Thread: NIN mudras going into 5.0

As much as I want shadow clones, the latency issue needs to be addressed before they can add a mudra and additional ninjitsu; possibly even keep the system as is. I don't think single button jutsu is the answer, we would get 6 additional skills on our bars all sharing the same CD. I thought about if reducing the mudra recast timer would help, but not sure it will do anything if latency is the problem. And I personally would not want to be able to use abilities between mudras. I don't have an issue with the current system. Only that it is at the mercy of ping.

How about if the mudras didn't share the CD timer, but instead have their own separate CDs? I am not sure if the CDs need to be tied together for ninjitsu combinations to register, but also don't see what they would need to be. I really hope they figure this out going into 5.0 as NIN has become one of my favorite jobs to play.

They could do a lot to fix mudras just by making them weavable and seperating them from the ninjutsu button itself. so you give the mudras themselves maybe a 10 second duration with an instant recast. but keep the ninjutsu button on its 20 second cool down.

If they did this instead of say trying to go:
Spinning Heel > Gust Slash > Ten > Jin > Chi > Ninjutsu > Aeolian Edge. and suffering from the rather heavy slipping issues while entering your doton. What players would be able to do is:

Ten > Spinning Heel > Jin > Gust Slash > Chi > Aeolian Edge > Ninjutsu and drop doton without any gcd clipping issues at all.

The seperation of the recast timers would then effectively allow players to pre enter there next mudras before the ninjutsu button came off its 20 second cooldown.

So at lets say 60 seconds into a fight a ninja has just pressed ninjutsu and thrown raiton on to the boss. at say 70 seconds he could start weaving his next mudra combination between his next gcds so when he presses the ninjutsu button at 80 seconds his next
chosen ninjutsu is all set to go.. again without clipping any of his gcds..

this would eliminate a huge amount of ninjas clipping issues. the biggest issue ninjas would be left with would be the clunkiness of ten chi jin itself.

I think the intent with NIN was to separate ninjitsu from weaponskills, and I believe this will remain in 5.0. I am not sure why this is an issue for some players so long as the damage that clips the gcd is greater than the gcd/combo potency. I don't have an issue with TCJ because the potency is ridiculous, and personally speaking, I would find weaving mudras between weaponskills to be much less engaging. I'd probably abandon NIN if they did this.

Eliminating shared CDs among the mudras would also allow to queue the next mudra and desired ninjitsu. I think it would solve a lot of the current issue and allow the fourth mudra. At least on paper I think. Ninjitsu involving four mudras would definitely have to be very strong, unless it is some kind of passive jutsu like Huton that you usually cast prior to the fight. Something like shadow clones effectively tripling the damage from your auto attacks (just an example) would definitely boost NIN overall DPS.

it's more to fix a latency issue than change the way a job plays. making mudras weavable for example wouldnt stop those with decent connections working exactly as they do now. but those with slightly higher latency could benefit from it.

I'm in the uk and play on sargatanas and as much as people sometimes spout move data centres if latency is an issue it's not an option. ive been on my server since before it existed. back in 1.0 when it was called saronia. before it was merged. its where all my friends are so moving just isnt an option. and before they moved the data centre i never had a single issue.and times of day i have a faster connection than people on the datacentres door step..

the thing is there's times of the day where i can throw out ninjutsu with no issues at all and never bunny. hell even ten chi jin flows quite smoothly. but then randomly a couple of hours later it becomes a clunky mess. and i start seeing bunnys because the server missed an input or something such. even if my latency has only gone up a few ms it can make a huge difference.

allowing mudras to be weavable wouldn't change the gameplay that much you could still do the whole thing in a single gcd if you so choose it would just give players on a slightly higher latency a chance to keep up. especially when yoshi proclaims this game is designed to be played at 200ms and yet can frequently see you messing up your mudras even if you're playing at half that...

latency is widely regarded as ninjas single biggest problem. and allowing mudras to be weavable would go an incredibly long way to resolving that issue

I am not sure if that really fixes the latency issue though. I think at best it would sweep it under the rug. It may very well transfer the issue over to our gcds instead of the subsequent mudras. Which aside from my opinion of dulling gameplay, this possibility is another reason why I think weaponskills and mudras/justu should remain separate.

There is no disputing that changing the way mudras work will change how NIN plays. The question is how much will it impact the way it is played currently. Now if SE cannot figure out how to rectify the latency issues, then perhaps there will be no choice other than to change how NIN plays. Unfortunately. No doubt about it NIN will be the job I'll be paying the most attention to when 5.0 announcements begin.

Originally Posted by Grimoire-M

I think I mentioned this in another thread, but instead of adding another mudra, why not add combos to the current mudras that increase their potency? So 1-1 or 1-1-1 would empower Fuma Shuriken at each step, 1-2-2 or 1-1-2 would boost each of the 2-mudra skills, and the current 3 mudra skills would be unaffected. That alone would be plenty, since it could be used to boost TCJ potency a bit further and mitigate rabbit issues somewhat.

potency would have to worth the clipping else be worthless to do

another problem for nin in 5.0 will be skillspeed as secondary stats go up as i highly doubt every new batch of ilvs we will be able to avoid it completely clipping could get real bad if se mess it up too much

Originally Posted by Kurando

Do you think they would ever remove Mundra input? I mean let's say you can set Raiton to your hotbar directly, but when you use it the animation plays for whatever Mundra is required to use that particular Ninjutsu. I suppose it would be like casting time except you can do it whilst moving, though the auto input means less issues with lag/latency.

They could negate those issues already by just moving the queuing moment up a bit and trusting the client timer for the animation lock duration. Sure, there might be some hackers at the highest end, but they wouldn't be able to post a log or play outside their static without being found out, which removes almost all reason to hack outside of glamour farms.

I remember from the 70 quest that the fourth mundra is "mirror". Gave me the mental image of it duplicating the current ninjutsu command.

Like, you tap in the command for Raiton, then hit 4. When you actually cast ninjitsu, shadow clones appear on your sides and you cast 2-3 Raitons before they fade away. Just give it a seperate timer from the other mundras.

Just a shower thought, but i figured it could be a cool way to impliment the 4th.