(Spoilers) Ghimlyt difficulty was a step down from the Burn...and that needs to stop

[Bright-Flower]

The Burn wasn't really all that tough. Mist Dragon is a bit tougher than most dungeon end bosses I'll admit, but not by all that much.

[Noitems]

The Burn as a dungeon itself was fairly normal the Mist Dragon does trip people up (Even now with me and my positioning sometimes).

I'd like SE to take the idea of G.Dark (varied mobs doing different attacks similar to what we see at midbosses) but mix it with the same difficulty as the Mist Dragon the whole way through.

People would struggle with it first thing but I think it's a great way to get people aware of what they're doing and give people some experience into what EX/Savage content can lead into. But obviously people will adpat and learn and that will lead into the best stuff overall.

We've all gotten used to the idea of picking a bunch of mobs and mowing through them at one spot. I'd like the danger of more focused mechanics while we do it. Something to spice up our daily runs past people new people not knowing mechanics.

[Jandor]

The Burn wasn't really all that tough. Mist Dragon is a bit tougher than most dungeon end bosses I'll admit, but not by all that much.

Yeah pretty much this.

I will add though that I find the Burn just generally rather annoying to tank, those giant ass mobs pushing each other everywhere.

Ghimlyts person sized mobs are bliss in comparison.

[Yeol]

What are my current benefits from dungeons?
- Leveling.
- Learning/Practicing a job.
- Tome stones.
- Grand company seals.
- Glamour.

The reward is not worth the effort.

If I'm gonna run expert everyday for my weekly tomes, I'd rather have the dungeons be 'fun' than hard.
Nice music, visuals, mechanics is what matters to me personally when it comes to dungeons. It's something I like to do while chilling.

I do agree that there is an issue with having easy only content, it does not help players improve.

Best thing SE can do is make solo content a bit harder (MSQ & job quests). Let players run into that wall where they have to retry the quest multiple times until they get it right. The key word here is solo, so the players can take their time to learn. No need to wait for queues or feel the pressure of failing multiple times in a party. In the end, everyone is going to clear MSQ & job quests thanks to echo buff.

[Sandpark]

I do agree that there is an issue with having easy only content, it does not help players improve.

Best thing SE can do is make solo content a bit harder (MSQ & job quests). Let players run into that wall where they have to retry the quest multiple times until they get it right. The key word here is solo, so the players can take their time to learn. No need to wait for queues or feel the pressure of failing multiple times in a party. In the end, everyone is going to clear MSQ & job quests thanks to echo buff.

No though you are entitled to your on opinion. The last thing a company should do is increase the barrier for entry or difficulty in the main story. The MSQ is where most content is unlocked. It's bad enough people have to wait on queues, sometimes a long time. Playing XI some content was considered too hard for standard players, some of the genkai quest(mostly solo job quest) had some players quitting the game due to frustration. Half of the player base did not even get to through the CoP expansion which was not even the difficult endgame content locked behind it, until it was nerfed to high heaven years later.

If they want their main target demographic to be bleeding edge difficulty they could do that but I doubt it. For side content they can make content give headaches, vitriol, finger gymnastics, twitch reflexes, content so hard it makes babies bleed. But keep that away from the MSQ.

[Yeol]

No though you are entitled to your on opinion. The last thing a company should do is increase the barrier for entry or difficulty in the main story. The MSQ is where most content is unlocked. It's bad enough people have to wait on queues, sometimes a long time. Playing XI some content was considered too hard for standard players, some of the genkai quest(mostly solo job quest) had some players quitting the game due to frustration. Half of the player base did not even get to through the CoP expansion which was not even the difficult endgame content locked behind it, until it was nerfed to high heaven years later.

If they want their main target demographic to be bleeding edge difficulty they could do that but I doubt it. For side content they can make content give headaches, vitriol, finger gymnastics, twitch reflexes, content so hard it makes babies bleed. But keep that away from the MSQ.

Just to be clear I'm not asking for a sudden big spike in difficulty.
What we have now is like you're running the game on beginner mode. I'm asking to rise it to a normal difficulty.

Don't forget the echo buff which increases you HP and attack if you continue to fail. The players will not get stuck and left behind.

[Sandpark]

Just to be clear I'm not asking for a sudden big spike in difficulty.
What we have now is like you're running the game on beginner mode. I'm asking to rise it to a normal difficulty.

Don't forget the echo buff which increases you HP and attack if you continue to fail. The players will not get stuck and left behind.

Is the later MSQ dungeons all really challenging? Not really. But it is far from beginner mode. Beginner Mode is A Realm Reborn Dungeons particularly the early, early ones.

HW on is more liked veteran dungeons or what you call normal difficulty. Good amount of mechanics.
Hard is normal difficulty but different locale and mechanics, but still normal difficulty.
Extreme is above normal difficulty, introduction to higher difficulty.
Savage is a step above that.
Ultimate is the highest difficulty.

Extreme onwards will come later. Final Steps/Shinryu/Burn vanilla skipped the process of having a normal mode even though they were called normal, and got ninja nerfed later. I don't want them skipping tiers of difficulty.

Are you asking for the omitting of normal mode?
If so starting in hard? Starting in extreme?

[Yeol]

Is the later MSQ dungeons all really challenging? Not really. But it is far from beginner mode. Beginner Mode is A Realm Reborn Dungeons particularly the early, early ones.

HW on is more liked veteran dungeons or what you call normal difficulty. Good amount of mechanics.
Hard is normal difficulty but different locale and mechanics, but still normal difficulty.
Extreme is above normal difficulty, introduction to higher difficulty.
Savage is a step above that.
Ultimate is the highest difficulty.

Extreme onwards will come later. Final Steps/Shinryu/Burn vanilla skipped the process of having a normal mode even though they were called normal, and got ninja nerfed later. I don't want them skipping tiers of difficulty.

Are you asking for the omitting of normal mode?
If so starting in hard? Starting in extreme?

I was not talking about dungeons

[Campi]

When you only get DPS Players with about 2k DPS, Tanks without using CDs and only spaming Aggro-Combo and Healers just standing around, i think the difficulty is just fine o:
As a Healer i'm always Top DPS in this Dungeon, when i go with DF Players.

And i think the Burn is as easy as Ghimlyt o:
Nothing special at all in 70 Dungeons, all are the same. Mass Pulls and easy Bosses :shrug:

[DevilsDontFly]

When you only get DPS Players with about 2k DPS, Tanks without using CDs and only spaming Aggro-Combo and Healers just standing around, i think the difficulty is just fine o:
As a Healer i'm always Top DPS in this Dungeon, when i go with DF Players.

And i think the Burn is as easy as Ghimlyt o:
Nothing special at all in 70 Dungeons, all are the same. Mass Pulls and easy Bosses :shrug:

But don't you think the reason to why those tanks and DPS aren't pushing a bit harder is because they don't have to? What you said just proves the point that even if you stand still smashing the same key over and over, either to heal, tank or dps, you can still finish the dungeon without any issues or whatsoever.

To me the main issue is that walking around in order to get your gathering nodes is more dangerous than anything you'll ever face in a dungeon. If the game got progressively harder as levels went up, I'm pretty certain that tanks would have to put some effort into surviving and soaking damage, dps would have to pull their weight on finishing a check and healers wouldn't be able to get away with casting one spell every 8 seconds.

Content doesn't need to be extremely difficult, but when we the players have to go out of our way to make it a little bit (small, small bit) more challenging by doing big pulls (that were cut by invisible walls), I think the difficulty curve is the issue. However like other people pointed out, myself included, big difficulty should come with big rewards.