowers), and is entirely irrelevant to the rest of the game (i.e. can't do anything else while doing Eureka), and yes, it is absolutely the WORST Relic (i.e. 'casual' long term grind) content FFXIV has ever had.

Originally Posted by Reynhart

There definitely was something wrong with Tomestones items, because farming tens of thousands of them was far from moderation.

While it was excessive for the 2.0 relics, it was still your prerogative to farm tomestones not in moderation. SE isn't at fault for any player intention of wanting to farm nonstop, and it's because devs know that players would do that is why we have tomestone caps in the first place.

Originally Posted by Reynhart

Contradictory statement, since older zones sync your elvl, so it's a great way to do your challenge log with friends even if your level is way higher.

Except too much of a level difference means your friends wouldn't get any kill credit.

Originally Posted by Reynhart

The scaling makes NM in low populated instances as easy to pop and kill, if not easier

Last time I checked, like all other fates, it's passive scaling. What that means is that the fate is spawned with predetermined parameters based on either the number of people inside the instance or an escalating value set with each spawn until the fate being incomplete resets those values to baseline levels. In other words, it's only easier in either fresh instances or if absolutely everyone in the instance is participating, and even then there's no guarantee if it'd be easier.

Active scaling is what happens in games like WoW where enemies scale their values mid-fight, and what too many people playing this game think of when they hear the word "scaling". FFXIV servers are nowhere near responsive enough for that.

Originally Posted by Reynhart

Eureka is the fastest way to cap your tomestone each week, and also a good way to make gils since you can sell lots of new items on the market board

This goes back to the whole "moderation" thing. Anyone that can run Eureka can just as easily do an expert roulette once a day (maybe craft or gather while waiting in the DPS queue) and cap out before the week's over. But again, it's your prerogative to farm things not in moderation.

Also helps to factor in that this thread is about the relic weapon--a high-end weapon originally stated to be for casual players--locked by intentionally casual-unfriendly content.

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

The zone is filled with people doing relic .

See this issue with this argument. The zone holds, what...150 ppl? And that is for a whole data center. So you cant really tell how many ppl are doing it without knowing how many instances are active. 150 ppl for 10+ servers isn't really good to go by. Esp since when I was still doing Eureka I would often leave after an hour or so, eat and reenter the exact same instance. That doesn't make it seem like a whole lot of them are up at once.

This is by far the laziest argument and the one that is easiest to poke holes in. We need much more concrete data than "This one zone is full" and last I read from the unofficial census its only like 9% or even less, active subs that have gotten even a Pyros weapon which is significantly lower than the ARR and SB versions which I believe were over 40% and 30% respectively, while still current.

4.0 relic seemed very meh to me. IMO the worst relic so far and it has increased queue times for all other content.

It simply comes down to not everyone is going to like how A B or C relic is made. Just cause you don't like how one or the other relic weapons are made doesn't mean other people don't. Hopefully they keep on changing the way relics are made so different people can enjoy the different ones. Remember this game has bunch of people playing it and not everyone is going to like doing every single thing in the game. Do what you like and leave other things you don't like to others that do.

It's an mmo it doesn't revolve around a single player or group. There are tons of different kinds of players and different content the appeals to different people.

Originally Posted by AnimaAnimus

See this issue with this argument. The zone holds, what...150 ppl? And that is for a whole data center. So you cant really tell how many ppl are doing it without knowing how many instances are active. 150 ppl for 10+ servers isn't really good to go by. Esp since when I was still doing Eureka I would often leave after an hour or so, eat and reenter the exact same instance. That doesn't make it seem like a whole lot of them are up at once.

This is by far the laziest argument and the one that is easiest to poke holes in. We need much more concrete data than "This one zone is full" and last I read from the unofficial census its only like 9% or even less, active subs that have gotten even a Pyros weapon which is significantly lower than the ARR and SB versions which I believe were over 40% and 30% respectively, while still current.

Don´t spread missinformation pls.

Originally Posted by swiss_Momo

sooo, the latest Lucky Bancho Lodestone census is out, this time including some numbers for Eureka. According to those, the number of active players per region that have started Eureka is:
58,8% JP
41,4% NA
44,2% EU

and the number of active players that have reached the Pyros level cap of 50 is:
18,6% JP
5,8% NA
7,3% EU

Originally Posted by HiroesX81

You forgot the part where anima was only done by 9.15% by March 2017.