Performance-based roll system

[Deceptus]

For the regular 8 man and the 24 man raids, I think a system where you get a bonus to your roll based on how many times you've done it that week would work.

Sort of like a bad luck protection. Something this game sorely needs.

[Shurrikhan]

Any ideas on how we can make rolling on loot somewhat performance-based? I'm mainly talking about the non-savage duty funder type stuff like dungeons, normal raids, trials, etc. It would be nice to reward people who perform with a +20 to whatever they would've rolled so that there's an incentive to do your best instead of letting people carry you. It's kind of annoying to see players die to easy mechanics 4 times, contribute nothing, and then win the loot with a 95 roll while the people who actually did the work lose out.

I don't think it'd work very well with anything that doesn't have granular rewards, especially without an accurate by-ilvl benchmark comparator.

Consider: you're trying to get actual gear from the dungeon. A Savage raider is also attending, looking for some glamour pieces. Having 50% more ilvl beyond the base for a level 70 than you do, he also does some 40% more throughput. You both roll what would have been 50s. He gets the loot. That wouldn't feel great.

And then there are the less just but still obvious issues. The truly bad players aren't going to be encouraged not to slack off by this. Unless they are almost literally prevented from getting loot -- at which point they throw a (in a significant way, deserved) fit here and/or unsubscribe -- they'll just do more runs, likely chalking it up to RNG as always. So, we just get to experience that poor play for more runs, while getting good players for fewer runs, accentuating the skill pyramid.

Should there be other ways to better encourage our players towards competence and some modicum of effort? Certainly. This just isn't one of the viable ways.

If anything, we probably just ought to see some silent normalization via bad luck protection, better player training and in-game support therefor, a more reasonable and continuous difficulty curve, and the like.

[Seraphor]

For the regular 8 man and the 24 man raids, I think a system where you get a bonus to your roll based on how many times you've done it that week would work.

Would that mean that at the end of the week, right before reset, everyones rolling 95+ every time and anyone who hasnt been grinding it all week doesnt have a chance?

[CaptainLagbeard]

Would that mean that at the end of the week, right before reset, everyones rolling 95+ every time and anyone who hasnt been grinding it all week doesnt have a chance?

Well, the idea is more that people don't grind it all week, because they will eventually get their loot. It's more an idea to limit the grind.

[Ilan]

Any ideas on how we can make rolling on loot somewhat performance-based? I'm mainly talking about the non-savage duty funder type stuff like dungeons, normal raids, trials, etc. It would be nice to reward people who perform with a +20 to whatever they would've rolled so that there's an incentive to do your best instead of letting people carry you. It's kind of annoying to see players die to easy mechanics 4 times, contribute nothing, and then win the loot with a 95 roll while the people who actually did the work lose out.

That won't happen because everyone is paying money to play the game and SE doesn't want a huge shitstorm or people quitting aka loosing money over something like that.

[Alleo]

Honestly OP even though I kinda agree with the idea behind it (because there is nothing more frustrating of having someone who was dead the whole run get nearly everything of the loot at the end) I doubt that this can be implemented in a way to be fair. How will the system judge if you have done good or not? It would need at least three different ways (for Tanks, healers and DDs) and then what would be the right way? Increase the chance if you are just doing your job by simply tanking or healing? Or would they need to DPS too? What happens if a healer or tank let people die on purpose to let it look like they are not carrying their worth? Or just simply a bad healer that lets the others die from unavoidable damage.

[Seraphor]

Well, the idea is more that people don't grind it all week, because they will eventually get their loot. It's more an idea to limit the grind.

But if everyone is playing it multiple times to get better roll chances, then you're likely to encounter other players who have also run it multiple times and have also got the roll bonus, which results in you not actually having any advantage against them.

If you haven't run it multiple times this week already, and you're paired with people who have, which would be likely, then you'll have less chance to roll, and depending on how great a bonus it is or how much it stacks, you could be guaranteed to not be successful on your first or first few runs.
You will need to run it multiple times to 'build up' your roll bonus, before you even have a shot at winning your loot, before taking into account that you need that loot to drop in the first place.

Basically you will need to grind it out, in order to get back to square one. So this will only enforce more grinding.


The only viable solution I can see, is that if the party consists of enough people who have run it multiple times, then the raid actually drops more loot.

[LalaRu]

When the squadron will be able to do all leveling duties, the loot problem solves itself.
Surely cannot ask to have all and every duty implemented tomorrow, but starting with the ones that today are the most farmed for the loot will be a good start.

[DPZ2]

At least, people who didn't participate at all, like being outside the boss arena the entire fight, should not be able to get loot from this boss.

Do they get loot now?

It's bad enough that this used to happen regularly when high-level players would start a boss battle in the Praetorium while all the new people were still trying to get through the cut-scenes (and the annoyance of skipping cut-scenes) only to end up on the wrong side of that purple line.

[Fynlar]

Does the concept of "the rich get richer" mean anything to you by any chance, OP?

I would maybe be down if they somehow made it so that someone who literally doesn't even try to contribute (note that this is not necessarily the same thing as "dying repeatedly to 'easy' mechanics") can't roll for loot, but anything beyond that is probably going to step on toes.

Do they get loot now?

Yes, they can, although it's obviously considered bad form and I've found most people will respectfully pass on this loot (assuming they didn't just wimp out of the fight on purpose; people unintentionally missing a fight is a lot less of a problem nowadays with that warp feature they implemented not too long back)

The only time the game doesn't let you lot is if you enter the instance after the fight was won and loot is still in the pool (as in you're replacing someone that had left)