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  1. #1
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    kikix12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fynlar View Post
    Except it is? That's literally what defines a trans person, unless you're just trying to plug your ears and shut your eyes and pretend they don't exist..
    So this is where your ignorance lies. At least it had a reason...surprise surprise.

    I'll give you three phrases regarding a trans person.

    "Mr. Jack's sex at birth was that of a woman. His gender was always that of a man though."
    This phrase is completely clear and correct under current meanings of the words.

    "Mr. Jack's sex at birth was that of a woman. His sex was always that of a man though."
    This phrase is partially correct. Second instance of "sex" is used incorrectly however. Then there's the fact of it being used twice in a row saying two opposite things. It's not relevant here because the second use was incorrect to begin with.

    "Mr. Jack's gender at birth was that of a woman. His gender was always that of a man though."
    Here we have an error as well...but not in use of words. The word gender is used correctly both times. The error is more of a matter of style. Repeating the use of the same word in consecutive sentences (or within one sentence) was always a problem that is to be avoided. Here we have also another problem in that the word is used in two related, but separate contexts...which are opposite of each other. That makes this phrase correct on the meaning...but something you'd get an F for at school.

    But we can fix that very easily.
    "Mr. Jack's gender at birth was that of a woman. His gender mentally was always that of a man though."
    And voila. Problem solved, except that it still looks so-so with the word "gender" repeated in consecutive phrases. However since the word "mentally" was added, the issue of misconception is solved because now not only first sentence have context (at birth), but the second one have as well (mentally). Something the phrases above lacked.


    Transgender people are proof of there being a possibility of someone having two genders that are different from one another (mental and biological)...or of there being a person whose sex and gender are not the same. Both of these statements are correct. They merely state the same thing in two different ways. You know...the whole purpose of synonyms existing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iscah View Post
    Possibly because "gender" is seen as a more 'polite' word than "sex".
    I think it's less a matter of it being "polite", more a matter of it having a second meaning that is considered taboo. If public use of the other meaning of that word did not risk fine for obscenity, sharp looks and possibly being raped...it would be used a lot more often even outside scientific and medical circles.
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    Last edited by kikix12; 10-16-2018 at 02:01 AM.

  2. #2
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    Iscah's Avatar
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    Aurelie Moonsong
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    Quote Originally Posted by kikix12 View Post
    I think it's less a matter of it being "polite", more a matter of it having a second meaning that is considered taboo.
    That's what I meant.

    Interestingly it doesn't seem to have that definition in the 1964 dictionary - and not because they didn't want to talk about it, it's just a separate entry.



    Quote Originally Posted by kikix12 View Post
    But we can fix that very easily.
    "Mr. Jack's gender at birth was that of a woman. His gender mentally was always that of a man though."
    And voila. Problem solved, except that it still looks so-so with the word "gender" repeated in consecutive phrases. However since the word "mentally" was added, the issue of misconception is solved because now not only first sentence have context (at birth), but the second one have as well (mentally). Something the phrases above lacked.
    I still don't think that's correct - or ideal at any rate. That's exactly when you use "sex" and "gender" as separate terms with different meanings, even if they can be interchangeable elsewhere.
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    Last edited by Iscah; 10-16-2018 at 02:20 AM.

  3. #3
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    kikix12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iscah View Post
    I still don't think that's correct - or ideal at any rate. That's exactly when you use "sex" and "gender" as separate terms with different meanings, even if they can be interchangeable elsewhere.
    Its meaning is correct. Synonyms have that to them, that they are not selective.

    However it is a stylistic error, at the very least. Under normal circumstances, any person with a suitable vocabulary should avoid making such phrases. Completely non-problematic alternatives are, for example:
    "Mr. Jack's gender biologically was that of a woman, but mentally he always was a man."
    "Mr. Jack's gender is biologically a woman and mentally a man."
    "Mr. Jack's biological gender of a woman is different than the mental one."

    It's all a matter of context. When using a multi-meaning word in an ambiguous manner, it is a good idea to provide context. There is no such need when using two words that are synonyms in one of the cases, but not the other, like "sex" for biological gender and simply "gender" for mental one. That is part of the reason why we use synonyms.
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