Please Remove Tomestones currency

[Inosaska]

It's currently way better then what everyone has to do in WoW to gear up right now.

[NocturniaUzuki]

That's very much a matter of mindset. Coming from single player games myself, it still seems strange to be expected to keep paying and paying for a game forever. Anything else - I reach the end, I do finish it, and that's it. I've paid the same amount whether I play it over again, or come back to it in a few months, or never touch it again. It could be the best game I've ever played but I don't need to keep paying for it (or playing it non-stop) to show that I like it.

Calling it pathetic was probably a bit too far. You're right that there are all sorts of players. The problem is that the vast majority of players (and humans for that matter) seem to be utterly obsessed with material rewards. Someone asked how many times I would do something for "fun"? What the hell kind of question is that? I do it for fun. Every. Single. Time. Is there another reason to do anything in a game? What differs are peoples' definition of fun. Unfortunately, a lot of people seem to only have fun if they get to see a shiny reward. For these people, they quit as soon as they get their gear set, and so SQEX has to limit the system to keep this playerbase from ditching. As for me? I play for fun and challenge. I do a fight again and again until I get better. Then I make it harder and do it again. And then make it harder and do it again.

Unfortunately, I burn out sometimes too. But not because of a lack of new content or grinding too fast. I burn out because of built-up frustration with the playerbase. Waiting 3-4 hours for a party to solo heal Omega (Savage) in an any-chest party drains the soul. Especially when said party can't even do the mechanics. If I had hosted a 2-chest weekly, people would be all over it. But no - I take out some of the material reward and people avoid the party. The lack of people willing to join anything for the sake of the fight itself rather than rewards, and also the even further lack of talented players of that nature is what drives me to burn out.

[Makeda]

If it was removed what should replace it?

Here in FFXIV you have a timegate. Over in WoW you have 'random' and my raid group there had people using leveling gear on key slots like weapon as we entered 'hard mode' of the raid due to the luck of random drops. You'd get that one person who'd get a stack of drops on the first night, and that other person who'd have nothing weeks or months in...

Maybe the current tomestones are not working - all split into so many different types it can get silly... but the basic idea has a LOT of merit to a player like me coming from another game.

I used to run a guild in WoW... you don't want to know how annoying it is to watch your most dedicated, loyal, and studious raid member get nothing, while some new recruit gets it all, and then quits guild for a higher ranking one the next day...

In this game, it feels like as gated as we are, a team of people will usually keep pretty close pace with each other.

[HyoMinPark]

Calling it pathetic was probably a bit too far. You're right that there are all sorts of players. The problem is that the vast majority of players (and humans for that matter) seem to be utterly obsessed with material rewards. Someone asked how many times I would do something for "fun"? What the hell kind of question is that? I do it for fun. Every. Single. Time. Is there another reason to do anything in a game? What differs are peoples' definition of fun. Unfortunately, a lot of people seem to only have fun if they get to see a shiny reward. For these people, they quit as soon as they get their gear set, and so SQEX has to limit the system to keep this playerbase from ditching. As for me? I play for fun and challenge. I do a fight again and again until I get better. Then I make it harder and do it again. And then make it harder and do it again.

Unfortunately, I burn out sometimes too. But not because of a lack of new content or grinding too fast. I burn out because of built-up frustration with the playerbase. Waiting 3-4 hours for a party to solo heal Omega (Savage) in an any-chest party drains the soul. Especially when said party can't even do the mechanics. If I had hosted a 2-chest weekly, people would be all over it. But no - I take out some of the material reward and people avoid the party. The lack of people willing to join anything for the sake of the fight itself rather than rewards, and also the even further lack of talented players of that nature is what drives me to burn out.

You should probably calm down on the pretentious-sounding statements.

There is nothing wrong with doing content for things like chests in the hopes of getting gear, but you’re making it sound like the worst crime that could exist in this game. People’s definitions of fun are different, and people run content for different reasons; there is no “right way” or “wrong way” to do content or play a game. So some only do it because they want BiS. Plenty others do it to chase pretty numbers, or to learn new jobs, or simply because they’re bored. Who cares what people’s reasons are for doing content?

People not joining a solo-heal for current Savage is probably less about the chests and them simply not trusting the solo heal to play out in a smooth manner. For some people, repeated wiping due to deaths gets tiring.

[Iscah]

Calling it pathetic was probably a bit too far. You're right that there are all sorts of players. The problem is that the vast majority of players (and humans for that matter) seem to be utterly obsessed with material rewards. Someone asked how many times I would do something for "fun"? What the hell kind of question is that? I do it for fun. Every. Single. Time. Is there another reason to do anything in a game? What differs are peoples' definition of fun. Unfortunately, a lot of people seem to only have fun if they get to see a shiny reward. For these people, they quit as soon as they get their gear set, and so SQEX has to limit the system to keep this playerbase from ditching. As for me? I play for fun and challenge. I do a fight again and again until I get better. Then I make it harder and do it again. And then make it harder and do it again.

Fun is very subjective, and then there's "satisfaction" as a separate concept to "fun".

It might be satisfying to beat a hard boss and have it "over and done with" but you wouldn't want to put yourself through that difficult battle again. (And coming from single player games, you're not usually expected to beat difficult battles again, unless you start the entire game over.)

Or you might be willing to go through it - or even enjoy doing it - X amount of times to earn the rewards from it (for completion, glamour or whatever reason) but don't have any desire to do it over again when you're not making progress towards that goal. Especially when the format of the game means you're going to do it a lot of times even if you do only do it when you'll make progress.

And it comes down to what people enjoy. I don't really enjoy the high-level gameplay, but I do enjoy being in the game and following the story, and I enjoy playing around with glamours - so that would be my main driving factor for venturing into things like EX primals. But most of the time I just don't do it.

Getting rewards is not "fun" in itself, but getting all the pieces for a glamour idea and seeing it on my character is fun.


And I don't see what the actual problem is with people quitting once they have their gearset, if that's what they want. Obviously it's not what Square Enix wants, because of course they want to keep you subscribed for as long as possible... but for a player doing what they find enjoyable? They did the work, they earned the result, they "finished the game", and they don't have to stay around if they don't want to.

[NocturniaUzuki]

You should probably calm down on the pretentious-sounding statements.

There is nothing wrong with doing content for things like chests in the hopes of getting gear, but you’re making it sound like the worst crime that could exist in this game. People’s definitions of fun are different, and people run content for different reasons; there is no “right way” or “wrong way” to do content or play a game. So some only do it because they want BiS. Plenty others do it to chase pretty numbers, or to learn new jobs, or simply because they’re bored. Who cares what people’s reasons are for doing content?

People not joining a solo-heal for current Savage is probably less about the chests and them simply not trusting the solo heal to play out in a smooth manner. For some people, repeated wiping due to deaths gets tiring.

And you should stop judging opinion pieces as statements of fact. The purpose of forums is largely to share opinions. The reason I apologized for calling it pathetic was because that was too direct an expression of how I feel about it, and could too easily be taken as an insult.

I literally said "What differs is peoples' definitions of fun." In other words, that fun is subjective. I am not saying anything is "right" or "wrong" as an absolute. All I'm doing is expressing my opinion on the matter like everyone else. Just because I don't write "In my opinion..." before every sentence does not mean it is being argued as an absolute fact rather than my personal opinion. I'm writing responses to share my view on the matter and the frustration I feel about it. That's no different than what everyone else doing.

"I think it's frustrating that so many people people only find fun in material reward, and that, subsequently, there is a lack of players who share the same mindset I do."

Does that satisfy you? Because that's literally all I said, but with stronger language to illustrate the frustration I feel, plus examples from my experience. It may diverge from the immediate topic of tomes versus no tomes, but it is still on topic, as it is related. I'm simply point out that I believe the issue is not possible to solve due to the fact that it has less to do with tomes and more to do with player psychology.

[Reinha]

Mendacity tomestones are already not capped. They just reward the gear level which is appropriate for the time it takes to get those tomes.

[Mansion]

I'm a bit in between two mindsets on that topic. I get the point of capping, the logic of weekly rest and uncapping when relevant. It works fine for the way the game is designed (at least for endgame).
But...
What if they reinvented the wheel actually? The game has worked relatively fine that way for 5 years, and I'm seeing more and more people "bunrning out" that system by the end of the patch, and by the end of the expansion.
What if dungeons were actually useful? What if we had something else to build except gearing (especially when gear is not mandatory if you don't aim for high end content)? That's something I'd be happy to see the devs work on actually, more than changing the tome system for something else that would end up being the same in a way.

[HyoMinPark]

And you should stop judging opinion pieces as statements of fact. The purpose of forums is largely to share opinions. The reason I apologized for calling it pathetic was because that was too direct an expression of how I feel about it, and could too easily be taken as an insult.

I literally said "What differs is peoples' definitions of fun." In other words, that fun is subjective. I am not saying anything is "right" or "wrong" as an absolute. All I'm doing is expressing my opinion on the matter like everyone else. Just because I don't write "In my opinion..." before every sentence does not mean it is being argued as an absolute fact rather than my personal opinion. I'm writing responses to share my view on the matter and the frustration I feel about it. That's no different than what everyone else doing.

"I think it's frustrating that so many people people only find fun in material reward, and that, subsequently, there is a lack of players who share the same mindset I do."

Does that satisfy you? Because that's literally all I said, but with stronger language to illustrate the frustration I feel, plus examples from my experience. It may diverge from the immediate topic of tomes versus no tomes, but it is still on topic, as it is related. I'm simply point out that I believe the issue is not possible to solve due to the fact that it has less to do with tomes and more to do with player psychology.

Where am I saying I construed your statements as fact? Nowhere. I said that they sounded pretentious, because you’re treating anything other than what you personally find “fun” as inferior and “not fun”. At least, that’s the impression I get from your wording. That’s the issue I have with your posts. If that wasn’t your intention, then work on your wording, because that’s how it sounds.

The statement I made about the “right” and the “wrong” ways to play a game come from your previous statement, where you say:

The underlying issue here is that players grind then quit without these limitations in the first place. If more human beings were less pathetic, they wouldn't need to resort to annoying limitations to hold onto players who apparently enjoy quitting the game they "like" as soon as they "finish" it.

This makes it sound like anything that isn’t your preferred method is “wrong”, when people have plenty of preferred ways to play a game. None of which are correct or incorrect.

[Ssmiley_Bjakkzz]

well its simple just a different playstyle i would wish for the game and thats not what SE makes and some dont agree for and also for example whats up with gearing up and become strong when you anyways going on with synced down duties, i dont see the point in why that should be, well for those that say it would unbalance the game for other players, then why not lose the chain off the limit requirement party ups of 4-24 players and be able to go run for yourself or with someone than full party, theres unsynced yes but let that be accessable for how you wanna play they game, i pay for the sub for christ sake lol, let me play how i want my game than put in restrictions for you can do that and you cant do this.
Simple said really. FFxiv needs a total re-makeover in my opinion, because its still a fun game envoirment atmosphere of pretty and lore, just system is so messed up.