Doman Reconstruction: Watchtower issues

[Remedi]

It would also be wrong to say that the nation is semi-justified, because honestly, there's not a lot of indication that the nation is at fault. You mentioned that brothels and selling folks into them is not illegal in Doma, but is that actually true? Just because we saw it happen to Yotsuyu doesn't mean that it was above board. Brothels and sexual slavery are illegal in most of the civilized world today - but they still happen, all the same. I might buy that brothels are legal, but the impression I get from the game was that King Kaien was an extremely kind and beloved king. It seems unlikely that even under Garlean occupation he would allow slavery to be a legal thing, sexual or not. No, I'm fairly convinced that Yotsuyu's being sold was definitely a shady affair, not one that is socially or legally acceptable.

All that said, though, Yotsuyu's story is still one worth telling: beat someone down long enough, and they may eventually snap and bite back. The Golden Rule is a good thing; treat others as you would have them treat you. Yotsuyu was stepped on her whole life, and when she obtained the power to do so was all-too happy to step on others in turn. Abuse is a cycle, and the abused often pay it forward and become abusers themselves. These are good lessons to learn, and it would do potential abusers good to be made aware of the kind of extremes to which their actions can lead.

My point exactly

[TheMightyMollusk]

So if someone was abused in your city, someone you did not even know, or at that time was not even born and they came back to murder everyone, including your family, would you truly just say: Well I can understand that, lets forgive that person, we are kinda all at fault here and lets built a grave for them?

There's a difference between "burial to put a body in the ground" (see Zenos) and "honored memorial" (see Haurchefant), but either way, it's a grave.

Of course, unless it becomes a plot point, we'll never see it anyway. (Did she even leave a body to bury? I forget, but Ysayle and Thordan faded into aether after they died as primals.)

[Iscah]

While it's important that Yotsuyu's story is told and learned from and not forgotten, making a grave (or more likely a memorial) to her in the city would be the wrong approach. In time the people might be ready to hear it and regard her with pity, but for now it would be a reminder of those still-raw memories of suffering - every bit as much as the watchtower they've chosen to tear down.

And talking of memorials....

There's a difference between "burial to put a body in the ground" (see Zenos) and "honored memorial" (see Haurchefant), but either way, it's a grave.

Haurchefant's memorial actually isn't a grave either, at least as we'd define it - his body isn't buried there. (It's not pointed out, but Corentiaux at Camp Dragonhead mentions it if you talk to him.) Which seemed an odd thing, particularly as the pre-existing stone cairns are referred to as a graveyard in one of the dragoon quests, but the question got brought up in a Korean Q&A a few weeks back and the answer is rather lovely.

Discussion thread: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...A-with-Yoshida
Document link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...ClxamIIE64ca0/

Q: Apparently Haurchefant’s body is not buried under his monument. Where exactly is he?

[Yoshida]: To answer this, we probably have to ask the FFXIV lore team. My simple answer is that Haurchefant is part of lineage of Fortemps and I’m sure he was buried with other great peoples of Fortemps.

Within Final Fantasy XIV lore, they do not share the same idea of body in between life and death. Lore-wise, there is the existence of Aether. The reason why warrior of light placed the monument along with shield and flowers in Coerthas Central Highlands was probably because he/she wished Haurchefant’s aetherial being would be able to visit the viewpoint where Ishgard can be seen the best.

We believe a soul, if exists, wouldn’t really be mattered to be connected to where body would be at.

So (unless the lore team have a different answer), graves are not necessarily physical but "where the person would want to be".

Which I suppose comes back to the question of Yotsuyu - would she even want to be in Doma?

[Dualgunner]

While it's important that Yotsuyu's story is told and learned from and not forgotten, making a grave (or more likely a memorial) to her in the city would be the wrong approach. In time the people might be ready to hear it and regard her with pity, but for now it would be a reminder of those still-raw memories of suffering - every bit as much as the watchtower they've chosen to tear down.

And talking of memorials....



Haurchefant's memorial actually isn't a grave either, at least as we'd define it - his body isn't buried there. (It's not pointed out, but Corentiaux at Camp Dragonhead mentions it if you talk to him.) Which seemed an odd thing, particularly as the pre-existing stone cairns are referred to as a graveyard in one of the dragoon quests, but the question got brought up in a Korean Q&A a few weeks back and the answer is rather lovely.

Discussion thread: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...A-with-Yoshida
Document link: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...ClxamIIE64ca0/



So (unless the lore team have a different answer), graves are not necessarily physical but "where the person would want to be".

Which I suppose comes back to the question of Yotsuyu - would she even want to be in Doma?

This makes me think about Samurai spoilers:

Musosai was buried with his katana by the Silver Bazaar overlooking the ocean; a place he would have the best view of the ocean.