Please nerf butcher's block potency

[Snarky_Sunseeker]

Now Iz, I know it's difficult for you to comprehend that there's a world outside of the subset of a subset that is the Savage tryhard community, but believe it or not, those other 95% of players are the reason why SE even bothers to create the only content that's "relevant" to them. So, much to your chagrin, my points hold as much weight at yours if not more so, because I represent a part of the community that doesn't see everything outside of Savage as nothing more than filler or a stepping stone.

We'll just have to agree to disagree that I fail to see why a tiny minority of the playerbase should pontificate what's "best" for the rest of us. I think we're done here.

Also, I'll reiterate my point: SE should check the enmity algorithms for all three tank jobs. They probably won't find anything they take issue with, but hey. Nothing lost by asking.

[Izsha]

Now Iz, I know it's difficult for you to comprehend that there's a world outside of the subset of a subset that is the Savage tryhard community, but believe it or not, those other 95% of players are the reason why SE even bothers to create the only content that's "relevant" to them. So, much to your chagrin, my points hold as much weight at yours if not more so, because I represent a part of the community that doesn't see everything outside of Savage as nothing more than filler or a stepping stone.

We'll just have to agree to disagree that I fail to see why a tiny minority of the playerbase should pontificate what's "best" for the rest of us. I think we're done here.

Also, I'll reiterate my point: SE should check the enmity algorithms for all three tank jobs. They probably won't find anything they take issue with, but hey. Nothing lost by asking.

You fail to realize that loosing threat on a hunt zerg does not actually affect you in any tangible way besides "Darn it! I want to make more enmity!". You dont loose points. You dont loose anything. Heck, we dont even hunt the way they were intended to be hunted. Basing balance around an activity with no winners or loosers at the expense of other content which does is a poor method. No one is 'excluding' Drk from their hunt parties because of the War meta. If a job is notably underpowered in content with strict win conditions, those players are now going to suffer stigmatism from the community.

Hunts dont have any weight in the world. I never said raids are all that matters. There is lots of content that matters when it comes to tank performance. Nearly everything in the game is relevant when it comes to balance. I remember being excluded from dungeons in 2.0 on war in favor of plds as war couldnt mass pull. I remember plds being excluded later because flash did no damage in dungeons. Dungeons matter. Raids matter. 24 mans matter. Extremes matter. PVP (in its own separate world with its own balance and actions) matters. Leveling experience and balance pre 70 matters. Hunts, dont matter (for balance).

Hunts are literally the lowest priority of content to worry about balance on. That is not to say that hunts arent useful/fun/valuable content or that players that hunt dont matter. But job balance in hunts doesnt. There is no notable loss/punishment/exclusion/stigma/negative side effects of job imbalance in hunts. There are consequences to poor balance in virtually any other aspect of the game. All tanks are capable of adequately tanking any hunt defensively and can generate more enmity than any non-tank, and have enough enmity to cap points in large groups exceedingly effectivly. The fact that X tank can do it 1 gcd faster is utterly irrelevant.

[Snarky_Sunseeker]

And, as expected, you totally miss the point. I'm not surprised.

Seriously, dude. Let it go. You stopped being on-topic about two posts ago. And I, for one, don't want to see a thread get locked because of it.

[shao32]

such a heated debate for this, its a Qol nerf, even if don't solve bad players staying on tank stance in OT spot its give them less excuses to use the agro combo outside of MT, WAR have the highest emity generation, nerf 10-20 on buther don't affect the job in anything and can improve the learning curve.

[ed3891]

So I was just in a run with a WAR OT and he was catching up on enmity like crazy, I could barely keep hate off him, thought he must be doing crazy high damage or something.

But I started watching him and noticed, he was using butcher's block as OT.... I told him to stop and he complained that it's his highest potency combo, at which point naturally the party jumped on him telling him to use storm's path.

But it's stupid for BB to be WARs highest potency combo in the first place. It just confuses WARs into thinking it's their dps combo (like the above), when it's not, they should never be using it any more than DRK or even PLD.

So please SE, lower BB potency and raise the enmity modifier so the enmity generation is the same but the damage is the weakest of the combos, in line with the other tanks. Stop the madness.

So because someone else is bad at playing WAR - and by virtue of that person playing badly, you had a poor experience in a single fight - means that the job itself needs to be nerfed, to the detriment of the broader player base?

You don't get outdoors much, do you?

[ValentineSnow]

So because someone else is bad at playing WAR - and by virtue of that person playing badly, you had a poor experience in a single fight - means that the job itself needs to be nerfed, to the detriment of the broader player base?

You don't get outdoors much, do you?

You don't think much do you?

If it was one person in a single fight I wouldn't be complaining. I've come across this more often than I should in content as far into the game as alphascape savage.

People are playing the job badly because the descriptions on the abilities are misleading. People see butcher's block as the highest potency combo so they think it's the strongest. If people don't care to crunch the numbers beyond adding up potencies and aren't even considering the beast gauge it's no surprise some of them get tricked into thinking it's a damage combo. As has been said it's a QoL change, if BB was equal potency to the other 2 combos then people would see it's a choice between enmity, gauge and debuff and it would become clear cut which combo to use.

Also, it wouldn't be to the detriment of the broader playerbase, because it is an ENMITY COMBO, it is not used for damage, it doesn't need the damage, the broader playerbase doesn't even use BB outside of pulling the boss and it helps those players If other warriors aren't using BB as an OT because they misunderstood the skill.

[Driskus]

If it was one person in a single fight I wouldn't be complaining. I've come across this more often than I should in content as far into the game as alphascape savage.

I don't see the need for changing anything. If they'd actually read the whole tooltip they'd probably realize what they should be doing. If they're all the way to Alphascape Savage without even figuring that out, I highly doubt changing the potency is going to accomplish much.

As far as hunts go, I could see multiple tanks accidentally having tank stance up and fighting each other for aggro, considering there's usually more players fighting that one mob than the game can even render. I also doubt someone's going to click on every single other tank just to see if one is already in tank stance. Its not like it matters much since those mobs die so fast anyway.

[shao32]

I don't see the need for changing anything. If they'd actually read the whole tooltip they'd probably realize what they should be doing. If they're all the way to Alphascape Savage without even figuring that out, I highly doubt changing the potency is going to accomplish much.

As far as hunts go, I could see multiple tanks accidentally having tank stance up and fighting each other for aggro, considering there's usually more players fighting that one mob than the game can even render. I also doubt someone's going to click on every single other tank just to see if one is already in tank stance. Its not like it matters much since those mobs die so fast anyway.

butcher's block spam has been a problem since heavensward i really see this kind of WARs pretty ofthen this last 3 years just bcs ppl read the tooltip and fail to understand more gauge means more fell cleaves with are more dps that spaming butcher's block, and the combo was a direct dps gain on heavens so im not surprise this ppl drag this belief from that, nerfing butcher will remove enterily this belief and prevent a lot of missunderstand of what to do with the most easy job of the game.

[Aquaslash]

, to the detriment of the broader player base?

You don't get outdoors much, do you?

Bruh, what detriment? Literally NOTHING is adversely impacted by nerfing BB. If anything, they can completely disallow it outside of Defiance and it'll fix everything except leveling dungeons, but those need an overhaul anyway. There is nothing to lose from such a change and everything to gain.

So what if newcomers need some hand holding? The game needs a proper advanced tutorial anyway

[Soraki-Muppe]

You can't patch away stupid. Even if this combo, that should not be nerfed, was nerfed into the ground those same players would still spam it screaming in their minds "Ima doing GREAEAT!!! Ima war nimbar owne!!!1
If you tied the combo to tank stance those same players would stay in tank stance so that they could go on spamming it.
The only thing a nerf would do is punish those of us who only use it when we have to, it would force us to use it more and in so doing be a dps nerf to the entire class.
Like I said, you can't patch away stupid. If they this far into the expansion still does not understand that BB is a dps loss then they will never understand it no matter what, heck I bet you could pay someone to slap them in the face every time they did this and they would still never learn. Nerfing BB will fix nothing.