SE: Please copyright takedown FFLogs.

[Videra]

Anyone want some popcorn? Because this thread is a pretty solid salt shaker.

[Osmond]

This site breeds toxic communities like The Balance and elitists mindsets. It also uses job and ability symbols ripped from the game files and profits on SE copyrighted content through advertising. It's also constantly used to name and shame players. Use of the website also requires use of third party tools that break the games ToS. What's worst is that one must make an account and forcibly opt out in order to be excluded from the site.

SE, please take advantage of the site owner's legal liability and force him to immediately take down his toxic website. It is an affront to everything stood for in this great community

The dev team already known about the issue for few years. You have to prove that someone that does it in order to make your claim true. The other is the word, "toxic". I've come to notice that the ones who said these words as extreme..somewhat tends to be the same person that is toxic in person. Everything is toxic nowadays.

[Osmond]

Parse programs is nothing more than a double-edged feature. It can help players get better at their job, it can help their friend improve on their job, it can help newcomers improve their job. The other is that it brings the worst in people. Some want a certain range in DPS for their group they create. Some demand a few wins on your character. There are those who do win, but could be "carried". It just a touchy subject for this game and I can get why they won't have their own personal parse made in house. Yet, even if fflogs were pretty much hit w/ the C&D and it goes for good, the "toxic" community will still exist with or without fflogs. They'll still figure out at some point that you still bad at DPS or the job you play.

[HyoMinPark]

going to the website is proof enough, your parsing numbers are being displayed with-out the players consent and IS against the TOS espically the way it is being used to shame other players. I had already given SE the website address about a month ago,showing it is displaying each charter data without there conscent to other players. Unknown if it will be taken down, but t he site should be removed and the website administrator should be punished for this infraction.

SE is well aware FFLogs exists, and if they were going to do something about it, they would have already. It's unlikely they ever will, because shutting it down would just cause another, similar website to appear in its place. It's better to deal with the devil you know than one you don't.

And how is it being used to shame players? I don't see this proof you claim to have, as simply displaying a number on a website isn't harassment.

[Jin-]

Can't find my character :S

[Lambdafish]

This threads existence is more toxic than its subject matter. Get over yourself op

[redcurrant18]

If people want to use that kind of site, by all means I have no problem with that since its their business. I'm not into hardcore raiding or worrying about numbers since for me, that takes the fun out of the game.

[Ash_]

The issue of not having an opt-in/opt-out feature and capturing personal data might be more of a legal issue in some parts of the world and more likely to land the site in trouble, such as the EU where privacy laws are now much tougher. It's the reason we are now asked on just about every site if we accept cookies and having our clicks tracked, to every mailing list requiring your express permission to be on their list, and the right to be forgotten laws. But it's a grey area when it comes to FFlogs, as it doesn't identify you personally, but your character. It could however be argued your character name is your personal online ID, and your personal data is being captured and stored without permission. I've always thought if someone made a complaint in EU, the site probably wouldn't survive as it is.

[KaivaC]

The issue of not having an opt-in/opt-out feature and capturing personal data might be more of a legal issue in some parts of the world and more likely to land the site in trouble, such as the EU where privacy laws are now much tougher. It's the reason we are now asked on just about every site if we accept cookies and having our clicks tracked, to every mailing list requiring your express permission to be on their list, and the right to be forgotten laws. But it's a grey area when it comes to FFlogs, as it doesn't identify you personally, but your character. It could however be argued your character name is your personal online ID, and your personal data is being captured and stored without permission. I've always thought if someone made a complaint in EU, the site probably wouldn't survive as it is.

The problem is that, your character is NOT your personal data. It is a SE policy. So players asking for SE to file a lawsuit on their behalf is asinine at best, not to mention that all it would do is far more harm than good. The easiest solution - if you don't raid or intent to raid, then what exactly is the point of you having it? Just hide your logs and boom, problem solved. You have SSS if you want to know if you're hitting good DPS (and given that a lot of people cannot beat the Alphascape Savage v4.0 dummy without their chocobo or pots, that's a good goal to go after if they really want to know how their DPS measures up without logs).

[Ash_]

The problem is that, your character is NOT your personal data.

The character itself isn't. The name of the character could be construed as being however your online identifier, and if the collected information can in anyway link back to identifying the user, then that makes it more at risk of being in breach of privacy laws. Ultimately it depends on the territory where a complaint is/if it were made, and the application of that territory's laws. Again it's a grey area, and it's up to the site owners to gauge what the risk is. I know the USA has non-existent privacy laws, but the rest of the world is quite strict in this area.

Also, just hiding logs wouldn't be sufficient in many places, including the EU. If you request all of your data to be deleted from existence, then that service must legally comply. In fact, in many places it is illegal to collect any kind of user information, whether it identifies people or not, without permission including in Aus.