Performance-based roll system

[Seraphor]

Sorry but i have to be the one that says it. The biggest part of the RDM's you'll get in DF won't raise anyway because they don't care or because they didn't read the tooltips.

It's also very difficult for controller players to target other alliances anyway. We target by scrolling through the party list.
If you're in another alliance, I'll never find your corpse in the sea of flailing weapons, spells and fireworks.

[Yeol]

I would say keep rolling numbers independent from performance. But we can reward the entire party with extra loot to roll on at the end of the fight if they clear it with no deaths.

Clear with deaths = 4 items.
Clear with no deaths = 5 items.
We can be generous and say no more than 2 deaths = 5 items.
This is in case of normal 8 man raid.

I don't think people will stress out and kick other players in order to get the 5th chest. Because in the end, they might not win any loot, it's still RNG.
The extra chest is only there encourage people to play better.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Kicking and waiting for a replacement would hurt the party's dps more, they'd be better off sucking it up and running it again.

If you're standing around right after a wipe, your DPS is 0 then anyway. DPS before kick and replacement = 0. DPS after kick and replacement = 0

[SpiritMuse]

It's also very difficult for controller players to target other alliances anyway. We target by scrolling through the party list.
If you're in another alliance, I'll never find your corpse in the sea of flailing weapons, spells and fireworks.

It can be tricky to find someone not in your party, definitely. However, for alliances you can hold L1 and then use left and right D-pad to go through the displayed alliance list. (And the same L1 allows you to use up and down to go through the enemy list which also comes in handy sometimes.) Still somewhat finicky, but pretty doable most of the time.

[Ameela]

Instead of loot I'd rather have good performance reward more gil, tomes and experience depending on the duty.

So like have the game grade your performance at the end of each duty as either Bronze, Silver or Gold. Bronze gives you the same rewards we have now while Silver would maybe get you like +50% of the total rewards and Gold would give +100%

Maybe exclude capped tomes from this system just for the sake of fairness, but if it's just gil, exp and outdated tomestones then it's a nice bonus and incentive to play well while also not locking anyone out of super important loot

[Mansion]

Sorry but i have to be the one that says it. The biggest part of the RDM's you'll get in DF won't raise anyway because they don't care or because they didn't read the tooltips.

I don't raise people when I know it's going to be a pain for my mana. Just because we can chain raise does not mean that we should. Two raises back to back is a huge amount of mana, even with Lucid dreaming. Plus considering manashifts to Bards / healers.

Just avoid to die.

[CaptainLagbeard]

Loot rolling is fine as is so long as they don't try what they did with Ridorana Lighthouse by making loot rolls greed only. This was quickly fixed (and the backlash was severe) so I'm assuming it's probably not something they'll risk again. It has worked fine since 2.0 launch. No sense in changing it or even making your suggestion an option. Something tells me a lost loot roll brought this on. We've all had that happen. It sucks, but that's just the way it goes. Random will be random.

Well, the greed only loot for 24 wasn't THAT bad of an idea... But combined with other problems with the 24 man raid's loot, it was a terrible failure.

[Kleeya]

Sorry but i have to be the one that says it. The biggest part of the RDM's you'll get in DF won't raise anyway because they don't care or because they didn't read the tooltips.

Even if that was true (it might just be you having no luck ending with bad/selfish rdms) that's not a reason to make that even worse by inciting people of thinking of their group dps only.

I did take that as an example, but we can imagine players with aoes markers going on purpose near other groups players, so that their heals gets busy healing them rather than doing more dps. Or for the same purpose tanks turning the boss towards other groups when a big cleave is coming. No tanks wanting to be the main defensive one because "my dps". A full roster group in 400+ stuff getting the bonus despite not needing such low level stuff, while the two others less geared groups who actually need more drops will in fact get less. Players with parsers leaving the raid when they see they will not get more drops. And so on. I am sure that there is tons of other points that will make 24 man raids way more toxic if you bring competition between players into them, instead of keeping them as as a common goal to reach together.

[Ilan]

It's also very difficult for controller players to target other alliances anyway. We target by scrolling through the party list.
If you're in another alliance, I'll never find your corpse in the sea of flailing weapons, spells and fireworks.

I don't play with a controller so i wouldn't know but from what SpiritMuse it is not impossible so i can't let this count as an excuse.

I don't raise people when I know it's going to be a pain for my mana. Just because we can chain raise does not mean that we should. Two raises back to back is a huge amount of mana, even with Lucid dreaming. Plus considering manashifts to Bards / healers.

Just avoid to die.

Dude come on don't exaggerate. 2 raises are no issue except you died before.
But yeah its a good idea to not die and the next thing that a healer will say to everyone in the party is: "nah i won't heal you i have to do dps myself, just avoid to take damage"

Even if that was true (it might just be you having no luck ending with bad/selfish rdms) that's not a reason to make that even worse by inciting people of thinking of their group dps only.

I did take that as an example, but we can imagine players with aoes markers going on purpose near other groups players, so that their heals gets busy healing them rather than doing more dps. Or for the same purpose tanks turning the boss towards other groups when a big cleave is coming. No tanks wanting to be the main defensive one because "my dps". A full roster group in 400+ stuff getting the bonus despite not needing such low level stuff, while the two others less geared groups who actually need more drops will in fact get less. Players with parsers leaving the raid when they see they will not get more drops. And so on. I am sure that there is tons of other points that will make 24 man raids way more toxic if you bring competition between players into them, instead of keeping them as as a common goal to reach together.

Uhm you'll discover RDM's like this frequently in 24 and 8 man DF content, that has nothing to do with my "bad experiences" because i'm very often also on RDM and i see that people won't get a raise from any RDM when i'm not able to raise.

I know you did take this just as an example, but its not the best. Stuff that you've just described already happen, not often but there is sometimes one of these players amongst the 23 other players. I also get what you want to say and i agree that people would become more egoistic if this system would be in the game, but it will not happen because SE doesn't want to chase a large group of customers away.

People already took their pitchforks out when we could only roll greed. Now imagine what would happen if a big part of the community wouldn't even have the chance to get loot because of this system.

[DamianFatale]

People with disabilities would be punished for this. Anyone who is partially blind, mentally challenged, and/or physically unable to play easily would be brutally punished.

Keep this kind of system in savage/extreme/ultimate if it is ever implemented.