Risk Factor. Can I have it?

[Rokien]

This whole talk of death penalty being required to enforce a sense of difficulty is BS to be honest.

If you join an Ifrit group or even go with LS members and die because you are a pleb the penalty is that you don't win, this is penalty enough IMO, no doubt if you continue to die or cause the group to lose they will no longer want to play with you, again penalty enough.

I would have to disagree, if you can die and just retry it with no repercussions, its not a penalty. The group breaking up is not a penalty either, you can just make a new one. I don't even take ifrit seriously, if I die, I die, I don't care, there is no stress, no nothing when fighting ifrit/moogle/any mob. Why do people like Demon/Dark souls? Because of the stress, it gets em wired up and makes them feel something. People like to feel emotion, whether it be bad or good. IMO demon souls had the best death penalty. You die, have to do the level all over again, you die again, you lose all your souls(if you didn't reach it in time). NOW, the added stress of someone breaking in added even more emotion to the game. You start to panic because you have not reached your souls yet.... The game itself was easy, the combat was easy, mobs were not hard if you knew their patterns. Though even if the combat was easy, you were always worrying about dieing. So you die in cause of that.

Of course, that is just talking just for myself.

[Arcell]

I would have to disagree, if you can die and just retry it with no repercussions, its not a penalty. The group breaking up is not a penalty either, you can just make a new one. I don't even take ifrit seriously, if I die, I die, I don't care, there is no stress, no nothing when fighting ifrit/moogle/any mob. Why do people like Demon/Dark souls? Because of the stress, it gets em wired up and makes them feel something. People like to feel emotion, whether it be bad or good. IMO demon souls had the best death penalty. You die, have to do the level all over again, you die again, you lose all your souls(if you didn't reach it in time). NOW, the added stress of someone breaking in added even more emotion to the game. You start to panic because you have not reached your souls yet.... The game itself was easy, the combat was easy, mobs were not hard if you knew their patterns. Though even if the combat was easy, you were always worrying about dieing. So you die in cause of that.

Of course, that is just talking just for myself.

Right and that's all well and good except Demon's Souls was created specifically for a hardcore audience who likes being mercilessly punished apparently. Final Fantasy XIV was not created with the hardcore audience in mind and even since Yoshida has taken over has continued to cater to a more casual audience than FFXI. If you want a really hardcore game, FFXIV is not it and I don't think it ever will be.

[Rokien]

Right and that's all well and good except Demon's Souls was created specifically for a hardcore audience who likes being mercilessly punished apparently. Final Fantasy XIV was not created with the hardcore audience in mind and even since Yoshida has taken over has continued to cater to a more casual audience than FFXI. If you want a really hardcore game, FFXIV is not it and I don't think it ever will be.

LOL the biggest casual gamer I know even played demon souls and loved it!~ there for hardcore mechanics can work in a casual game ^.^
He also thinks this game is way easy. Even though he doesn't like to put effort into it.

[Arcell]

LOL the biggest casual gamer I know even played demon souls and loved it!~ there for hardcore mechanics can work in a casual game ^.^
He also thinks this game is way easy. Even though he doesn't like to put effort into it.

Okay, good for you. You know someone who likes the game. Doesn't change the fact that this game was not created with a hardcore audience in mind.

That's not to say we don't need more difficult content, however timesinks and masochistic death penalties do not equal difficulty. More challenging mob AI, longer fights and fights that require strategy and thinking are difficult.

[Rokien]

Okay, good for you. You know someone who likes the game. Doesn't change the fact that this game was not created with a hardcore audience in mind.

That's not to say we don't need more difficult content, however timesinks and masochistic death penalties do not equal difficulty. More challenging mob AI, longer fights and fights that require strategy and thinking are difficult.

This game is ment for casuals, you said it yourself, they cant add hard stuff!~ aka more challenging mob AI

In an mmo, you can't have two polar opposites. You can't go easy/hard, people will complain and they will bump the hard down to normal/easy. You can have hard and exrta hard, or easy and medium. In the end one group has to be shafted ^.^. Also, if you are playing an MMO you can't complain about time ^.^ if you don't have the time, an mmo is not for you.

[Arcell]

This game is ment for casuals, you said it yourself, they cant add hard stuff!~ aka more challenging mob AI

Don't go sticking words in my mouth, casual players can handle difficulty. I consider myself a bit of a casual player and I fully welcome difficult fights. I do not, however, welcome wastes of my time due to masochistic death penalties, obnoxiously stupid lock out timers and the like.