Combo Action Button

[LastFireAce]

How about they don't touch DRG unless to buff it? I like the current stone rotation of drg... i love pressing so many bottom and yet no having this huge lag like NIN/MCH... my cup of tea.

[Alestorm]

I actually liked that rather than deleting skills like WoW does every expansion they've opted to making a more powerful version of an existing skill now. The only things I can see having an issue with ability bloat are DoH and DoL since you need all those skills as it stands now. Macros help, but shouldn't really be the long term fix.

[Sandpark]

Combos cannot and should not be consolidated in PvE. What you're talking about would change the PvE combat system entirely. I don't play a lot of jobs, but every single one I do weaves (sometimes double weaves) ogcds/instant abilities between the weaponskills required for their combos. And if even one job is impacted negatively, then the whole concept crashes and burns.

There is already a limit to the maximum number of skills the devs can implement and give us access to during PvE, and I am sure they are well aware of it. This is reduced greatly due to the game having players that use a controller. This basically gives the devs a maximum of 48 skills (excluding passive traits) to give players access to during combat, or 3 cross bars. The pet classes are an exception and use a 4th, and actually have room for additional skills on this bar if the devs wanted to go there.

There are simpler ways to reduce/prevent button bloat if this is your chief concern. For starters, some jobs have innate gcd skills that go unused because there is always a better gcd to use. Think Repose for WHM. I also believe the role skill system is either being revamped, or (hopefully) being done away with entirely. There are a lot of skills here that can just go away and we won't miss them. Several other skills were wrongfully taken away from their respective jobs, and you can probably expect jobs like AST and WHM to lose access to skills like Eye4Eye come 5.0.

If a weave or double weave is really good or mandatory, wouldn't that mean it should become part of a combo aka the core of your rotation and not a may be good or useless to use ogcd?

Are you saying the server or platform can't handle a big amount of skills or the controller can't?
The XIV hotbar interface can support 256 skills on controller. But just because it can, does not mean a user wants to cycle through all those skills in real time combat. ESO only has 12 active skills per class during combat. Twelve is too small, 256 is too large.

Look at it this way. What happens if SE wants to add a third, fourth, fifth or sixth combo string later on to jobs whose core combos already consist of 3 or more hotbar slots?
Those slots double each string when not consolidated, if the amount of skills stay the same. Each skill is fighting for real estate space. If combo skills dominate the space, there is less room for unique buffs/debuffs,control skills, ogcd skills, and less room for skill modifiers.

So the simpler way is to strip skills from the game rather than revise those less useful ones to be better? Consolidating skills streamlines and condenses but never removes options, omitting skills streamlines and removes options.

I agree with Reynhart saying that having multiple WS on one button would not change weaving much.

[Gemina]

If a weave or double weave is really good or mandatory, wouldn't that mean it should become part of a combo aka the core of your rotation and not a may be good or useless to use ogcd?

Weaving might be mandatory for optimal play, but the ogcd skill that is being used is not per say. The ogcd you use if more than one is available should be the one that is the most optimal at that point in the fight. However, this is neither here or there anymore because I misunderstood the intention behind the combo button, which I thought would not leave windows open to weave ogcds in.

Are you saying the server or platform can't handle a big amount of skills or the controller can't?
The XIV hotbar interface can support 256 skills on controller. But just because it can, does not mean a user wants to cycle through all those skills in real time combat. ESO only has 12 active skills per class during combat. Twelve is too small, 256 is too large.

The controller can't. The reason it is limited to three bars or 48 skills is because of the quick access the controllers use. You have single tap L2/R2, Double tap L2/R2, and sequential tap L2->R2 or R2->L2. Yes, there are five whole other bars to fill up, but now you have to access those bars manually by holding R1, and pressing the appropriate directional key or button. You can also cycle just by tapping the R1 button, but imagine having to do that while executing an opener. This is without mention that many players share those other bars between all of their jobs, including crafters and gatherers.

Look at it this way. What happens if SE wants to add a third, fourth, fifth or sixth combo string later on to jobs whose core combos already consist of 3 or more hotbar slots?
Those slots double each string when not consolidated, if the amount of skills stay the same. Each skill is fighting for real estate space. If combo skills dominate the space, there is less room for unique buffs/debuffs,control skills, ogcd skills, and less room for skill modifiers.

Adding even one proc/combo based weapon skill to a jobs arsenal changes how you play it. After full combos are established, they don't get a whole lot of modifications with the exception of potency adjustments. I wouldn't expect such complex combo strings to ever be implemented into the game. While being proactive is a good trait, we still have the here and now to deal with.

[Reynhart]

I wouldn't expect such complex combo strings to ever be implemented into the game.

DRG already have two 5-step combos, I don't see why other jobs couldn't.

[Gemina]

DRG already have two 5-step combos, I don't see why other jobs couldn't.

Because the combos have already been established. Adding another step to a combo for the other jobs is the same as adding a 6th step to a DRG combo.

Plus, we're talking like this is already an issue when it isn't. There is no reason to fix something that isn't even broken.

[Rongway]

Combos don't need to be reduced to single buttons, but actions that have specific conditions, or paired actions that are mutually exclusive, should be merged.

The following could be consolidated into single buttons:

Ley Lines → Between The Lines (conditional)
Blizzard IV → Fire IV (mutually exclusive) or Enochian → Blizzard IV (conditional)
Dreadwyrm Trance → Deathflare (conditional)
Summon Bahamut → Enkindle Bahamut (conditional)
Wind Blade → Burning Strike → Rock Buster (mutually exclusive) [note: pet basic]
Shockwave → Crimson Cyclone → Landslide (mutually exclusive) [note: pet interrupt]
Aerial Slash → Flaming Crush → Mountain Buster (mutually exclusive) [note: pet AoE]
Contagion → Radiant Shield → Earthen Ward (mutually exclusive) [note: pet support]
Eos Pet Actions → Selene Pet Actions (mutually exclusive)
The Wanderer's Minuet → Pitch Perfect (conditional)
Gauss Barrel → Barrel Stabilizer (conditional)
Jump → Mirage Dive (semiconditional)
Fang and Claw → Wheeling Thrust (mutually exclusive)
Hide → Trick Attack (conditional)
Third Eye → Merciful Eyes (conditional)

There might be some I missed.

Jolt II → Impact would be nice, but the arguments that can be made for it are the same arguments that can be made for consolidating skillchains into single buttons, so it doesn't really belong in the list.

[Rowde]

Combos don't need to be reduced to single buttons, but actions that have specific conditions, or paired actions that are mutually exclusive, should be merged.

The following could be consolidated into single buttons:

Hide → Trick Attack (conditional)

This one won't work since TA can be used after Suiton, but Suiton doesn't apply Hide. Suiton let's you use TA without Hide.


I do like this train of thought because this "conditional" change of abilities is already utilized in PvE, but only by a handful of jobs.

The buttons for WAR's Fell Cleave/Inner Beast and Steel Cyclone/Decimation automatically changed depending on what Stance they're in.

DRG's Geirskogul automatically changes to Nastrond when LotD is activated.

RDM Enhanced versions of melee change automatically when enough mana is stored.

SMN Ruin II changes automatically when the proc is activated.

[Rongway]

The following could be consolidated into single buttons:

Hide → Trick Attack (conditional)

This one won't work since TA can be used after Suiton, but Suiton doesn't apply Hide. Suiton let's you use TA without Hide.

Sure, but also, Hide can't be used in combat, so I think it would be okay to change the Hide Button to Trick Attack whether under the affect of Hide or Suiton.

The cases where you can currently do Suiton-> (EndCombat) -> Hide to reset Jutsu timer -> Trick Attack are limited to extremely close trash pulls, so replacing the Hide button with Trick Attack while Suiton is active wouldn't affect raids at all.