Shadowbringers RDM Wishlist

[SaberMaxwell]

Edit: nevermind, forgot to account for the cost of not generating 11 mana from a Verslowspell. Maths should be fine now.

A Verslowspell is 310 potency, 11 mana, and a 50% chance that your next spell does 20 more potency and generates 3 more mana. Then the expected values for a Verslowspell are 320 potency and 12.5 mana.
Jolt is 250 potency and 6 mana.

In 9.76s (four 2.44s GCDs), your expected output for Jolt/Verfastspell > Verslowspell > Jolt/Verfastspell > Verslowspell is roughly 1140 potency and 37 mana generation.


An Enchanted Redoublement combo takes 10.08s (1.5s+1.5s+2.2s+2.44s+2.44s), spends a net 180 mana, refunds 35 mana, and does 2270 potency.

If we adjust the spellcasting phase for 10.08s, the spellcasting phase generates 38.21 mana and deals 1177.38 potency. The Enchanted Redoublement combo, complete through Scorch, does 1092.62 more potency at a cost of 128.21 mana (generates 180, refunds 35, shorts spellcasting mana generation by 3.21). Then the per-mana potency is 8.52.

A spell that costs 10 mana, does 400 potency, and guarantees a Verfastspell proc has an effective potency of 420 and mana cost of 7. Subtract the 310 potency that you would be doing anyway with a Verslowspell, and that's 110 potency at a cost of 18 mana (spend 10, miss out on generating 11, next spell generates 3 extra), which is a per-mana potency of 6.11.

Spends net 160 mana, unless I'm not considering something. Otherwise it looks like some sound calculations.

I do love talking RDM math though!

[Rongway]

Spends net 160 mana, unless I'm not considering something. Otherwise it looks like some sound calculations.

I do love talking RDM math though!

I had a few derps in the intermediate steps (e.g., I wrote 180 where it should have been 160, but I actually did the final calculation with 160). I'm going to blame it on this fever I developed this morning...

[SaberMaxwell]

I had a few derps in the intermediate steps (e.g., I wrote 180 where it should have been 160, but I actually did the final calculation with 160). I'm going to blame it on this fever I developed this morning...

Oof, yikes, I hope you get better D:

[Archwizard]

Vermedica - AoE Cure that costs 10 white mana

That's the concern I always have with suggestions like this. People have similarly suggested "HoT that costs or generates white mana, and DoT for black mana".

Heals and DoTs are not equally useful to a DPS, meaning such a spell would likely make the average of Verholy/Verflare casts more imbalanced.

And in this case, you haven't even proposed an opposing Black mana skill of equal value -- largely because such a skill doesn't actually exist.

Verwater - High potency Nuke maybe 400 that costs 10 White Mana triggers Verstone automatically

Or

Verblizzard - 400 potency uses 10 Black Mana automatically gives Verfire ready

Would be neat to use our manameters for certain spells.

The trouble is, you would only ever use such skills if you were near cap and wanted to immediately imbalance your Mana so you could cast Verholy and Verflare.
Ignoring for a moment that with these example values, in such a case you'd either effectively cost 1 Mana (for an extra GCD) or double-proc Verfire/stone:
This is a niche that is already covered by Enchanted Reprise, which would let you dump a little Mana when you're near cap to mulligan your values before your next combo.

[Archwizard]

Showerthought: It's entirely possible to satisfy the devs' intent for Displacement, while also removing Engagement and keeping players from backstepping off a cliff.

Corps-a-corps (40 sec CD): Rushes target and delivers an attack with a potency of 130.
Cannot be executed while bound.
Additional effect: Action becomes Displacement after activation
Duration: 10 sec
--> Trait - Enchanted Corps-a-corps: Potency increases to 200 if both Black Mana and White Mana are at 75 or more.

Displacement: Delivers an attack with a potency of 130.
Additional Effect: Returns caster to origin point of Corps-a-corps
Cannot be executed while bound.

I've also been experimenting with ideas to combine aspects of Black and White Magic philosophy to create some unique utilities for RDM. For instance:

Ensorcel (2 min CD): Empowers the attacks of nearby allies to deal an additional 5% damage as unaspected damage.
Duration: 15 sec
Shares a recast timer with Embolden.

White Magic enhances but doesn't destroy, Black Magic destroys but is selfish with its elemental power. Combining the two creates not only RDM's very own En-spell but an alternative to Embolden; less maximum potential burst, but able to include caster allies. Sadly Contagion got removed or else adding magic damage would be worth a damn, but maybe we'll see a new debuff or buff for that later.

Phalanx (90 sec CD): Restores 10% HP to self and all nearby party members.
Additional Effect: Erects a magicked barrier which nullifies damage equaling the amount of HP restored
Duration: 20s

Intending to satisfy the craving for an oGCD Medica effect by combining it with Manaward to create a pseudo-Succor effect. Thanks to the barrier and cooldown, you'll be encouraged to save it for when it will be most useful rather than just spamming it to save healers MP.

En-Garde (2 min CD): Creates a barrier that reflects half the damage of one incoming attack.
Duration: 10 sec
Additional effect: Resets the recast timer on Contre-Sixte if the barrier is consumed without reflecting damage.

Combining White Magic's ability to protect with Black Magic's destructive ability to create a counter-based personal defense.

[Zyneste]

Showerthought: It's entirely possible to satisfy the devs' intent for Displacement, while also removing Engagement and keeping players from backstepping off a cliff.

I just don't think that solution is feasible for returning you back to Corps. Have an even easier one though. Just move Engagement to level 40, so you get it at the same time as displacement. Have Displace Naturally have 200 potency.

I'd take any OGCD support at this point TBH, but I feel as RDM we should be focused on single target Healing/Mitigation, even on the OGCD. We can't ever really step into the party wide line outside of addle or we start to infringe on Ranged DPS territory. As a personal nitpick I'd rather not have any skill that affects the RDM's Damage or DPS utility. If its mitigation or healing, it should be for the sake of the mitigation/healing. Not for the DPS boost. See Addle while Bahamut is out why this is bad.

You would have thought with the introduction of VerAero/VerThunder into Holy/Flare, they'd make VerAero II/Verthunder II into VerWater/VerBlizzard, to give us actual AOE upgrades since VAII/VTII can be just considered a class tweak and not part of the expansion. I was never a fan of them, but with the new way Holy/Flare work in button placement, theres no reason not to have them.

[Archwizard]

I just don't think that solution is feasible for returning you back to Corps.

Why not? BLM's Between the Lines ability runs on exactly the same principle, and the Verfinisher combo actions will similarly replace buttons for a limited window. All of the necessary components for implementation are already there.

[Zyneste]

Why not? BLM's Between the Lines ability runs on exactly the same principle, and the Verfinisher combo actions will similarly replace buttons for a limited window. All of the necessary components for implementation are already there.

Between the lines leaves an Area of effect on the ground. A visible buff with a timer as well. Its not user friendly going from Displacing from the boss to that random spot on the other side of the him 35+ yalms on a larger boss where you had Corpsed 10+ seconds prior.

Where did I corpse from again, inside or outside this aoe? Oh welp wrong choice there.

The way it functions now is fine. Engagement as a advance skill is where the problem is. If it was level 40, there wouldn't be an issue.

[Shurrikhan]

I just don't think that solution is feasible for returning you back to Corps. Have an even easier one though. Just move Engagement to level 40, so you get it at the same time as displacement.

Honestly, though... why give Displacement potency anyways, instead of just a shorter CD?

Or why not, say, put three charges between both Corps-a-corps and Displacement, each on a 20-second recast, each at 200 potency? You get 100 ppm regardless so long as you don't hold either skill for over a minute. Want in? Okay? Want out? Okay.

You don't need to include a purely bloat skill just to deal with an issue that doesn't need to be an issue in the first place.

As for Displacement's own functionality, I'd just give it and all other back-step skills a similar QoL change: when you hold/lock your camera, you go directly back towards your camera instead of purely back away from the target, to a maximum deviation of movement perpendicular from the target.

[Archwizard]

And every job could just have one button that says "Deals 10,000 potency damage, 1 minute cooldown" and every job would be less clunky.
You ask why people keep wanting a DoT, but why are you so against a DoT? What have DoTs ever done to you?

Honestly, the only defense I've seen for this position that I haven't been able to refute is that people... just... hate DoTs. And just don't want to admit that their opinions are their opinions. 'Cuz then we'd call BS.

And truth is, I totally get that. DoTs are tedious to manage; timers in general are stressful. And don't even get me started on multi-dotting.
RDMs don't have to fight against decaying resources or stances (just proc effects that are overly long for most purposes), and that's a fairly large part of the appeal. It's the reason I swapped to RDM off of BLM, 'cuz I didn't take the stress of having to fight the Enochian timer and the DoT and the boss at the same time very well.

Of course, RDM doesn't have an Enochian or Trance, and the DoT was only a pain for BLM 'cuz their GCD usage is so tight that even popping TC during AF was a loss -- not really RDM problems.
And most people don't seem to get that once you get into the swing of things, a DoT is basically no different behaviorally than a cooldown attack on the GCD. I mean, you generally lose damage as long as a CD goes unpopped (unless it has charges, then only when it's at max), just like you lose damage as long as a DoT remains off the target. Just a different spot on the screen to look at, and something you can't macro onto a "pop all oGCDs" button.

Between the lines leaves an Area of effect on the ground. A visible buff with a timer as well. Its not user friendly going from Displacing from the boss to that random spot on the other side of the him 35+ yalms on a larger boss where you had Corpsed 10+ seconds prior.

Where did I corpse from again, inside or outside this aoe?

Ignoring for a moment that nothing says those markers couldn't be added:

Still sounds preferable to the current iteration, where blindly pressing the button yeets you into the unknown, including off ledges or into exactly the same danger areas you're talking about.
At least in my proposal, you know where you jumped from was safe less than 10 (not 10+) seconds ago (same risk as Raising), and I doubt you'll be doing a 35+ yd jump if the target isn't actively being kited (since you had to cast and Corps within 25).

Unless you think it's harder to remember a relative location for up to 10 sec (more likely 5) than it is to gauge 15 yards on the fly?

Honestly, though... why give Displacement potency anyways, instead of just a shorter CD?

Or why not, say, put three charges between both Corps-a-corps and Displacement, each on a 20-second recast, each at 200 potency? You get 100 ppm regardless so long as you don't hold either skill for over a minute. Want in? Okay? Want out? Okay.

You don't need to include a purely bloat skill just to deal with an issue that doesn't need to be an issue in the first place.

As for Displacement's own functionality, I'd just give it and all other back-step skills a similar QoL change: when you hold/lock your camera, you go directly back towards your camera instead of purely back away from the target, to a maximum deviation of movement perpendicular from the target.

In case 1: because the devs want to compel you to actually use it. As we've discussed before, there is no DPS penalty for casting in melee range, so in a world where Displacement provides no DPS boon, it'll just be flat out ignored except for the rare occasions bosses have "point-blank death radius" or "someone stand here" mechanics. It would be treated as niche at best and bloat at worst, unless there becomes a reason it's preferable to cast at range.

I do love your charge-based proposal. However, I would be concerned with its interaction with Manafication, and once again, the erasure of Displacement if Corps-a-corps becomes a safer alternative.
The only real way I can think of to make that work would be to give Corps-a-corps a minimum range so you can't just point-blank it... and even then there's nothing stopping you from just Displacing and zipping back in the whole fight (not that there's anything preventing that now, I suppose), or depending on the range... just taking a step back and Corpsing.

But if anything, the number of proposals we've come up with in this thread show precisely your point, that a QoL adjustment to Displacement would have easily prevented Engagement from being made.