Doman Reconstruction: Watchtower issues

[Annana]

Well said... and I wish we could continue with more of the reconstruction. There are still parts of Yanxia, especially the great bridge in the south west portion of the map --facing the Castrum, where I wish we could be involved in reconstructing. That bridge needs my donations...

Maybe after Ishgard finishes cleaning up the rubble and Ala Mhigo puts out the fires in the lochs.

[Ramesses]

Maybe after Ishgard finishes cleaning up the rubble and Ala Mhigo puts out the fires in the lochs.

The fires...? But how else do you expect your immersion within the Lochs to be maintained? The city itself is almost non existent.

[Lucke]

Noone that was under Garlean occupation has direct LOS to the bridge. Everyone living in the Enclave can see that massive Garlean tower to remind them of the occupation. The only people with a direct LOS to the bridge are the Anata and the Miqo tribe in the mountains (the Anata are/were largely indifferent to the Occupation). Ala Mhigo doesn't have LOS to the tower and Refugees camped in the Reach can't see it from there either so it's not in their face. For the Ala Mhigans, it's more of "Out of sight, out of mind" thing.

[TheMightyMollusk]

As an aside, a subtle grave for Tsuyu would be an excellent addition to the area. I find myself wondering if lessons have truly been learned by the Domans in regards to Yotsuyu's torment or if the entire chapter will simply be brushed aside and forgotten about by future generations.

Any grave for Tsuyu would be somewhere secret, to prevent vandalism from vengeful victims. She may get sympathy from those of us who could see her history, but to most of Doma she's just the evil dictator.

[Remedi]

It's Ironic how they essentially groomed their dictator, perhaps some would feel like the guy that owned the brothel if they actually knew that their ways can create this monsters.
I think Hien should full disclose the story of Tsuyu to his ppl so that they can actually learn and improve, as things stand someone like Yotsuyu might come up again, it's easy to say that she choose her path when speaking in a position that is different than hers, but the truth is that humans aren't rational in distress (it is why charlatans are still prolific to this day)

[ObsidianFire]

It's sad, but there's a lot of Deliberate Values Dissonance going on with Yotsuyu's story. Brothels, and selling people to work in them isn't illegal in Doma, which is probably a reference to how it was in historical Japan. I really have to wonder how many woman were in Yotsuyu's same situation and didn't end up growing up to be monsters. It's also very obvious that her family was almost as bad as she was. They just didn't have the influence she did. I get the feeling that a lot of what she put the Doman people through were things Yotsuyu learned from her aunt and uncle and brother first. I don't want to say she was too far gone when her aunt and uncle sold her too the brothel, but I get the feeling she would have snapped no matter where she ended up.

The problem with Hian calling attention to Yotsusyu's past is that the way Yotsuyu took her anger out on everyone is very obviously disproportionate to what she went though. Trying to convince an entire nation that the person who tormented them is semi-justified for what they did because the people of the nation, most of who could never have been in a position to do anything about Yotsuyu's situation, let it happen is a really hard sell. I don't see it happening.

The other problem is timing. Doma's infrastructure and culture was decimated by the Imperials. The Domans are going to be spending years rebuilding and reclaiming who they are nation. Inserting the idea that the last Imperial Viceroy was justified in what she did would cause moral to plummet. That's the last thing Doma needs right now.

I can see the truth coming out later, but not when the wounds Yotsuyu gave Doma are so fresh. The important thing is that Hian knows as he's the one in charge of rebuilding Doma. For now, that's enough.

[Alleo]

The simple thing is: You might want to try to change such things but there will always be bad people everywhere. I can see them making it a topic and it would be great if nothing like that ever happens again but I also would find it quite unrealistic. No matter how great most people are and how much Hien cares there will alway be those that will hurt others. They should try to talk to the people and that those wont turn away if they see something like that but more than that would go into the realm of fairy tales imo. Even in our modern world we have problems like that.

A grave for her would imo be too much. No matter the past she still committed horrible crimes. Its really bad that there were people mistreading her but that gives her no right at all to kill and torture any other person in this land. Her getting a chance as Tsuyu was probably more than enough for what she had done.

[Remedi]

It's very possible that Yotsuyu wasn't the only courtesan working for the Garleans, but I still say that unless you've been in that kind of shit, you can't really judge someone. You really need to be in a position of utter hopelessness to understand. At that point every choice would be better off that your reality even if that means sending your country to hell, a country that allowed your suffering.
It's not something you can really realize when you are not in that position, she said it at the end, that her countrymen decides to turn around to ignore what's rotten to believe that the wrong ins't there. Hien as a leader has to fix this one way or the other because he has witnessed what the old ways lead to. Trye the Garleans were the abilitator to this, but let's say there was no invasion, this would have been the custom forevermore. He knows now and can either pretend nothing happened or take actions, but I guess we won't see it.

[Alleo]

So if someone was abused in your city, someone you did not even know, or at that time was not even born and they came back to murder everyone, including your family, would you truly just say: Well I can understand that, lets forgive that person, we are kinda all at fault here and lets built a grave for them?

I mean if she had come back and hurt those people that have hurt her directly then maybe one could feel a bit more sympathy with her motives, but she hurt anyone just because they were born in the country, even if they were not even alive at that time. Your past does not in any way ever absolve you from such horrible crimes.

In the end Hien can only do so much. He should not ignore the problem and should try to change it but hoping that something like that never really happens again is probably too much.

[LineageRazor]

The problem with Hian calling attention to Yotsusyu's past is that the way Yotsuyu took her anger out on everyone is very obviously disproportionate to what she went though. Trying to convince an entire nation that the person who tormented them is semi-justified for what they did because the people of the nation, most of who could never have been in a position to do anything about Yotsuyu's situation, let it happen is a really hard sell. I don't see it happening.

It would also be wrong to say that the nation is semi-justified, because honestly, there's not a lot of indication that the nation is at fault. You mentioned that brothels and selling folks into them is not illegal in Doma, but is that actually true? Just because we saw it happen to Yotsuyu doesn't mean that it was above board. Brothels and sexual slavery are illegal in most of the civilized world today - but they still happen, all the same. I might buy that brothels are legal, but the impression I get from the game was that King Kaien was an extremely kind and beloved king. It seems unlikely that even under Garlean occupation he would allow slavery to be a legal thing, sexual or not. No, I'm fairly convinced that Yotsuyu's being sold was definitely a shady affair, not one that is socially or legally acceptable.

All that said, though, Yotsuyu's story is still one worth telling: beat someone down long enough, and they may eventually snap and bite back. The Golden Rule is a good thing; treat others as you would have them treat you. Yotsuyu was stepped on her whole life, and when she obtained the power to do so was all-too happy to step on others in turn. Abuse is a cycle, and the abused often pay it forward and become abusers themselves. These are good lessons to learn, and it would do potential abusers good to be made aware of the kind of extremes to which their actions can lead.