Regarding the Revision of the Prohibited Activities and Account Penalty Policy

[PharisHanasaki]

Clearly, you still do not understand what I am talking about here (morals and morality). This is the last thing I have to say to you on this topic.

GMs have protocols. While I've only heard of one unfair case of warning (a friend character's name was in Spanish and google translate decided to translate it wrong?) I haven't heard of many unfair bannings. Mostly unfair outcomes where people should have been warned/banned but couldn't due to the old ToS.

The FFXIV team has tried to tell us they do not agree with NA standing on some things, like newbies geeting kicked from MSQ duties for watching cutscenes. Where they forced EVERYONE to watch them. Sadly, in the west we have a sense of individuality where we try to be the best and to impose our views on others, like playing a certain way or another. They always ask for proof, and i'm sure people who report a lot get warned for misuse or just ignored (I know of one case).

[Jaywalker]

Hi Mr. Murouichi,

I'm pretty new to the FFXIV community, and if this has been mentioned already my apologies! I've seen people get very worried that with the severity of penalties to players and some uncertainty regarding rule interpretation. Most of the worries I've seen have been concerns about censorship, jokes among friends being punished, a risk of oversensitive individuals gaining authority, and similar. I can understand wanting to ensure the community is happy and healthy, but I have seen non-jrpg communities become so heavily policed by sensitive staff or fans that it created an atmosphere of fear that ultimately killed the following.

Are there any measures in place to make sure that there are not abuses of power like this? If there aren't measures in place, would the team be open to implementing them? Additionally, would it be possible for players to clarify uncertainties regarding what would and would not be punishable under the rules?

I normally wouldn't be worried with FFXIV (the fans and team both seem pretty reasonable), and even as I ask these questions I'm not hugely alarmed. I've seen this trend happen many times before though and unfortunately it seems like a real risk.

[Anselmet]

And the Golden Rule applies differently to different people.

Different cultures have different ways of treating individuals; they have different standards. They may coincide with your own, or they may not. So, whose culture are we following here? Mine? Yours? Japan’s? America’s? England’s?


It’s narrow-sighted of you to try and apply your logical skills, your reasoning skills, and your version of “the Golden Rule” to other people because we all don’t think the way you do. Just like they don’t think the way I do. Or the way another poster does. The irony of this is, is that you are all for others not “dictating” their opinions on other people when you are trying to “dictate” your mindset and way of thinking onto others.

This rule is unenforceable. You cannot just apply a blanket to people of different backgrounds, upbringings, cultures, and traditions and call it a day.

It's like the people who are for these rules cannot understand this. It's like they think that GMs are all robots with the same blue print of morals and standards. No guys just play nice! You'll be fine. It makes me wonder how long they have been on the internet because if rules can be abused ho boy are they gonna be! And personally, my morals and standards do not line up with the GM offices out of southern California!

[MistakeNot]

But what evidence have we that GMs can’t do their job right? I quite often see threads thanking GMs for their fair and balanced support. I’m sure with these changes they have more checks to go through before it goes to bans.

GMs are humans. Humans make mistakes. Humans can have bad days. Humans can be overworked and rushed.

I am sure that the GMs will do a good job most of the time.
I am also sure that mistakes will be made and innocent people will get punished. Not often, but sometimes. And when that happens there is no appeal, no way of removing the wrongful punishment from your record. No way of getting your account back if it was wrongfully terminated.

[Connor]

Do we have any evidence of people being banned unfairly yet? And maybe if they let us know a bit more about how they’re planning to do things it’d set peoples minds at ease.

I’ve said before but I genuinely don’t believe that the GM’s are going to ban a person’s account for something unreasonable. Like if one were to tell someone ‘I think your rotation might work better if you do X so you still have Y up for Z, which might help us beat the DPS check’, I’d be surprised if they then somehow got banned. There isn’t anything reasonable offensive in that sentence. Unless there’s some culture I’m unaware of where it’s considered extremely rude to make an entirely neutral statement lol.

If people are beginning to receive actual long-term bans for making reasonable statements or requests to others, then we have a problem. But until them, can’t we at least try and believe that the developers are trying to make the community a better place.

Whether you think it was a bad place to start with is a different argument entirely. And I can’t say anything substantial to this argument, because in my experience I’ve never seen any behaviour that was expressed or perceived as unacceptable. I’ve yet to see the parser person who drags on everyone’s DPS, nor have I ever come across a pure ice Mage. It’s even very rare for me to come across a pure healer that won’t do any DPS at all. But these are just my experiences

[NorthernLadMSP]

All I have to say is this. If the same people who hand out forum bans are the ones who will be handing out in-game bans, there's definitely a reason to be very worried.

[MorbolvampireQueen6]

Just add a silence system unless something goes really down hill aka stalk,harassment ,threat....

Ppl should be banned over opinion crashing or a view point nor over moral...

Personally i view morals as worthless that get in the way of growth

[Hamada]

But what evidence have we that GMs can’t do their job right? I quite often see threads thanking GMs for their fair and balanced support. I’m sure with these changes they have more checks to go through before it goes to bans.

http://support.na.square-enix.com/ru...5382&tag=forum
even with the ones people made you are not going to see them, because they can remove the threads because what is said here.

Others got banned off the forum wrongfully and that's more common then wrong in game bans.

Do we have any evidence of people being banned unfairly yet? And maybe if they let us know a bit more about how they’re planning to do things it’d set peoples minds at ease.

I’ve said before but I genuinely don’t believe that the GM’s are going to ban a person’s account for something unreasonable. Like if one were to tell someone ‘I think your rotation might work better if you do X so you still have Y up for Z, which might help us beat the DPS check’, I’d be surprised if they then somehow got banned. There isn’t anything reasonable offensive in that sentence. Unless there’s some culture I’m unaware of where it’s considered extremely rude to make an entirely neutral statement lol.

If people are beginning to receive actual long-term bans for making reasonable statements or requests to others, then we have a problem. But until them, can’t we at least try and believe that the developers are trying to make the community a better place.

Whether you think it was a bad place to start with is a different argument entirely. And I can’t say anything substantial to this argument, because in my experience I’ve never seen any behaviour that was expressed or perceived as unacceptable. I’ve yet to see the parser person who drags on everyone’s DPS, nor have I ever come across a pure ice Mage. It’s even very rare for me to come
across a pure healer that won’t do any DPS at all. But these are just my experiences

Banned off forums, banned off the game, and suspended unfairly, was there for it all. This ofc took place before these rules, that is why people are very worried now. I think it went, suspended for heated argument, then suspended longer for something with a parser, then banned from a curse word. I forget if the parser thing was the first or second one.

Another would be being banned (I am not sure if the full group got banned or what) I know someone on ps4 getting banned for being in a savage static, where the group kicked someone out of the static for blocking progress for the group due to not improving, and action was taken on the group because the person that got kicked complained they got kicked from parser harassment. (while this ps4 player got banned, I do not personally know the past infractions that made this one be a ban though)

In my view there is a strong disconnect on what the development team wants to enforce, and what the GMs actually do. I know another person (outside the 2 referenced above) who would talk about they would not even have bought this game if it was not for the forums and promising to improve from FFXI, needless to say they got disappointed and got hopes up. It is just the same result, just more chatter of "trying better" (I also love how gather bots get a free pass, despite years of reporting, while real players get banned because that GM on that day did not consider context for a complaint)

It's like the people who are for these rules cannot understand this. It's like they think that GMs are all robots with the same blue print of morals and standards. No guys just play nice! You'll be fine. It makes me wonder how long they have been on the internet because if rules can be abused ho boy are they gonna be! And personally, my morals and standards do not line up with the GM offices out of southern California!

talk on discord with said friends, can't mistakenly offend someone now.

But ya that is all there is to it, no more talking in game. Don't want to offend anyone then get hit with a "mistake" action that there is no way for an appeal. Then you just need 3 "mistakes" to get banned.

All I have to say is this. If the same people who hand out forum bans are the ones who will be handing out in-game bans, there's definitely a reason to be very worried.

^ this, especially with these new rules.

[Jellybums]

^^For real tho, people still gonna talk. Maybe not if they wanna stay in their comfort zones, which really why is talking in a civil/reasonable manner even out of one's comfort zone? Eighty some pages of push back on the rules, something wrong here.

[WaterShield]

^^For real tho, people still gonna talk. Maybe not if they wanna stay in their comfort zones, which really why is talking in a civil/reasonable manner even out of one's comfort zone? Eighty some pages of push back on the rules, something wrong here.

It appears that you haven't read any of the posts that contradict your views, if that is what you have to say.

People aren't upset because they don't want to "talking in a civil/reasonable manner". We are upset because of rules that are open to abuse.

Personally I'm exhausted of defending this from people who are unilaterally rejecting my opinion. It's clear that unless I fully accept your outlook, I am no longer welcome here. Which is just a shame.

I'm done with this community. Congratulations on becoming the same as every other community. Goodbye