Thread: AST Wishlist for 5.0

Originally Posted by CorbinDallas

Delete the sects and double down on Astrologians actual unique gameplay hook, cards and buff manipulation.

Hybrids that fulfil more than a single type of gameplay can never be balanced and only narrow the design space for future jobs. With AST existing in it's current state, that of a "WHM/SCH with cards", Dancer has no chance of being remotely unique with it's own healing niche. It will need to have shields or regens to be viable.

The PvP version of Astrologian is my dream. The rapid casting, buffing machine. It doesn't need to take from the other 2 healers to be unique, the cards already do that.

Basically. It also makes them waaaaaaay too easy to compare. "WHM only has this-and-this, while WHMAST has this, this, AND this, why would you ever bring a WHM" etc etc. Tbh though a big part of what SE needed to do with HW was remove the necessity for SCH shields for prog content, so that any composition without a SCH could actually survive raid mechanics. AST was doomed to compete with either WHM or SCH if the devs didn't do what they did with the Sect crap, because frankly they didn't understand that bubbles being required to survive stuff is godawful healer design that seriously limits new healer creativity.

Originally Posted by Sebazy

As someone with perhaps more experience than many on this subject. Everquest had a crippling problem balancing Slow beyond it's first expansion. Unslowed bosses were effectively unhealable for more than a few seconds with more resilient bosses often warranting a literal meat pile of suicide tanks whilst it was slowed. Even higher level trash mobs could often be brutally dangerous without slow.

There's no denying that EQ went in with values that were far too high with the ability ending up like a bad drug addiction, but MMOs have steered well clear of that ever since. It's a shame as Everquest's debuff and CC game was actually one of the most interesting aspects of it's combat. But I highly doubt SE want to open that can of worms on EX/Savage content.

TLDR for this 2am ramble = Don't put any stock in getting a maintainable PvE slow.

I won't put stock in it, but that doesn't mean it can't work. Some jobs can already inflict slow in PvE iirc. The way I see the upkeep working is similar to NINs Huton. They need to keep this up in order to maximize their damage. If it does drop, their DPS is heavily penalized, but not to the point that they're no longer effective in combat. They just need to get it back up ASAP. PvE slow that is maintained should not be required to clear content by any means. It sounds to me this was the mistake Everquest made instead of balancing it for content. It would only reduce optimization if it is allowed to drop, or mechanics force it to drop.

I don't think we should look at things like, "It didn't work for this mmo, so it won't work for FFXIV." We should be looking at how to make certain changes work for FFXIV. Especially if they are favorable. I'm not saying PvE slow is one of those, but I am trying to think outside the box.

I'd want the regen and shields removed from AST, partly because they're just not why I play AST, and partly because I'm tired of the three healers bouncing around and everyone questioning their identity. In return, give me back my 10% AoE Balance and give me MORE viable buffing options. Hell, give me a WHOLE, second, debuff deck. When the job was being released I didn't care about sects and meshing with other healers I just loved the card mechanic and that's still my favorite part of it today.

Hide the regens, hide the shields, we buffin' errybody out here.

Originally Posted by LiliRune

I'd love to see a rework where cards become more of a resource, kind of like how Minor Arcana functions.

You draw cards more often, but have to use them to power your aspected abilities, and possibly a DPS ability as well. Keep the card buffs mostly how they are, but change the redraw time to 5 or 10 seconds or whatever and require a card to be in the draw slot to cast aspected benefic/helios, then consume the card on cast.

This would mean not only are there no worthless cards, as they are all ammo for casts, but it makes fishing for a specific card more reliable, and leaves you having interesting decisions like "do I burn this Balance for the heal I need now, or do I Spread it and have to delay my heal 5 seconds?" With some rebalancing it could also make a card like Bole more useful, as you would choose between a shield/regen or the longer mitigation.

Since cards are going to need at least a minor rework with the removal of TP, something like this would provide a great opportunity to diversify the cards we use, so we feel like less of a "Balance Vendor" while also helping us feel less like "WHM with cards."

For higher end players who avoid healing GCDs as much as possible, this breaks up the monotony of casting Malefic, and when worked into a DPS ability or 2 as well provides impactful decisions, such as deciding between a higher potency nuke, tempting fate with Minor Arcana to get a Lord, or giving the card buff to a DPS.

This I actually don't mind, the shields and regens are still available, but worked into their card mechanic, and gives you a choice between extra healing or extra rDPS.

Draw cooldown would have to be decreased a bit though, and perhaps the value of the card effects.

Originally Posted by Seraphor

This I actually don't mind, the shields and regens are still available, but worked into their card mechanic, and gives you a choice between extra healing or extra rDPS.

Draw cooldown would have to be decreased a bit though, and perhaps the value of the card effects.

Thank you! Card cooldowns would definitely need to be shorter and balancing done with potencies/effects, which really needs to happen anyway with TP going away. The other benefit with shorter CDs as I mentioned, was that you get more attempts to fish for a specific card for your situation, even if it's slightly less potent for balance.

You'd also have the majority of your kit untied to this, so you're not without options if you just burned a card, so it would possibly enhance instead of crippling high level play.

Originally Posted by LiliRune

Thank you! Card cooldowns would definitely need to be shorter and balancing done with potencies/effects, which really needs to happen anyway with TP going away. The other benefit with shorter CDs as I mentioned, was that you get more attempts to fish for a specific card for your situation, even if it's slightly less potent for balance.

You'd also have the majority of your kit untied to this, so you're not without options if you just burned a card, so it would possibly enhance instead of crippling high level play.

Only issue I see is coordinating with another AST.
Currently its easy to see what sect they're in and go with the opposite. With this you'd need to be careful not to waste cards by both going 'shield' at the same time.

As for the cards themselves, ive thinking:
Bole and Balance: Shields, same as nocturnal.
Spear and Arrow: Bonus 10% damage reduction.
Spire and Ewer: Regen, same as diurnal.

Speakibg of coordinating with other ASTs, i always find it annoying when my cards get overwritten.
So I though about having one sect have cards debuff enemies instead, and have included this in my own wishlist:

Astrologian

Nocturnal Aspected Helios and Benefic shields to have their potencies increased by 20% with Celestial Opposition or 40% with Time Dilation.

Benefic cast time reduced to 1.5s. (Same for all healers most basic heal)

New Spire effect: Reduces MP costs for target by 10%. (still thematically consistent with being paired with Ewer, but can be useful even if target isn't low on MP)

Celestial Opposition: Now inflicts Stop instead of Stun. Mechanically identical but with a different animation, and if enemy is immune to Stun it can instead inflict Heavy unless also immune to Heavy.

Sects effect cards: Current effects are present in Diurnal Sect, new effects for Nocturnal Sect target enemies instead of party.
Balance: Enemy deals 10% less damage for 15s.*
Bole: Enemy takes 10% more damage for 15s.*
Spear: Enemy cannot deal critical hits for 15s.*
Arrow: Enemy’s attack speed is reduced by 10% for 15s. *but certain special moves and phase changes are unaffected
Ewer: Inflicts a 50 potency DoT for 15s.*
Spire: Enemy suffers 10% of the damage they inflict on any party members for 15s.*

Gravity II: Deals damage to all enemies in range (no drop off) damage scales with targets current HP percentage.
Base potency of 150 plus a bonus of 200 that scales with targets HP%. So at max HP they would suffer 350 potency damage, at 50% HP they’d suffer 250 potency damage, and at 10% HP they’d suffer 170 potency damage.