Combo Action Button

[Sylve]

I'm a relatively new player, but you are presenting a valid concern. Completely valid. I'm not very techi but I believe there are things like Macros in this game. I don't know how to use them at all, but that might be the solution. So, can anyone explain macros? Please explain like we are five.

I, myself, am concerned because I already have six hot bars running and all the skills are valuable. Thanks to anyone who replies.

There are no macro commands that would work for what I'd like to see. Closest is what I managed on Monk, which simply has attacks that require specific forms macro'd to be cast together. The system just automatically uses whichever skill fits the Form I happen to be in. That just let me use 1 2 3 8 for my main combos, just in different orders depending on where im at with buffs/debuffs. Cut down the keybinds a little with zero negative effects on my rotations.

The command for it is as simple as
/ac "Twin Snakes"
/ac "Demolish"
For one, and the other is
/ac "True Strike"
/ac "Snap Punch

So if I press 1 2 2, its Dragonkick - Twin Snakes - Demolish. But if I don't need Demolish, I can hit 3 for Snap Punch instead for a finisher, or True Strike if Twin Snakes is up.
Which is basically a dodgy, Monk only version on what I would very much like. A simple reduction in keybinds without dumbing down the way weaponskills combo together.

[Yasminou]

Combo buttons for PvE? No thanks. I wouldn't even work for classes where the combo forks up at a certain point.

I'm pretty sure such combos exist in PvP and the system works. If you have a combo 1->2->3 and another 1->2->4, then both combined combo action show the first WS. Then pressing either combined combo action button will update them both to show the second WS. Doing it again will update them both and one will show the third WS while the other will show the fourth one.

[Nexxus]

They can totally add a combo system like in PvP and add a new panels of skillsets in PvE.
If it works like in Aion (the use of 3 buttons for alternatives skills).
In my opinion, it would be really cool to add a system like this in PvE, it would make the game less nervous, but more strategic.
Mages could have also channeling skills, where the most you stay input the more the damage/healing/etc when you release...
You could have for example; "provoke" followed by 3 choices: "Q" = stun bash | "E" = Flash Heal | "R" = AoE Provoke/flash , etc...
The actual combo system is just a "mandatory" loop... it would be great to change the way to play that could make us exit from that loop...

[Sylve]

They can totally add a combo system like in PvP and add a new panels of skillsets in PvE.
If it works like in Aion (the use of 3 buttons for alternatives skills).
In my opinion, it would be really cool to add a system like this in PvE, it would make the game less nervous, but more strategic.
Mages could have also channeling skills, where the most you stay input the more the damage/healing/etc when you release...
You could have for example; "provoke" followed by 3 choices: "Q" = stun bash | "E" = Flash Heal | "R" = AoE Provoke/flash , etc...
The actual combo system is just a "mandatory" loop... it would be great to change the way to play that could make us exit from that loop...

Its impossible to move away from a core loop for a rotation. You could have a dozen paths to take and they'd have to all achieve the exact same result (In which case it doesn't matter, you just mash keys to win) or the best path gets simmed and becomes the only path.

The weaponskill combos are fine, they just need to condense them into one key pressed multiple times as opposed to multiple keys pressed once.

[Liam_Harper]

All I know, is that this would be a nightmare for Samurai. The way I have my abilities on my hotbar are from left to right to flow with the combo (i assume most people do this). Not only does it make sense, but it allows me look down and know WHERE i am in my combo for those moments in fights where I have to focus on a mechanic or something.

Not to mention those moments, for whatever reason, where you're short on Kenki for a Midare so you want to Haka -> Jinpu (now you have your Kenki), Kaiten -> Midare, then finish your Jinpu combo for another Sen. If the combo was consolidated you're forced to waste a Sen.

In short, it just wouldn't work well for Sam.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

So give it as an option. When I have to use both Shift and Alt as modifiers because I ran out of buttons on my keyboard/mouse, There are too many skills taking up too many slots.


Dragoon would stand to benefit a whole lot, at least for me. Currently playing my DRG is:
8 9 0 E
1 2 3 Q

This doesn't include the various buffs and single use skills like BotD, Heavy Thrust and the various jumps.
But being able to condense those 8 keybinds into 2 would be a bloody godsend.
The only mechanical change for players is that Impulse Drive becomes Disembowel when used. At the top with Wheeling Thrust + Fang and Claw, it need only change the other combo path button to the appropriate skill. 8 Skills, 2 keybinds.
But I see no reason that would stop you from using oGCDs like Jumps etc between weaponskills if it essentially just replaced Impulse Drive with Disembowel etc. Same with Doomspike and Sonic Thrust, I will NEVER use Sonic without first using Doomspike, so let me press ` ` instead of ` S+`
The only change would be that I pressed 22221 instead of 8 9 0 E Q, which frees up keybinds for other skills.

Does the pvp Combo button reset the chain if you don't press it 4 times in sequence? If it does, that's horrible and can piss right off. That's not what I'd like to see. I just want to see the next step in the chain replace the preceding skill for the duration we currently have for the Combo Action to be lit up since the preceeding skill is NEVER used while the followup skill is lit up. I'd still need 8 button presses, just not 8 hotkeys.


For something like Paladin, where there are branches,
Example, If I used Fast Blade and then Riot Strike intending to use Royal Authority, but needed to refresh Goring Blade instead, id set 3 combo paths onto 1, 2 and 3. 1 Would be a full Fast -> Halone combo, 2 would be Fast -> Goring and 3 would be Fast -> Royal Authority.
Then, in the example above, I would hit 3 3 2, since the combo path leading to Goring is updated to Goring Blade once Riot Strike is used from Combo path 3. I would have the exact same options as I do presently to take a different branch at the end of the path, just with fewer keybinds.

It's called playing a MMO.

If you're running out of space, invest in a MMO mouse which is designed specifically for this. I scarcely even use my keyboard—virtually everything can be done on my mouse. Using modifiers comes with the genre. The last thing I ever want to see is the game being simplified to the point we don't even need modifiers anymore. I actually want to press buttons, not spam the same few endlessly. That one change you cite is precisely what I don't want. Not only does 2221-1112 feel incredibly dull, it forces you to watch your hot bars more closely because you can no longer rely entirely on muscle memory.

Making it an option doesn't work because it won't remain an option. The devs aren't going to spend the resources necessary to implement a combo consolidation system into PvE only to also still prune out or simply not add new abilities. They're just going to tell anyone who dislike their combos on two buttons to "deal with it." So in reality, the only one who benefits is you. Not me. Hence why I want nothing to do with combo consolation.

On a separate note. I have to question your setup. Why would you ever put your main combo on 890E? Even without a dedicated MMO mouse, you should neither need to do that nor want to since three of those keys are in Narnia.

Being a healer, your dps spells arent your top priority, and they don't combo so that dont need to worry about GCD clipping or anything like that. You'll also only be dpsing when you're not to stressed, so you wouldnt typically be queuing up DPS spells anyway, and even if you were, you'd probably waste as much time changing targets anyway.

Uh... WHM would like to have a word with you about the near 500-600 DPS increase AST received almost exclusively because they made clipping your GCD a non-issue. Furthermore, there is zero scenarios where you aren't DPSing as a healer in this game. Even in Savage and Ultimate, you'll spend a significant amount of time dealing damage. Or have the opportunity to do so. The only excuse not to is when you're progging the fights.

[Derio]

Honestly I would like for the option to use the combo action to be there in PVE. Doesn't have to be mandatory but at least give us the option. Would certainly clean up my hotbars a lot.

[Sandpark]

Not to mention those moments, for whatever reason, where you're short on Kenki for a Midare so you want to Haka -> Jinpu (now you have your Kenki), Kaiten -> Midare, then finish your Jinpu combo for another Sen. If the combo was consolidated you're forced to waste a Sen.

In short, it just wouldn't work well for Sam.

Sam is no more complicated than the other jobs when it comes to core combos just has more strings. Monk has two single target strings, Sam has three single target strings, aka Monk would need two dedicated combo buttons and Sam would need three.
(1)Hakaze>(2)Jinpu>(3)Gekko= String 1 Gekko Combo
(1)Hakaze>(4)Shifu>(5) Kasha= String 2 Kasha Combo
(1)Hakaze>(6)Yukikaze= String 3 Yukikaze Combo

Non-consolidated equals six dedicated buttons, consolidated equals three dedicated buttons.
Now the rotation is 1,2,3 -> 1,4,5 -> 1,6.
Consolidated would be 1,1,1-> 2,2,2 -> 3,3.

With that short on kenki scenario in a consolidated combo, you would press 1,1, do kaiten -> Midare, then finish your Jinpu combo with 1.
Meikyo Shisui completely screws that consolidated idea though. You can't consolidate into fewer buttons then be able to do them separately..

So if they did try and consolidate Sam combos the effect or description of MS would have to be changed to something else like grants a full Kenki gauge and perhaps adds easier access to Hissatsu skills.

[Gemina]

What's the difference between
pressing 1, double weaving my ogcds, then pressing 2
or
pressing 1, double weaving my ogcds, then pressing 1 again?

I misunderstood the intention behind this combo button. Weaving is not an issue this way, but I still don't know how it would work as not everyone combos the same. NIN has three finishers; DRK goes either 1-2-3, or 1-4-5, so since the second skill either rotation is different they couldn't take advantage of this button in any way. I am sure each combo using a job can provide at least one con about this combo button.

It just seems wonky, and as I said earlier; there are better and more efficient ways to reduce/prevent button bloat. Some of which are issues that need to be addressed now, and not send everyone with muscle memory into a craze as they relearn how to execute their weaponskills.

[Gemina]

If a weave or double weave is really good or mandatory, wouldn't that mean it should become part of a combo aka the core of your rotation and not a may be good or useless to use ogcd?

Weaving might be mandatory for optimal play, but the ogcd skill that is being used is not per say. The ogcd you use if more than one is available should be the one that is the most optimal at that point in the fight. However, this is neither here or there anymore because I misunderstood the intention behind the combo button, which I thought would not leave windows open to weave ogcds in.

Are you saying the server or platform can't handle a big amount of skills or the controller can't?
The XIV hotbar interface can support 256 skills on controller. But just because it can, does not mean a user wants to cycle through all those skills in real time combat. ESO only has 12 active skills per class during combat. Twelve is too small, 256 is too large.

The controller can't. The reason it is limited to three bars or 48 skills is because of the quick access the controllers use. You have single tap L2/R2, Double tap L2/R2, and sequential tap L2->R2 or R2->L2. Yes, there are five whole other bars to fill up, but now you have to access those bars manually by holding R1, and pressing the appropriate directional key or button. You can also cycle just by tapping the R1 button, but imagine having to do that while executing an opener. This is without mention that many players share those other bars between all of their jobs, including crafters and gatherers.

Look at it this way. What happens if SE wants to add a third, fourth, fifth or sixth combo string later on to jobs whose core combos already consist of 3 or more hotbar slots?
Those slots double each string when not consolidated, if the amount of skills stay the same. Each skill is fighting for real estate space. If combo skills dominate the space, there is less room for unique buffs/debuffs,control skills, ogcd skills, and less room for skill modifiers.

Adding even one proc/combo based weapon skill to a jobs arsenal changes how you play it. After full combos are established, they don't get a whole lot of modifications with the exception of potency adjustments. I wouldn't expect such complex combo strings to ever be implemented into the game. While being proactive is a good trait, we still have the here and now to deal with.