SE: Please copyright takedown FFLogs.

[van_arn]

it's not going away

[Reimmi]

We're not talking about extremes though. We're talking about basic dungeons.

I dunno i've always felt that you should give your all in any content involving other players
being lazy just because the content is easy isn't an excuse, it wastes other peoples time
now if you're playing your best and you're still doing poorly, at least you're trying. that's good enough for me

[DumdogsWorld]

Using 3rd party tools is rather unique violation to the ToS. Most of the time, bad people who don't want to break the rules find ways to be bad without breaking them. There are so many ways to be toxic in this game without violating ToS. When it comes to 3rd party tools, however, everything seems to be the opposite - you can be the nicest person in the world, but if you talk about parsing in-game, then....yeah.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, it's against the ToS whether people want to admit it or not. Sure, it's not enforced when you keep your mouth shut, but that just makes it a classic example of the "it's not illegal if you don't get caught" fallacy. I'm not condemning the use of parsers, however, whatever the ToS may say. But, as with any situation where you're on the wrong side of the rules, you gotta lack any toxicity and be super considerate of other people in order to get away with it.

[NessaWyvern]

Parsing had improved my experience in this game a lot because now I can tell when I'm doing alright and when I'm not.

Parsing helped me in this game, but in another way. I am a healer main who was uncomfortable as a dps. I ran suzaku ex on my RDM, since the healer slots were taken, and someone was parsing. The parse they posted showed that I was at the top 20% for RDM on suzaku, and that was a real confidence boost, and now I adore playing RDM

[Shurrikhan]

For that matter, if everyone is performing well, a dancer isn't needed at all.

The value of a Dancer, as with any job with indirect contribution, improves with party performance.

And even then the indirect damage contribution does exactly no more or less, number per number, than direct contribution. If you do 7k yourself and only add a further 3k via the party, you're still doing no more than any 10k SAM or BLM.

The only real difference is that you can better be carried by your party the more you contribute indirectly.

[NebulaStarsong]

I believe in having fun with what you do, as long as you helping while having fun, it should be ok. I do not like the fact that someone uses my name without my permission, but it's good to see where things are at times. That aside, you can tell when someone is having fun, they're putting in more damage, more work and is doing it according to them and not to someone else telling them how to do what they do. This is what I like to see more of, not "Do this or you suck and fail because I'm better then you" kind of bull. I don't think the site will go down but if people use it for ill reasons then it does give it a bad name. If you do poor, get kicked. If a site says you do poor, get kicked. How will anyone get better or get good, if they're not even allowed to get better or get good at a dungeon, if they're not welcomed into one? Just poor excuses to use a site. The site itself wouldn't be the problem, if this was the case, just the people that use it would be the problem, that are doing this to you.

[SturmChurro]

The value of a Dancer, as with any job with indirect contribution, improves with party performance.

And even then the indirect damage contribution does exactly no more or less, number per number, than direct contribution. If you do 7k yourself and only add a further 3k via the party, you're still doing no more than any 10k SAM or BLM.

The only real difference is that you can better be carried by your party the more you contribute indirectly.

Dancer is honestly kind of fluff. It makes other people feel better though. It depends on who your partner is, I've been partnered with people where I will still be doing more. A good dance partner can pull some serious dps. Generally though, yeah a team who knows how to use their skill set can better utilize dancer utility. It all evens out in the end, dancer or no dancer.

If you want to play physical ranged I'd probably just play a machinist honestly. Leveling mine up currently. Luckily I can wear my geared dancer stuff on it.

Thinking about it, I suppose you are right to an extent. I was more coming from the perspective that a good dancer isn't needed - if you are an above-average player. As a below-average player, you can at the very least passively contribute. An above average player is probably better off playing a regular class, and you might get a dancer to boost you! Rather I think we both meant the same thing, just worded it completely differently.

[Tinibou]

On one hand I agree with the OP about the toxicity FF Logs bring.
But if some people want to use it, they should be able to.

Tips : update the description of your character profile on the Lodestone and put "fflogs-hidden" then no one will be able to check on FF Logs your logs and you won't be bullied or what by the toxic players

[HyoMinPark]

That's because WHM is completely busted currently and SE has decided it is WHM's turn to dominate after AST and SCH did. In other words they can't come to any balance decision that works. That's also why Dancer wasn't a healer and you know it.

This has nothing to do with what I said.

[Lunavi]

The one part I do agree on is that it is VERY terrible that you have to sign up to their website to opt out of it. I would be 100% fine with the site if it was opt in. I am very very concerned of the reason why they chose to do it like that, which is why I really dislike it as that just makes it obvious what the true reason for its existence is, which isn't a positive one.