Why another complex minigame that will probably die in 2 weeks?

[KaivaC]

So don't play it?

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I mean, to be fair, Mahjong does have a decent popularity worldwide.

[Azurymber]

So don't play it?

The issue isn't about whether or not I like it.
It's about whether it's going to even be possible to play 2-weeks from now when everyone has given up on it.

I enjoy verminion and choco racing, but they both share the same issue with Mahjong, which is that people who are good at the game will always wreck people who aren't. And there is no incentive to become good at the game because rewards aren't high enough. So even if you have a few players who love the game, they will eventually get tired of 30min+ queues or playing alone, and just quit as well.

That's why even when the gold saucer is FULL of people for the MGP bonus in the summer, verminion queues are still 30+min and you almost always end up doing solo choco races, or occasionally face 1 other person.

On the other hand if they made a game anyone can pick up, without needing to invest time into it, then people might actually play on a regular basis

[KaivaC]

On the other hand if they made a game anyone can pick up, without needing to invest time into it, then people might actually play on a regular basis

Fair enough - games such as what, though? They can't exactly put in games that have a huge gambling stigma attached to it, like typical casino games. I'd imagine that if they had added Blitzball as Yoshi had hinted at finding a hard time implementing, that would be a significant time sink as well. Maybe we need to throw some suggestions on feasible future GS options and see what catches up with others?

[Azurymber]

Fair enough - games such as what, though? They can't exactly put in games that have a huge gambling stigma attached to it, like typical casino games. I'd imagine that if they had added Blitzball as Yoshi had hinted at finding a hard time implementing, that would be a significant time sink as well. Maybe we need to throw some suggestions on feasible future GS options and see what catches up with others?

Multiplayer FF7-esque magitek motorcycle racing (with swords). Think mario kart (add powerups and stuff so part of winning is random luck)
Multiplayer FF7-esque snowboarding (it was so popular it spawned a standalone game)
Multiplayer BlitzBall (not blitzball manager 2019)
Mario-Party-Esque boardgame with gold-saucer-based minigames (e.g. short jumping minigame, flying plane minigame, basketball hoops minigame, etc)

Im sure there are 100s of unique possibilities they could think up.
The key being none of them have a level system, or special gear, etc. You just queue up and your on equal ground with everyone else. And have fun.

[KaivaC]

Multiplayer FF7-esque magitek motorcycle racing (with swords). Think mario kart (add powerups and stuff so part of winning is random luck)
Multiplayer FF7-esque snowboarding (it was so popular it spawned a standalone game)
Multiplayer BlitzBall (not blitzball manager 2019)
Mario-Party-Esque boardgame with gold-saucer-based minigames (e.g. short jumping minigame, flying plane minigame, basketball hoops minigame, etc)

Im sure there are 100s of unique possibilities they could think up.
The key being none of them have a level system, or special gear, etc. You just queue up and your on equal ground with everyone else. And have fun.

I don't disagree with those suggestions - especially motorcycle, Blitzball, and Mario Party. But I worry that the latter two may be time sinks in and of themselves. I'd imagine Mahjong might have slightly longer staying power because, of course, it is rather popular (there were a good number of people who wanted the Mahjong board on the Live Letter stream where it was revealed).

[Reynhart]

Think mario kart (add powerups and stuff so part of winning is random luck)

That's what Chocobo Racing should be.

[CorbinDallas]

That's what Chocobo Racing should be.

That's exactly what chocobo racing is though. You could be sailing away in first place and boom, choco meteor, now you're in last.

[Reynhart]

That's exactly what chocobo racing is though. You could be sailing away in first place and boom, choco meteor, now you're in last.

In theory yes, but isn't there a leveling system in that so that you can be screwed if you start way later than everyone ?
In Mario Kart, neither vehicles nor pilots change over time.

And, from what I've seen, the controls are really stiff with the invisible "lanes" making this a lot less fun to play that an actual racing game.

[Alien_Gamer]

I enjoy verminion and choco racing, but they both share the same issue with Mahjong, which is that people who are good at the game will always wreck people who aren't.

You just described every competitive game in existence.

All of your examples apply to this as well, those with more skill will do better. Games without skill are called games of chance and there's plenty of those already. If the game is determined by getting an arbitrary number, why bother wasting time with other players? Just go play minicacpot each day and collect your rewards. People do that because its a free currency generator and takes 30 seconds, not because its any fun.

I also don't believe Mahjong or any of the other games you mentioned are too difficult to learn. The game is horrid at telling you the rules and how to use the game but Mahjong itself isn't hard, neither is triple triad or chocobo racing, or any others.

About the only thing I do agree with is the time investment for a full game is more than I want to put into it. But thats also because I don't really care about Mahjong; if they were to put in Go, I could spend hours playing that though.

[kikix12]

I enjoy verminion and choco racing, but they both share the same issue with Mahjong, which is that people who are good at the game will always wreck people who aren't.

As another poster said...that's true for all games of skill. Heck, it's not even about multiplayer. If you are bad at Darksouls you will not finish it for months, while someone that's good will find it a breeze and finish it on first try. And second. AND third.

That is because that's the whole point of games of skill. They are there so that you can test yourself against the challenge, and if you fail, learn whatever is needed to overcome it. If you quit at first failure or two then it's simply not something for you. Nothing is for everyone. If someones not ambitious enough to gain new skills (Mahjong in this case) on their off time, it's no ones fault. It's just not for them.

And there is no incentive to become good at the game because rewards aren't high enough. So even if you have a few players who love the game, they will eventually get tired of 30min+ queues or playing alone, and just quit as well.

Really?! Seriously?! Sorry, but this is just ridiculous. People play Mahjong for CENTURIES. And guess what...There were NO rewards at all. Do you think that people play Mahjong only for rewards?! That's rather insulting, really. That line of thought insinuates that people play board games just for rewards coming from that. Chess, Backgammon. Heck, even collectible card games like Magic the Gathering, Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh would fall under this. All of these games are played mainly for the fun of playing them. They are stand-alone games, a point in and off itself.

So no, rewards in actual Final Fantasy XIV are nice, but Mahjong is one of the games that CAN defend itself on simply being...itself. Though personally I'm not interested in Mahjong, if a game of that sort that I like was implemented, I'd HOPE that people that play just for rewards wouldn't feel like playing it. Why?! Because these sorts of people don't have fun when doing that, and it's not fun to hear people complain about a game mid-match just cause they feel like they "need" to do something they don't enjoy.

That's why even when the gold saucer is FULL of people for the MGP bonus in the summer, verminion queues are still 30+min and you almost always end up doing solo choco races, or occasionally face 1 other person.

Vermilion and Chocobo Races have innate issues by design (in Final Fantasy XIV). They would have failed as stand-alone games. From controls to implementation, as well as the method of gathering the minions to play with. Then Chocobo races are technical crap. The controls are bad and not as responsive, the whole game feels clunky and the management is made in a way that's simply not fun. They both are games that take an idea (MOBA and "monster raising" respectively) and butcher it. Mahjong does not suffer from that. They used actual real-life rules to create it.

On the other hand if they made a game anyone can pick up, without needing to invest time into it, then people might actually play on a regular basis

Or they may not. Really, this applies to everything. Look at all the mini-games. The one with chopping the wood near Vermilion area is rather easy 400MGP every minute or so. Sometimes "only" 150MGP. It's very simple and not really bad. And how often do I see someone there?! Try 'never'. Well, that is a bit of an exaggeration. I'll see someone here or there every couple of my visits there.

Whether a game is basic or complicated is irrelevant. What matters is whether people enjoy it. Mahjong have a large fanbase, whether you want to admit that or not. Now, it's fanbase may be mainly in Asia, but you know what?! This game IS available in Asia.

Multiplayer FF7-esque magitek motorcycle racing (with swords). Think mario kart (add powerups and stuff so part of winning is random luck)

Chocobo racing...Already available, but butchered up.

Multiplayer BlitzBall (not blitzball manager 2019)

Um...Yeah. Look below...

Mario-Party-Esque boardgame with gold-saucer-based minigames (e.g. short jumping minigame, flying plane minigame, basketball hoops minigame, etc)

There are such mini-games already available all over the Gold Saucer. Either as gates or permanent. Not exactly those games maybe...but hey.

Im sure there are 100s of unique possibilities they could think up.

And yet all you do is give ideas that are a copy of something done. Which they would butcher to avoid being accused of copyright infringement. Except from their own games. They still do butcher them (Chocobo Racing...).

The key being none of them have a level system, or special gear, etc. You just queue up and your on equal ground with everyone else. And have fun.

Um...When was the last time you did play Blitzball?! There IS a complicated leveling system there. That's kinda the entire attraction of Blitzball. Finding the better players and getting the better skills. Other than that, it's a simple football simulator with fewer players. And no, it's not even 3D movement. It's perfectly flat. Well, in its original form in Final Fantasy X anyway.


I'd imagine that if they put forth effort into making it thematically a "true blitzball" the swimming would be done in three dimensions in a manner akin to flying, but the skills learning and player recruitment would still be a thing.