SCH needs some nerfs

[Rosa_Frandlia]

I was thinking of Focus being the base ability truth be told. What I'd propose is something rather basic, like adding an additional 100 potency to your next Ruin spell, plus the current MP boost you already get from the current ED. This would then diverge via a trait gained at 30, allowing it to affect the next three Ruin spells for SMN, and allowing SCH to instead add a separate 100 flat healing potency to Physick or Adlo, without affecting the shield potency of the latter at all. It could later be improved to affect AoE spells too, possibly, though I'm hesitant to do that on either class given their AoE damage is already fine as it is. It could, however, add more healing potency to Succor in a similar manner. Just boosting the flat heal and not the shield. I'm just reluctant to even do that without a nerf to Indom itself.

A complete re-work as a buff? While not a bad idea (especially for scholar), that would actually mean a total re-work on summoner as they need to use three aetherflow skills to unlock their cap abilities from both HW and (6 total) SB in deathflare and demi-bahamut after two uses of 3 stacks of aetherflow. While that may not be a bad thing, I wonder if SE would go for it. Aetherflow stacks are a key right now to the rotation on summoner.

That is is the problem with two jobs coming from archanist, to look at changing its skills you effect not one but both. Also if you have nothing that eats away aetherstacks until 30 with bane, they would then have to be put onto a timer like greased lightning on the monk. That would totally change both classes into much more complex forms of themselves.

I'm just playing devil's advocate, but looking through all effects is definitely something to do. If the classes become unplayable at lower levels, that is something we don't want for people leveling them. I'm in the camp of sch is fine as is, get whm and ast more in line with it is better than nerfing scholar. We wouldn't even be having this discussion if whm and ast were on par, not whm lagging behind so far in end game content.

I just hope I don't get booted from a party like at the start of SB for being whm due to how much was taken from whm's toolkit with Shadowbringers.

[Grimoire-M]

Why would they not just use Lustrate instead?

It would still restore MP at the same rate that ED does. I don't get why you missed that. The only reason for it to affect healing potency at all is to give it a minor boost beyond simply restoring MP, without affecting SCH's shield potency at all. SCH already has a lot of tools to improve their shields. They don't need another. Their GCD heals, however? They could use the boost sometimes, particularly in ARR when the 150 potency heal on Succor and WD are all you have for topping off a dumb group. And there are still level cap situations where you have to toss out Physicks. Alliance Roulette's a good example. You can't lustrate a different party member. And the MP boost would help pad through the loss of using Raise repeatedly more than the Lustrate would, while the healing boost would help make up for spending Aetherflow in that manner. It's not good by any means, but it gives SCH slightly more reach in their worst area, without touching on their best. Most likely you'll simply use it on a Ruin II to move/weave later regardless. That's plenty. It doesn't need to 'beat Lustrate' in potency to be worth using when it already pays for 80% of an Adlo and a third of a res. It's something minor that would be appreciated in Alliance roulette and ARR more than anything.

DPS wise, however, it's still a significant nerf, because it only works on Ruin spells. Not Miasma II, not Broil II. Ruin II is the only DPS spell left on SCH's kit that it would work on. And as a result it is a 50 potency nerf per ED used in the best case scenario, which is one where you're specifically out of melee range or need to move for a long consecutive period of time regardless of whether you're in melee range or not. It's a complete loss if you were using Miasma II to weave them in as much as possible, because now you're cutting into your Miasma II usage in order to weave it in at all, forcing you to instead use Ruin II. You'll rarely weave Miasma II in at all this way, basically only when you had to use the potency of a prior SCH-Focus on a GCD heal instead, already have Bio II rolling, and have to move/weave, and are in melee-range, which is pretty restrictive as it is. So yes, it addresses the problem on all fronts. The only concern you might still have is how to spend all of that MP you've effectively gained from cutting out Miasma II, which...hey, you could use it on your expensive healing spells. Or just keep spamming Broil II. Either way, it's less damage compared to what SCH can currently do. How much simply varies from fight to fight.

A complete re-work as a buff? While not a bad idea (especially for scholar), that would actually mean a total re-work on summoner as they need to use three aetherflow skills to unlock their cap abilities from both HW and (6 total) SB in deathflare and demi-bahamut after two uses of 3 stacks of aetherflow. While that may not be a bad thing, I wonder if SE would go for it. Aetherflow stacks are a key right now to the rotation on summoner.

This is an ED replacement, with nearly the same functionality ED currently has for SMN's specific interactions. The rest of both kits are completely untouched. The only restriction it would need is for the Ruin stacks to only exist inside combat to prevent opener shenanigans. Hell the SMN-Focus trait could trade away the MP for the extra damage just to preserve their current MP values. Regarding Aethertrail, it would proc when you use SMN-Focus, like any Aetherflow ability currently does. It does not gain Aethertrail stacks when you expend the Ruin stacks it gives. All of the current SMN aetherflow abilities require an enemy to be present to work at all though, which cuts into your rotation during jump phases. This guarantees you can get DWT and Bahamut rolling on time, no matter what the fight's like, and lets you go for a Fester/SMN-Focus/Fester opener, which has the same timings as the Fester/Painflare/Fester opener but doesn't lose potential potency to speed it up. It actually lets you squeeze more into the current DWT. Bahamut is the only exception due to the way it interacts with your oGCDs, requiring a target to proc Wyrmwave, but it doesn't change up the core rotation much. You'd use it twice in your non-bahamut Aetherflow window (SMN-Focus/Fester/SMN-Focus) to get to DWT faster and use 3-4 stacks inside DWT for a minor boost of 30-40 potency every 2 minutes. If the Aetherflow lockouts were removed you'd be repeating the opener inside DWT anyways since Fester/SMN-Focus/Fester fits in cleaner than Triple Fester does, which is still 90 potency every 2 minutes over the current rotation for comparison.

The reason for the divergence from the base ability of Focus into two distinct Job-specific abilities is simply because SCH and SMN have different needs that ED doesn't help with, but those needs still share some commonalities. It's a slot worth replacing on both jobs, and functionally what it does is still similar on both, but tweaked to deal with their respective problems. SMN needs an ability to use Aetherflow on during downtime, and specifically needs it to compete with Fester to be worthwhile to use at all. SCH needs the MP more than it needs the potency, and I address the latter concerns above. Focus is specifically so Arcanist has something to do at a low level and ties it all together.

[Rosa_Frandlia]

This is an ED replacement, with nearly the same functionality ED currently has for SMN's specific interactions. The rest of both kits are completely untouched. The only restriction it would need is for the Ruin stacks to only exist inside combat to prevent opener shenanigans. Hell the SMN-Focus trait could trade away the MP for the extra damage just to preserve their current MP values. Regarding Aethertrail, it would proc when you use SMN-Focus, like any Aetherflow ability currently does. It does not gain Aethertrail stacks when you expend the Ruin stacks it gives. All of the current SMN aetherflow abilities require an enemy to be present to work at all though, which cuts into your rotation during jump phases. This guarantees you can get DWT and Bahamut rolling on time, no matter what the fight's like, and lets you go for a Fester/SMN-Focus/Fester opener, which has the same timings as the Fester/Painflare/Fester opener but doesn't lose potential potency to speed it up. It actually lets you squeeze more into the current DWT. Bahamut is the only exception due to the way it interacts with your oGCDs, requiring a target to proc Wyrmwave, but it doesn't change up the core rotation much. You'd use it twice in your non-bahamut Aetherflow window (SMN-Focus/Fester/SMN-Focus) to get to DWT faster and use 3-4 stacks inside DWT for a minor boost of 30-40 potency every 2 minutes. If the Aetherflow lockouts were removed you'd be repeating the opener inside DWT anyways since Fester/SMN-Focus/Fester fits in cleaner than Triple Fester does, which is still 90 potency every 2 minutes over the current rotation for comparison.

The reason for the divergence from the base ability of Focus into two distinct Job-specific abilities is simply because SCH and SMN have different needs that ED doesn't help with, but those needs still share some commonalities. It's a slot worth replacing on both jobs, and the functionally what it does is still similar on both, but tweaked to deal with their respective problems. SMN needs an ability to use Aetherflow on during downtime, and specifically needs it to compete with Fester to be worthwhile to use at all. SCH needs the MP more than it needs the potency, and I address the latter concerns above. Focus is specifically so Arcanist has something to do at a low level and ties it all together.

I had another thought you may like, tie ED soley to the INT stat. This would make it have declining strength just like Physick to the summoner. This wouldn't touch archanist at all, meaning nothing would be changed there. I know it goes against all DPS coming from MND in SB, but it would likely also give the effect you want without messing with SMN at all and making it not as effective for SCH. I wouldn't think this would have too much coding at all to change, but give both SMN and SCH a spell that is useful while leveling (especially to 50 where gear has both MND and INT) and after that give it diminishing returns. Change the tooltip, change it so it goes off INT, done. No major re-work to either SCH or SMN.

[Grimoire-M]

I had another thought you may like, tie ED soley to the INT stat. This would make it have declining strength just like Physick to the summoner. This wouldn't touch archanist at all, meaning nothing would be changed there. I know it goes against all DPS coming from MND in SB, but it would likely also give the effect you want without messing with SMN at all and making it not as effective for SCH. I wouldn't think this would have too much coding at all to change, but give both SMN and SCH a spell that is useful while leveling (especially to 50 where gear has both MND and INT) and after that give it diminishing returns. Change the tooltip, change it so it goes off INT, done. No major re-work to either SCH or SMN.

I don't think changing one button qualifies as a major rework to either job, particularly when the individual components of the ability I presented exist in other forms already. The only odd bit really is that it uses Refresh potency rather than a percentage boost on a non-combat ability.