Thread: [Spoilers] The Patch 4.5 Lore Discussion Thread!

There's a lot to account for here but let's be frank: we were led to believe that there was a darker ending in store when Urianger seemingly betrayed the Scions in favor of helping the WoD. Don't forget it was a conversation between he and Elidibus that convinced him to intervene. **Spoiler** Let's also not forget about Ukukalhai who is the WoL from the shard that became the Void. Or at least one of them. (Its hinted that the shards that fell did so to an imbalance of either light or dark--if Ukukalhai is really from the Void then Ascians can also move through time because Voidsent have been around for hundreds if not thousands of years. Either that or there is more than one Voidshard.) Elidibus actually rescued him from that world and brought him to the First. ** More Spoiler ** When I saw Thancred in the Shadowbringers trailer with the child in the robe I immediately assumed it was Ukukalhai. It may not be but thats where my mind went. In have a gut feeling that in Shadowbringers we'll be shard hopping. But I guess we'll see.

Originally Posted by Ursa_Vonfiebryd

There's a lot to account for here but let's be frank: we were led to believe that there was a darker ending in store when Urianger seemingly betrayed the Scions in favor of helping the WoD. Don't forget it was a conversation between he and Elidibus that convinced him to intervene. **Spoiler** Let's also not forget about Ukukalhai who is the WoL from the shard that became the Void. Or at least one of them. (Its hinted that the shards that fell did so to an imbalance of either light or dark--if Ukukalhai is really from the Void then Ascians can also move through time because Voidsent have been around for hundreds if not thousands of years. Either that or there is more than one Voidshard.) Elidibus actually rescued him from that world and brought him to the First. ** More Spoiler ** When I saw Thancred in the Shadowbringers trailer with the child in the robe I immediately assumed it was Ukukalhai. It may not be but thats where my mind went. In have a gut feeling that in Shadowbringers we'll be shard hopping. But I guess we'll see.

I don't have access to my lorebook at the moment, but I don't think that Ukukalhai was a Warrior of Light in any capacity. He was a refugee from the Thirteenth Shard that became the void though. Elidibus transplanted his soul here I believe and if I remember correctly he did feel guilty knowing that he's probably inhabiting someone else's body on the prime at the moment. He even knows a bit about the circumstances that caused its destruction. I honestly doubt that he'll be a huge character for this expansion. He's connected to an old plotline that hasn't come up in a long time, and this is supposed to be a big progression of the Zodiark/Hydelyn arc. Also, the figure Thancred is holding appears to be a girl (although her appearance is purposely obscured.) It's probably the same figure as in this image.

Originally Posted by CaesarCV

I don't have access to my lorebook at the moment, but I don't think that Ukukalhai was a Warrior of Light in any capacity. He was a refugee from the Thirteenth Shard that became the void though. Elidibus transplanted his soul here I believe and if I remember correctly he did feel guilty knowing that he's probably inhabiting someone else's body on the prime at the moment. He even knows a bit about the circumstances that caused its destruction. I honestly doubt that he'll be a huge character for this expansion. He's connected to an old plotline that hasn't come up in a long time, and this is supposed to be a big progression of the Zodiark/Hydelyn arc. Also, the figure Thancred is holding appears to be a girl (although her appearance is purposely obscured.) It's probably the same figure as in this image.

I noticed that too. However considering that Elidibus will likely be playing a large role in the next patch if not the new expansion, the connection is not far fetched. I'm going by the dialogue for that arc but Ukukalhai was a potential warrior of light because of his Echo but was too young to do anything about the destruction of that world. Considering Solus and Gaius are both mainly from 1.0/2.0 you really can't dismiss anyone at this point. And Ukukalhai calls Elidibus his Master (I'll have to watch the cutscenes again but I'm fairly certain his master ends up being Elidibus as the final reveal). Just saying. Yeah its unlikely but certainly not that much of a stretch, even if its not him in the trailer (and its probably not--the voice was very feminine too i think).

Also as for Yugiri dying, she took a bad fall during her failed assassination attempt on Zenos. I wouldn't necessarily give that credence to her demise. Or anyones demise the way things are going.

Originally Posted by Anonymoose

This is going a tad off the rails in terms of claims without evidence; we don't want to get FFWiki levels of {{citation needed}}.

Sorry if I was ever misleading. I have to do most of my posting away from home at the moment due to holiday shenanigans, which makes it hard to access resources like the Lorebook or Garlond Tools. Thank you very much for the quotes! I haven't done that storyline in maybe 2 years now. I guess my memory of him talking sadly about how he's probably possessing a body here might have been a false one. That happens from time to time unfortunately. I'm still of the belief that the Scions had their souls/minds taken to another shard though. Unukalhai (of the strangely hard to spell name) could definitely appear in the next expansion, but I just feel a little skeptical he'll be terribly important since absolutely nothing from the Warring Triad plotline has actually been mentioned again. Sure Gaius came back up again, but he was mentioned a lot since his 'death', even during Stormblood itself. We'll see though.

Originally Posted by Anonymoose

On one hand, Gaius survived two large explosions from the Ultima weapon (one which threw him out of the cockpit and one right on top of his face) before the camera cut away from a third explosion while he was still standing - and that Gaius, Regula, and Varis have all shown us that a Garlean can be lifted into a passing transport in seconds (1.0 in Mor Dhona, 1.23 at the Halone's stone, 3.0 in the Sea of Clouds).

Hm...I'd be a little skeptical of reading too much into those sorts of capabilities. Villain escapes are one of those things that happen for more narrative reasons than in fiction ones. If they aren't supposed to die at this point in the plot, then teleportation or other methods work, and if they are supposed to die then they don't. Thordan slowly walking onto an airship is equivalent in a narrative sense to Garlean Magitek transport capabilities since both are just tools to get Villain A to Point B, and to make sure we can't kill them in that moment. It's the same reason that Stormtroopers in Star Wars are supposedly well trained enough for Old Ben Kenobi to recognize and mention it, but never hit the heroes. Narrative trumps in-universe logic in most works, FFXIV included.

That being said, 'airship escape' would be a fairly logical answer for how he managed to survive. They'll probably have some explanation...or just be coy/make a joke about it. Maybe he'll jump into a lead lined fridge to survive the blast...

I think it depends on how much how Gaius survived matters to the story. If it involves something like... taking the Heart of Sabik with him, then they'd better tell it.

The other thing to consider is how Gaius got to Ilsabard afterwards. Lore Book 2 has finally revealed what happened in Gyr Abania between Operation Archon and Stormblood. Shortly after Operation Archon, the XIIth Legion invaded Gyr Abania and took over the remaining XIth Legion members there including the Skulls. So Gaius would have had to make it through a region where everyone would hate him if he was discovered...

Amusingly, in the German text, Nero says basically "Hey, aren't you the one who tamed the Garlean wolf?" But none of the localizations use the word "killed" specifically—bested, defeated, vanquished. Just vague enough to leave that door open for a Days of Our Lives-style comeback. Also amusingly, Nero really makes zero attempt to conceal his identity, save for the mask; he has a very distinctive mode of speaking in the Japanese version and should be immediately recognizable unless the player skipped all the cutscenes.

Y'know, a part of me is not sure if Nero would save Gaius? Not after what he overheard during the Praetorium battles, and some of his earlier dialogue suggests that he wasn't really all that interested in the Legate's cause in the first place. To him, Ultima Weapon was, for the most part, just another bullet point on his "my future's so bright I gotta wear shades" CV (and he does, he literally does). He was angling to outshine everyone—Garlond, Baelsar, the Allagans, Timbuk3... And you know, Ultima Weapon did make a hell of an explosion...

On the other hand, he desperately wanted to be noticed by Gaius (which is a bit of a contradiction to the earlier point? TBH I think the Garlean scenes and characterization in ARR could use a little TLC and workshopping) and what better way to endear yourself to your soon-to-be-ex-boss than by literally pulling the guy out of said hell of an explosion? Anyway, we've seen that not even Nero is immune to the rare surge of altruistic energy.

So I dunno! I know nobody asked but I'm only 50/50 on whether Shadowhunter is actually even Gaius at all. I have my own theories but I guess we'll find out soon enough! My plot sense tends to be...bad. Really bad. So, grain of salt I guess.

(Also in re the Alliance raid... The whole magicite thing gives me super dodgy vibes but I can't quite put my finger on 'em. It reeks of something what oughta not be there. Garleans maybe. I dunno. Again, we'll see!)