I wish Gunbreaker would be a DPS class.

[Dualgunner]

But the primary purpose of those two jobs is to DPS. There are 7 other jobs whose purpose is to DPS.

I could argue the primary purpose of ranged dps is to provide resource support, damage support, and mitigation support, as both of them have reduced damage compared to other dps and (at least BRD) is basically mandatory in every group because of the sheer level of relief they bring, not the dps they bring.

Thus, new jobs whose primary purpose it is to tank and heal are a MUCH higher priority than ones to DPS.

Did I ever argue otherwise? My argument has always been "Saying DPS shouldn't get new jobs till 7.0 is silly just because melee dps are heavily represented already." I have accepted GNB as tank and fully expect DNC to be healer, and have been saying for the past year it'll be nice to see some more of those, but I hope they don't screw them up.

My issue comes up when people rally the party line of "DPS don't need any new jobs ever" because, while yes, there are only three tanks, the fact remains if I want to tank I have three options. If I want to be a damage focused caster, I only have three options. If I want to be a ranger, I only have two options. DPS isn't split into subroles for no reason, it's done because no matter how much you stretch it, the difference between Samurai and Black Mage is far greater than the difference between Dark Knight and Warrior. Meanwhile, Samurai and Monk make a far greater analogy to Dark Knight and Warrior because they're in the same subrole.

Now, the next DPS jobs (which will be at or close to 6.0) should most definitely be ranged physical, since they are the least represented OF the DPS jobs.

Glad we can agree on that at least.

[kikix12]

Actually, you said that I did in your post responding to him.

"Apples and oranges are juicy" doesn't mean that apples and oranges are juicy together but that either of them can be used to get juice. If I'd want the tanks and healers to be counted as one I'm pretty sure I should have used "with", as in, "tanks with healers" that actually pools them together.

Basically "There are cows, pigs and chickens on this place so it's a farm." means that those are things you find on a farm. But you can have a farm with only cows and pigs, for example. As it is, what I said was that they are in the same situation. Not that they are one and the same.

My issue comes up when people rally the party line of "DPS don't need any new jobs ever" because, while yes, there are only three tanks, the fact remains if I want to tank I have three options. If I want to be a damage focused caster, I only have three options. If I want to be a ranger, I only have two options.

If I want a magical tank I have zero options. If I want a melee healer I have zero options. If I want a ranged physical healer I have zero options. Except for ranged tank, all those are not present even though the game most certainly allows that. There is no reason why we should dismiss them as a possibility. You can tank with spells, heal at range by throwing potions or such and heal while attacking in melee. Square simply didn't go around to make such tanks and healers. In comparison, you have ranged DPS role. And I'm pretty sure that 2 is more than 0.

[Dualgunner]

"Apples and oranges are juicy" doesn't mean that apples and oranges are juicy together but that either of them can be used to get juice. If I'd want the tanks and healers to be counted as one I'm pretty sure I should have used "with", as in, "tanks with healers" that actually pools them together.

Basically "There are cows, pigs and chickens on this place so it's a farm." means that those are things you find on a farm. But you can have a farm with only cows and pigs, for example. As it is, what I said was that they are in the same situation. Not that they are one and the same.

There isn't as much yellow as there is purple and orange.

The meaning of the sentence can easily be misinterpreted as "There's count of yellow is less than the counts of purple and orange." If that's not the intention of your words, find better phrasing.

If I want a magical tank I have zero options. If I want a melee healer I have zero options. If I want a ranged physical healer I have zero options. Except for ranged tank, all those are not present even though the game most certainly allows that. There is no reason why we should dismiss them as a possibility. You can tank with spells, heal at range by throwing potions or such and heal while attacking in melee. Square simply didn't go around to make such tanks and healers. In comparison, you have ranged DPS role. And I'm pretty sure that 2 is more than 0.

This is an argument I will wholly cede to once we get a DoM tank that has its own unique cross role tree. Humorously enough, PLD and DRK are pretty magical tanks on their own; one with an entirely magical burst phase, and the other with an entire toolkit that revolves around their mana pool.

[Kaedan]

Ahh, I see. I thought this was the conversation about "ranged DPS being the most underrepresented".

[Lauront]

It's an issue that will arise whichever job they ad. Personally, I would have preferred a DPS GBR, but then again I also wanted DPS SAM (although in hindsight, I would certainly trade the two around. )

I think GBR will at least fit in with the tank gear sets. DNC, if it is a healer - and the likelihood IMO is that it will be - I am a bit more concerned about, because the healer sets are mostly robes or coats, with some tunics. None of these really fits such a job well, so it'll be stuck to using glamours. Still, it's not like striking sets are particularly well suited in general to SAM or MNK either generally speaking, yet they get by through job specific and level 1 glamours, so I am hoping that they will give it a nice set of job-specific outfits that can be glamoured on along with any generic glamours.

I'd have liked Chemist better as a healer, and DNC as a striking dps, but I'll wait to see what they come out with as it may end up surprising me and being very good.

[Seraphor]

If DNC were a dps, it'd have to be scouting. Weak physically, but quick and with plenty of debuffs, so it would compete with NIN.

[Taruru306]

Yes Gunbreaker always a DPS in Final Fantasy VIII imaging melee DPS LB3 with Gunbreaker doing Squall Lion Heart + Blasting Zone alike skill instead some tank shell in LBIII how stupid to put a gunbreak into a tank doing stupid shell..............

[BatLW]

Since there was a new Tank in SB, I wouldn't have minded to have the DNC be a Healer and the Gunbreaker be a DD. At least it wouldn't ruin Waiting Queues for Tanks because EVERYONE is now trying to play Tank - Which causes a problematic misbalance, since Tank's are less needed than DDs. (1 Tank / 2 DDs each group).

But I agree - The Limit Break for Gunbreaker should have been a Damage Limit, would also mix up the gameplay and class choices a bit. What the game needs is a better dynamic between the Tanks and what they can actually do - So you can actively CHOOSE what kind of Tank you need.

[Seraphor]

Well Tanks are essentially DPS classes now anyway.

[Kathryn]

Since there was a new Tank in SB, I wouldn't have minded to have the DNC be a Healer and the Gunbreaker be a DD. At least it wouldn't ruin Waiting Queues for Tanks because EVERYONE is now trying to play Tank - Which causes a problematic misbalance, since Tank's are less needed than DDs. (1 Tank / 2 DDs each group).

But I agree - The Limit Break for Gunbreaker should have been a Damage Limit, would also mix up the gameplay and class choices a bit. What the game needs is a better dynamic between the Tanks and what they can actually do - So you can actively CHOOSE what kind of Tank you need.

And what new tank did we get in "Stormblood" pray tell, iirc the last new tank class was DRK and that was in Heavensward.