Please stop making Eureka

[Magic-Mal]

Translation: It's crap, and it's going to keep being crap. Just deal with it and enjoy it even though you don't enjoy it. Stop complaining.

Basically...

[HyoMinPark]

Yeah right, they totaly won't gate more and more cool thing behind it like they do since years and will totaly rework already done instances.

Diadem died fast, close to no one did it and we still get Eureka, keep on dreaming embargo works on big companies.

Where was I talking about reworking Eureka?
I think it’s well past the point of no return. Any “reworks” now are simply damage control.

Based on your responses to those who replied to your first comment, it was clear that a nerve was struck. I’m sorry I disagree with blindly chasing carrots on a stick regardless of how miserable one is, and I’m sorry I disagree with sending the wrong message to game developers (i.e., “I’m not actually enjoying Eureka, but you’re going to think I am because I continue to throw myself into the content for those shiny carrots you dangle before me!”).

I think the developers are well aware that Eureka is a failure. I also think they were well aware that people wouldn’t touch the content if the Relic wasn’t shoved in there, which is why the Relic is in there in the first place. There’s carrot number one. Now that people dropped off in Pagos, they try to dangle more carrots—emotes, glamour, minions, mounts, and now housing items and hairstyles. I’ll never forget a review I read on Eureka right after Pagos was released, and it was fairly reasonable in its assessment and presentation: it said that the developers took the aspects most hated from FFXI and shoved them into a game where they simply will not work (mostly, I believe they were referring to the mob-chaining that Pagos is built on).


But, again, I’m sorry that I disagree with miserably chasing carrots.

My time in-game is better spent elsewhere.

nd keeping on "just don't do it it will change" is false

Again, where was I actively talking about non-participation sparking change?

Not participating seems to be the only way the developers will acknowledge that Eureka is a mess that most people do not like, because they don’t seem to listen to the constructive feedback given about it—or, if they do, it feels cursory at best. Stepping foot in there tells them that you will do whatever it takes to get a shiny, regardless of how miserable you are. And that’s not the message I want to send video game developers.

People are more than welcome to enjoy the content—but if you don’t enjoy it and go in anyways to chase the shiny carrot? Sorry, I don’t really agree with such a practice.

Nowhere in here did I say anything that non-participation would spark change. I said that it seems to be the only way to show them that Eureka is a mess, because clearly writing novels telling them as such doesn’t.

I love this game. But I will not be blind to its flaws, and I will not be miserable while playing it. No matter how pretty the carrot. If the grind isn’t worth it to me, it isn’t worth it.

[BillyKaplan]

keep on dreaming embargo works on big companies.

What embargo? The one where so many people say they hate it and keep doing it anyway? That one?

[Alleo]

One of the biggest problems is all the people who say they hate Eureka but "only do it for the relic/hair/glamour" then complain non-stop about Eureka.

Don't do Eureka just for some item or hairstyle. That makes you a number on Eureka's Participation records, showing Yoshi that "People are playing this!" Just don't play it at all.

In a way, those who unhappily play Eureka are part of the problem simply because they help bump participation numbers.

You are right. People do kinda need to test the content first to give an opinion about it but if you are still in Pyros, even after truly hating Eureka you are just giving the devs false numbers. I understand that people want certain items but there is a time where maybe one should stop and ask themselves if they are not helping the devs with that thus maybe even create more of such content in the future.

I was in Anemos for a few days, first to try it out but also for the T-Rex mount. Yet I also (after seeing how bad it was imo) I gave myself a dead line and that I would stop playing it at x day even if I still did not have a mount. Thankfully I got it but after that I set no foot in it again because I did not want to further give the devs more participation numbers..if we had questionnaire after doing it where we could give them our opinion about this, then this might have been different but in the end, if you dislike it that much and still do it then you give them reasons to do more, because not only might they believe that people like it but might see that putting huge amount of items behind it might be incentive enough, no matter how boring or repetitive the content is.

(On the other hand I can fully understand why people still do it and I have no ill feelings towards them. Because in the end its SEs fault that they are reading numbers that way and either ignore feedback on the forum or not give us any ingame way to give them feedback)

[Schan]

I know someone mentioned Glamours... the thing is with Glamours and some other content we see room for improvement.

I don't really see that for Eureka. Sure they could add it dailies but that would be sort of like beast tribe dailies. The base gameplay is still boring. You sit there slapping mobs, hoping that nothing 2 levels above you aggros your bum until the fate spawns and cash in. They're not even smart mobs. Furthermore closest to dailies is the challenge log (which are basically weeklies). It's even more frustrating to me when I realize that I lost extra content that i enjoy because of the sheer amount of resources/ money pumped into Eureka so I understand why they are pushing it so hard. It's not easy having to explain to your boss you pumped a ton of money into a complete failure.

I'm sure a there were a couple of people who enjoyed bits of 1.0. Still doesn't mean it wasn't a failure. Please cut your loses and nuke it like you did FFXIV 1.0. Just stop. I do not want an eureka reskin in 5.0.

edit: I actually enjoyed Diadem. This does NOT mean i want a Diadem reskin in 5.0 either.

[LauraAdalena]

Long response, but I feel it’s necessary, just so I don’t have to touch this subject again,

You're wasting everyone's time AND MONEY with this useless crapfest. And this is me being as nice as I possibly can.

Ftfy

You realize this is all content that’s been in development for months already and they aren't just going to not release it.

Yep.

Eureka, by some peoples thoughts, is successful for them. Glamours clearly havent been, due to all the complaining here on the forums.

Ultimate is probably about as successful as eureka, probably less actually, in terms of number of people able to access and do the content.

Yep. Doesn’t mean it’s actually successful. I know that lots of people I know stopped caring about Eureka, and as someone who loved Diadem 2.0 and enjoyed Anemos when I could get parties with my friends and get drunk, Pagos killed all interest for Pyros and the following, and no fixes will change that. And I get the feeling 90% of the playerbase who liked Anemos felt this way, and 100% of the people who disliked Anemos but still did it just quit as soon as the chains were the best thing. Feelings do not equal reality. Is it keeping players engaged and subscribed? No. So therefore, it’s not successful. Also, comparing Ultimate to Eureka, as many have pointed out, is a severe misunderstanding of who Ultimate is aimed toward. You are comparing content aimed toward hardcore players to content aimed toward casual players that doesn’t really understand the casual mindset or time constraints.

Oh also, comparing people’s complaints of glamours just because they can’t apply them where they used to, as well as never getting a furnishing for the Glamour Dresser is a huge difference. The glamour plates give us a lot more than we used to have, a free glamour of every piece of gear without having to spend another glamour prism and set them to specific classes? Sign me up! I still have the complaints above, but they aren’t complaints… more constructive criticisms since they seem to not want to restrict us to sanctuaries anymore, but then just decided randomly to re-restrict us to sanctuaries and inns.

I'd rather have new chocobo racing tracks than more Eureka.

PLEASE. I WANT A MORE DONUTS TRACK OR CCH TRACK. Hell, rework chocobo racing and let me ride any mount I want.

Then consider that people DO play Eureka, and some enjoy it. The majority might complain about it all day long, but as long as people are setting foot in the instances, SE will consider it to be working - devs usually just see the game from the back end, through numbers of participants. I daresay that when I log on tonight, there will be multiple full instances of Pyros.

Yes. I do enjoy Diadem 2.0. No, the actual Diadem 2.0 with Emergency Missions was actually kinda fun. But that doesn’t mean I don’t understand that so few people are actually playing the content to warrant it to keep running right now in SB when few people actually set foot in it, nor does it warrant this being worth SE’s time when so little of the playerbase does it. Also, I think they know how poorly the content has been received because of how few people are actually playing it, hence why Pagos is the fastest nerfed relic step in the history of the game. Not even the 20/20/20/20 (Unidentified) or Book step were nerfed that fast, and both of those are considered the worst steps in the game.

No, it’s not as bad as either of those, but good god do so few people actually want to do it. Hell, I put myself through the Unidentified step and felt rewarded after I did it, after finishing Anemos I felt like “Cool. Now what?” That’s just my opinion based off of many others.

It IS an MMO. If people want to do the content, they can grab a group of friends and hop in. Thats what I've been doing with Anemos. I have 2 friends that absolutely refused to do it after they stepped in and killed a couple mobs by themselves.

They actually enjoy it now when we've been doing it as a group.

I also think some people go in with the mindset of "this is a grind, I hate grinds, I hate this."

Actually, I love a good grind. There are grinds in this game and many others that, in my opinion, are extremely rewarding when done well. How do you do a grind that’s successful and fun? Reward the player every set step/point. IE, I know people will disagree with me now but let’s give this the context of at the time when healer’s didn’t have accuracy and accuracy was an actual thing in the game, the aethersand step as a scholar was really fun and felt like I was making myself stronger. Other games that do it right, imo, outside of FFXIV?

Fire Emblem: Awakening with its relationship system and how you develop relationships to make your army stronger felt extremely rewarding when you’d grind.

FFV’s job system and how maxing out jobs and leveling jobs gave more abilities for you to use outside of the job it’s on AND stat gains for the base class, Freelancer, was extremely rewarding and felt really good when you’d max a job and switch to a new one.
Those are just my examples, and I feel like Eureka does neither of what those games do in terms of rewarding the player for the grind instead giving weapons that, for some people, aren’t even worth it unless you really want glamour.

Also, Anemos is good. It’s not great, but it does enough good for me to actually say I enjoy it, but only with friends especially when I can drink with them. Pagos was not fun, even drunk. I don’t even know how to say it outside of just telling you that I can not enjoy Pagos drunk. I cannot speak about Pyros, but honestly… The RNG stats (especially since I stopped raiding due to personal things) are not worth it for me, especially on the classes that don’t get good weapons on Suzaku. I’d much rather put in the effort to get a party and do Suzaku again for a weapon that’s not as good for my class than have to finish Pagos’ weapon and do Pyros. And just leveling in Pyros isn’t rewarding to me, because I don’t get anything out of it.

----

Alright, so enough replying to comments and here’s my opinion:

They keep messing up Eureka. It’s a solid concept, but what they should have done so they weren’t stuck with pushing out what they had last minute was released Anemos on the first .5 patch of the game and actually took the criticism from it. I personally feel like they put themselves in a corner where they don’t have time to apply people’s criticisms or if they do they are blatantly ignoring them, even from the Japanese side which they are usually extremely open to listening to. It’s a bizzare feeling of like they want and need to release this content but they haven’t taken any criticism to make it actually good to a majority of the players. I feel like they’ve forced themselves into a crunch period of astronomical proportions and to get it done they have to reuse systems from Anemos and Pagos to actually get it done.

I’m not excusing this behavior, nor am I even saying that they should not have released the content at all or saying that they have a chance. They don’t, they are too close to the end of the expansion and said earlier, they pushed themselves into a corner. In all honesty, they could have done something like this that was good, but they made us wait too long, they are now cramming it down our throats as fast as possible, and my personal opinion is…

This is not content. Content in the game should be stuff we actually can return to at most points and be able to do it. This is limited time content. Content like diadem where once its use has been fulfilled when it’s on-content people will just leave it and never come back. And it’s already happening, with Anemos and Pagos being practically empty at points (Or so I’ve heard) meaning people who actually want the relic will have to wait for a nerf. And no, that’s not how it should be. If it’s intended to be content to keep us hooked and they’re just going to nerf it later down the road, this is not well-designed content. This is content that was meant to hold us over and little more. Even dungeons have more use than that given the HW relic requires certain dungeons to be done, and the 50/60 roulette becomes really good if you have them all unlocked. And fates? At least those are used for relics in ARR and heavensward, and are used by DPS waiting for queues to get leveling faster.

Diadem, Eureka, and other content like these are not good content if when they stop being relevant they’ll just be shoved aside and never acknowledged or even have their use stripped of them in the cases of Diadem where the Unidentifiable Crafted items are now in the Grand Companies and no longer need to be HQ so you just buy one and you’re done. Content like this is not healthy for the game as a whole and makes content seem slimmer when you step back and analyze what content people will actually be doing after its time in the sun is gone.

That is my opinion, whether you share it or not is whatever. I’m done talking about this, and I think I’m going to take a break from this game as a whole and go finish FFV now, because at least when I’m grinding there I can have fun.

[InkstainedGwyn]

I would also like to point out to all of the people who enjoy Eureka (leaving "enjoy" alone, it's their definition) - if they hadn't crammed a bunch of non-Eureka stuff (glamours, hairstyles, emotes, mounts, housing items) into Eureka, most of us would be leaving you alone with your enjoyment. I've said it and I'll say it again - I don't care if Eureka is in the game, because I support giving content to different groups, just like I supported Ultimate, I supported Rival Wings, I support the various other pieces of content. My complaint is when they try to jam content that 1) is for other groups, when the original idea was to have "something for everyone" or 2) supposed to be catered to the majority of the game, into something that a minority enjoys. Because whatever you want to say, the Primal/Savage weapons were for the raiders, and the relic was for the rest of us who wanted something to invest some time into but not do raids/spend 39 hours a day.

[AbandonHopeTD]

The eureka instances are "busy" because there is 136 standing at the aether and 8 spawning nm's

[Nariel]

Nha I don't tell everybody should enjoy it, I say people will keep do it for the reward because they love this reward more than they hate the content, they will complain about how much unfun it is, and keeping on "just don't do it it will change" is false, they will just recoat it with another paintcolor so yeah people still do it even if its boring, sure it have to change but be real, it won't even if only 10 people do it like diadem. Maybe because they love this game even if he have flaws who know ?!

[BillyKaplan]

Nha I don't tell everybody should enjoy it, I say people will keep do it for the reward because they love this reward more than they hate the content, they will complain about how much unfun it is, and keeping on "just don't do it it will change" is false, they will just recoat it with another paintcolor so yeah people still do it even if its boring, sure it have to change but be real, it won't even if only 10 people do it like diadem. Maybe because they love this game even if he have flaws who know ?!

People like you are why Diadem is on the verge of being scrapped with many of the worthwhile awards from it being in HoH now, but Eureka only keeps getting more and more shinies locked behind it. Because what didn't work for Diadem apparently works for Eureka.
Hell at least Diadem is good for gatherers.