Performance-based roll system

[Brightamethyst]

Commendations typically go to Tanks or Healers, so the only thing that does is make it harder for DPS to get things.

This is true, but that falls to each individual player to decide.

That's a matter of visibility, not quality. Tanks and healers get more commendations mostly because what they do in a party is more obvious.

Held aggro, grabbed adds quickly, didn't spin unnecessarily? Tank did a good job. No one died, status effects cured quickly? Healer did a good job. BLM did... um... huh. I'm pretty sure I saw some fire, maybe. Is that good?

[JohnSpawnVFX]

They were talking about commendations, not loot.

Yes, with the context being "more commendations, higher rolls on loot"

With an all preformed party, they can just use lootmaster or have the person who would get the loot roll, and everyone else pass. No need to get a random and kick them, just so that a friend would join the party to game the comms.

[WellFooled]

How do you stop someone from being kicked and then having them replaced by one of your friends who then trade commendations with each other? Currently you can't commendate in pre-form parties, but joining as a replacement bypasses this restriction. Sure it's a lot of hassle to go to but some players will do anything they can to cheat a system if possible.

That's a fair point. I'm afraid I don't have a good solution. The obvious one would be Square punishing behavior like that so that people tempted to do it wouldn't do it for fear they get banned, but Square does so little moderation of their game I think that's unrealistic. I don't think any system can be made villain proof.

Yes, with the context being "more commendations, higher rolls on loot"

With an all preformed party, they can just use lootmaster or have the person who would get the loot roll, and everyone else pass. No need to get a random and kick them, just so that a friend would join the party to game the comms.

The commendation discussion and the higher rolls on loot discussion are two different proposed ideas in the thread, but don't actually incorporate each other. I suggested commendations being worth more (for example, cooler achievement rewards for them, using them as a currency for mounts and gear, etc) as a way to encourage people to perform better in duties instead of the OP's suggestion of a performance based roll bonus.

[Seddrinth]

What about designing more mechanics into raids/trials that all party members have to deal with such as the Suzaku bubble direction mech? So if you get all 10 right you'd have a bonus added to your roll vs some who get 6-7 right. Or the numbers mechanic in lighthouse where if you get them right you have bonus to your rolls compared so people who mess up? Or the level checker part in o11 normal where people have to stand in a bubble? If you don't stand in one you get a penalty to rolls. Those examples are not game changing and are not prone to griefing or abuse. It would be a very very tiny bonus reward to doing things correctly, and in most cases won't affect the outcomes of rolls, just if you are rolling close to another player it would push you over the top.

[Emstidor]

What about designing more mechanics into raids/trials that all party members have to deal with such as the Suzaku bubble direction mech? So if you get all 10 right you'd have a bonus added to your roll vs some who get 6-7 right. Or the numbers mechanic in lighthouse where if you get them right you have bonus to your rolls compared so people who mess up? Or the level checker part in o11 normal where people have to stand in a bubble? If you don't stand in one you get a penalty to rolls. Those examples are not game changing and are not prone to griefing or abuse. It would be a very very tiny bonus reward to doing things correctly, and in most cases won't affect the outcomes of rolls, just if you are rolling close to another player it would push you over the top.

As a healer, what's to stop me from deliberately underhealing and letting people die, in order to maximize my own chances at loot at the end? Or using Rescue on you during a mechanics phase? If I don't say anything in chat you have no way to prove that I intentionally sabotaged you versus accidentally misclicking a skill.

[Akonyl]

The other thing about locking it to specific phases like that would be that it doesn't actually reward overall good behavior, just a very specific type. Group-wide mechanics like that where everyone does the same thing are pretty minor+infrequent, so I could just throw 90% of the Suzaku fight and just do the DDR section correctly for all the +loot I'd need.

[Seddrinth]

The other thing about locking it to specific phases like that would be that it doesn't actually reward overall good behavior, just a very specific type. Group-wide mechanics like that where everyone does the same thing are pretty minor+infrequent, so I could just throw 90% of the Suzaku fight and just do the DDR section correctly for all the +loot I'd need.

I mean, every system can be abused. At least you would be trying 10% of the fight as opposed to 0% that some people are doing right now lol.

[Reynhart]

How about a performance based number of loot instead ?

You could add optionnal objectives to dungeons, that would simply increase the number of chests at the end, to encourage everyone to perform better.
- No death ? "Flawless victory bonus chest"
- Less than x number of damage taken ? "Life preservation bonus chest"
- x amount of total damage dealt ? "Brutal bonus chest"
- Every monster killed ? "Slayer bonus chest"
etc...

[Seddrinth]

How about a performance based number of loot instead ?

You could add optionnal objectives to dungeons, that would simply increase the number of chests at the end, to encourage everyone to perform better.
- No death ? "Flawless victory bonus chest"
- Less than x number of damage taken ? "Life preservation bonus chest"
- x amount of total damage dealt ? "Brutal bonus chest"
- Every monster killed ? "Slayer bonus chest"
etc...

I think that's a really great idea.

[reivaxe]

A well meaning suggestion that's ripe with "bad idea".

Just think, if the best players got a better roll they wouldn't have much need to farm things, right? I mean, if they want things other than mounts they could farm and they would be super successful at getting Scales and fragments and stuff and have an iron grip on that market. But if all they want is the mount then they wont have to farm for nearly as long which would leave fewer people who know what they're doing to bother playing those fights.

They already give them a reward in tokens. If you're really good at a fight but unlucky then through time, research and hard work you can get mounts with tokens. For DNGs it does suck though. There's also lootmaster if you're confident that you can complete the duty over and over again with a group of decent enuff players.

I know no one likes the DPS who is bffs with the floor and is first timing a primal rolling a 99 on a mount and jumping for joy but it has to be a possibility.