My Catharsis in FFXIV

[HyoMinPark]

When we finally beat the boss, they decided to have a meeting to discuss on how to deal with that boss before moving on to Alexander. Their strategy was to squeeze out as much damage as possible (I wanted to tell them that dying less would lead to more damage, but I decided to keep that to myself). When they got to me, they wanted me to use Shoulder Tackle on cooldown no matter what, I told them no because I wanted to stay on the boss and I haven't gotten down its rotation just yet for me to pull off that kind of min-maxing, 100 potency every 30 seconds would not be missed. So they kicked me from the static. Not because I performed poorly, but because I didn't want to completely maximize my damage with such desperate clawing to scrape up a minuscule damage increase. That was not going to change the result of the entire fight. That's what's I'm talking about when I spoke of criticism because I didn't squeeze out every bit of damage.

They kicked you because they wanted to optimize, and you weren’t willing to do that. Any static wanting to optimize is within their rights to kick a member who refuses to optimize.

When the goals of members of a static are different, there will always be contention. They wanted to squeeze out as much damage as possible; you wanted to play it safe. That didn’t line up with what they wanted. 100 potency adds up over time, by the way—it’s one thing to hold the ability for a few seconds for a well-timed dashback, but if you continuously hold it over the course of a fight to the point that you are losing multiple casts of it, that’s you throwing away damage for literally no reason. For example, 5 missed casts is 500 potency—already stronger than Tornado Kick, which was MNK’s most potent ability back in HW.

When it was that I talked with Japanese raiders about my scenarios like the one I talked about, they all pretty much had the same response: They don't care. As long as you're doing all that you can to win and not die, they're fine with whatever play-style that you want.

Not if you joined a hardcore group on JP. If they want to optimize and you do not, they will not take you. They will kick you. A group that doesn’t want to optimize won’t care, but there are a multitude of groups on JP that do want to optimize and min-max. Don’t join groups that want things different from what you want.

Huh? Magic-crystal-ball-website? What are you talking about? The only site on my forum profile page is to my YouTube channel (which I should change because I'm not uploading anything. I'll set it to my twitter for now), and my lodestone profile has that code that FFLogs wanted me to put on it, which was for those Alexander raid runs. It no longer matters, the Japanese players don't really use it. I think that they use something else to check performance, but's it's used more for a personal performance analysis rather than analyzing others.

If you think JP players don’t use a certain tool and a certain website, you are mistaken.

[Zorixas]

They kicked you because they wanted to optimize, and you weren’t willing to do that. Any static wanting to optimize is within their rights to kick a member who refuses to optimize.

When the goals of members of a static are different, there will always be contention. They wanted to squeeze out as much damage as possible; you wanted to play it safe. That didn’t line up with what they wanted. 100 potency adds up over time, by the way—it’s one thing to hold the ability for a few seconds for a well-timed dashback, but if you continuously hold it over the course of a fight to the point that you are losing multiple casts of it, that’s you throwing away damage for literally no reason. For example, 5 missed casts is 500 potency—already stronger than Tornado Kick, which was MNK’s most potent ability back in HW.

Yup, they wanted maximized damage, I just wanted to win. Which is funny, because when we were learning the fights, they focused on damage over mechanics, which lead to them dying more and, ironically, less damage done overall.

Not if you joined a hardcore group on JP. If they want to optimize and you do not, they will not take you. They will kick you. A group that doesn’t want to optimize won’t care, but there are a multitude of groups on JP that do want to optimize and min-max. Don’t join groups that want things different from what you want.

It's not like I want to join hardcore groups. Luckily there are far, far more mid-core players that see the same way I do, "Fight to win, but have fun and don't stress over it." It's far more difficult to find and join hardcore Japanese players than it is to just jump in a practice, clear or farm run, or even just use the Duty Finder (Not for savage though, Party Finders for those).

If you think JP players don’t use a certain tool and a certain website, you are mistaken.

You quoted me saying that they don't use FFlogs so much but something else instead and why they use it, then respond to that quote as if I said that they don't use any logs of some type at all... What are you even doing?

[HyoMinPark]

Yup, they wanted maximized damage, I just wanted to win. Which is funny, because when we were learning the fights, they focused on damage over mechanics, which lead to them dying more and, ironically, less damage done overall.

It's one thing to not focus on optimization as much when you're trying to get that first clear. But afterwards, they clearly stated what they wanted to do, while you wanted to continue this "playing it safe" mentality. That directly contradicted with their new goals, so they removed you to find someone better suited for the group. There is nothing wrong with that, and it doesn't make them "wrong".

You quoted me saying that they don't use FFlogs so much but something else instead, then respond to that quote as if I said that they don't use any logs of some type at all... What are you even doing?

Correcting you. You literally said that they "don't really use FFLogs", but they do.

FFLogs is the only "leaderboard" so to speak for this game; same with ACT. And they use them both. You can see them using their magical crystal ball just by watching JP streamers. You insinuating that they don't use it that much is incorrect. You insinuating they use something else is incorrect.

Do you have proof that they utilize other programs? Because the leaderboards on FFLogs insinuate that they're still fairly prevalent on there.

[Enjuden]

Pretty sure that video has absolutely nothing to do with what you're talking about. Still, to say that NA as a whole is unwelcome because of the little history you have is ludicrous. Gilgamesh at the time had a lot of players that would never agree to your way of playing whatsoever. Unless someone has personal history that speaks out in this thread, there is little to go by but your word, and with you only doing primals, there isn't anything to say one way or the other. There's a good reason a lot of the players I know are Gilgamesh Evacuees during ARR/Heavensward, so I can see why you'd just blast a server, but not an entire region.

Still, if you like it in JP servers, then you do you.

[Vidu]

Let me give an example of what I was referring to.
During Heavensward on the Gilgamesh server, I decided to finally try out raiding and take on Alexander, so I joined a static (I was a monk at the time). When we got to Cruise Chaser, we had more trouble than the other 2 bosses. I was doing all that I can to remember the mechanics and what to do to counter them, but I couldn't remember the exact rotations and timings for what mechanics were coming and when, so I made the decision of not using Shoulder Tackle for when I needed to get away from the boss, I can charge back in immediately when it's safe, my damage was great without it anyway, I made sure to not die as much as possible and follow the strategies as best as I could. The result was as we progressed; I died the least amount of times and countered the mechanics the most when doing good damage. When we finally beat the boss, they decided to have a meeting to discuss on how to deal with that boss before moving on to Alexander. Their strategy was to squeeze out as much damage as possible (I wanted to tell them that dying less would lead to more damage, but I decided to keep that to myself). When they got to me, they wanted me to use Shoulder Tackle on cooldown no matter what, I told them no because I wanted to stay on the boss and I haven't gotten down its rotation just yet for me to pull off that kind of min-maxing, 100 potency every 30 seconds would not be missed. So they kicked me from the static. Not because I performed poorly, but because I didn't want to completely maximize my damage with such desperate clawing to scrape up a minuscule damage increase. That was not going to change the result of the entire fight. That's what's I'm talking about when I spoke of criticism because I didn't squeeze out every bit of damage.

Since other people have adressed the JP-server-thing already, I'd like to focus on your experience on Gilgamesh here - mainly to note a few things (some that might have been covered already aswell):

1) While I dont wanna say that you're doing excatly that, this has a bit of a generalisation-vibe to it: One (or maybe even just a couple more) isolated incident that made you brought down judgement on the whole western servers - dont get me wrong, I'm gald for you that you found your place on a japanese one, but basically saying "I could have never found such a friendly envoriment on a NA/EU server!" is just plain wrong.

2) Personally I would have removed you from that static aswell - but not because of your actual action of not squeezing out every last bit of damage you could but because of your attitude behind it, which is quite honestly a pretty arrogant one.
"I dont need to improve anymore" - and even more "I'm better than you guys, dont tell ME to improve". Both arent things that I'd want from any member in my very casual, laid-back and friendly static.
As I said in my first post: You should always try to improve - you had room for improvment there and as far as I can gather from your post, so did the rest of the static (if you went over everyone) and since they stayed on, they probably took that advice to heart and were willing to improve.
Playing things safe is great for learning fights - but the desire to optimise afterwards is a keypoint for many groups aswell. Sorry if your personal desire clashed with the legit desire of the majority of that group here.
I'd also like to note here that you said yourself that you were using shoulder tackle because you didnt know the rotation perfectly - your expressed desire to not change your use of shoulder tackle also showed that you werent actually willing to bother learning the content "properly" - which, again, is not an attitude I'd like in a group.
I honestly wouldnt be surprised if the real reason you got removed from that group wasnt 100 potency every 30 seconds but your attitude of "Nope, I'm not gonna improve and you know why? Because I'm already better than all of you!" (paraphrasing)
You couldnt even be bothered to learn when you can use shoulder tackle safely - I dont recall A11S to well, but I'm pretty sure you didnt had to close a gap every 30 seconds and lost out on shoulder tackles that could have been used while still functioning as gap-closer.

At the end of the day... maybe a japanese server with silent blacklisting and less open critisim is the right place for someone who acvtively chooses not to improve anymore because they (wrongfully, if you ask me) feel that they've done enough already. I cant imagine such an attitude working anywhere in the world - and specially not in a culture thats focussed on team-work and on everyone doing their best. Because you dont - or at least didnt. You could improve, you knew how, yet you choose not to - and defend it with "There are people who are worse than me!"

[Luthiene]

I'm a fairly new player but I've honestly found people in this game to be generally helpful to those trying to learn. I've had zero negative interactions with other players but I'm sure this could change once I get into end game content.


I usually read up on a new duty before entering, learned my class abilities and haven't had any complaints so far. I don't think in the average group anyone expects people to be doing more than getting through the content without trouble/wiping. The only time I've seen people become upset while playing is when people join a duty or raid blindly and expect to be carried.

If someone offers me advice or constructive criticism in game I generally take it in and use the feedback to get better. When you're grouping with others your willingness to be a team player does affect everyone else in the group. So if a static wanted to kick you for actively refusing to learn mechanics and maximize dps that seems fair.

[Vidu]

If someone offers me advice or constructive criticism in game I generally take it in and use the feedback to get better. When you're grouping with others your willingness to be a team player does affect everyone else in the group. So if a static wanted to kick you for actively refusing to learn mechanics and maximize dps that seems fair.

See, this is a good and healthy attitude!
Keep that up and you'll run into more nice and supportive players than the odd bad apple!

[Divinewindx]

This isn't a single player game

[AppleJinx]

I wish I could bring myself to have fun on other people's expense as well.

[LordMaitreya]

You are either trolling or extremely lazy.