Things to think about before you call someone "Bad"

[Fynlar]

Thinking about how incredibly common it is for me to run into people who just never say anything and don't show any sort of indication that they are even hearing what you say, it has me wondering about how typical it is for the same thing to happen to GMs when they have to message players.

[Lastelli]

I have personally NEVER, after 5 years met someone who is an ass to people for the sake of being an ass. People always had their meltdowns because of just terrible people being terrible players wasting everryone else their time. Stop doing it.

This 100 times. Unfortunately, I'm afraid that things won't get better. The amount of players that have no idea how to play and just want a carry is overwhelming, and the game does absolutely nothing to teach them how to play, nor give any feedback about their performance. In almost any other game you'd hit a wall sooner or later, maybe in the form of a boss, that may indicate that you're doing something wrong and need to re-evaluate your approach, but in this game bad players can easily be carried through any kind of content except for (the last 2 turns of) savage and ultimate. So we end up with 2-3k dd in suzaku ex and alphascape normal. I mean...I witnessed o10n enrage because we couldn't kill the nails/dragon in time...and there were no deaths! I'm not the kind of player that would insult other players for being bad, most of the time I would simply leave after a couple of wipes if the situation is too dramatic, but at this point the average level of the players I find in df and pf duties is really turning me off the game.

[Vahlnir]

This 100 times. Unfortunately, I'm afraid that things won't get better. The amount of players that have no idea how to play and just want a carry is overwhelming, and the game does absolutely nothing to teach them how to play, nor give any feedback about their performance. In almost any other game you'd hit a wall sooner or later, maybe in the form of a boss, that may indicate that you're doing something wrong and need to re-evaluate your approach, but in this game bad players can easily be carried through any kind of content except for (the last 2 turns of) savage and ultimate. So we end up with 2-3k dd in suzaku ex and alphascape normal. I mean...I witnessed o10n enrage because we couldn't kill the nails/dragon in time...and there were no deaths! I'm not the kind of player that would insult other players for being bad, most of the time I would simply leave after a couple of wipes if the situation is too dramatic, but at this point the average level of the players I find in df and pf duties is really turning me off the game.

It takes a lot for me to leave a roulette, unless it's an Ex mode in Mentor roulette...I'm probably a poor mentor for leaving them to their own devices, but some of those fights were rough when they were current or even semi current. With how things tend to be nowadays? No thanks. But anyway, yeah, I've noticed a slight uptick in inexperienced players trying to tackle higher end content. It's quite bad trying to form clear parties that can actually clear. If it were in a roulette or the like I don't mind offering some tips. In fact, I'd love to. But you will get nothing from me in a clear party that's meant for one purpose: clearing the content you signed up for. Learning parties are >>>> that way. And there's never a shortage of those during prime time hours. Random dungeons and raids I try to set my expectations low and will rarely, very rarely say a word if things go south because random people with varying degrees of experience are lumped together. Sometimes it works out, sometimes it doesn't. I will help if I can.

[gamepob]

You seem to be reading an awful lot into what I said. Scroll up and you'll see I'm talking about a tank that wasn't using flash AND didn't respond to party messages.

If you won't communicate with your party, bye. Communication is non-negotiable, even for novices.

We began with end game content and people not doing the minimal (basic) required of their class. Which is understandable. Now we are at lvl 15 leveling (learning) dungeon where novices barely know how to play the game. Interesting. I wonder if you gave that player more than 5 seconds to answer.

How high is that horse you are riding on?

[Daibunnie]

Now we are at lvl 15 leveling (learning) dungeon where novices barely know how to play the game. Interesting. I wonder if you gave that player more than 5 seconds to answer

They should have a decent understanding of what they need to do especially when they got to level 15 somehow. I haven’t seen anyone wipe or kicked on sastasha so far so all those sprout players at least knew what they were doing and communicated enough. However, once you start getting into content like auram vale, you still have players acting like they only have those same 4 skills from level 15 and not communicating with the team. The only thing you can do at that point is either carry them through it or kick.

[van_arn]

We began with end game content and people not doing the minimal (basic) required of their class. Which is understandable. Now we are at lvl 15 leveling (learning) dungeon where novices barely know how to play the game. Interesting. I wonder if you gave that player more than 5 seconds to answer.

How high is that horse you are riding on?

Pretty normal height. And yes, players need to get kicked from sastasha if they won't read chat, and no in this specific incident our whole party couldn't get that tank's attention. Which is why we had the votes to get rid of them.

Lower level players do get extra consideration when mulling over a kick, and I'll happily bend over backwards to help when it's this low, but if you're carrying on a conversation with the air and nothing's getting learned they need the boot. Communication in dungeon is required at any level, especially when something as essential in the long term as flash isn't used, and that really is not negotiable.

If they don't or can't or refuse to read chat, then party content just isn't an option for them. As they progress, they will be expected to do more than just read chat.

[Jett-Rinn]

Folks probably won't even bother watching this but, this guy pretty much echos my sentiments on the whole matter https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TuF3UbptkRI The Tank and healer shortage is just going to grow, and folks being jerks to people who are still learning their class despite getting extra stuff for mentoring is sooner or later going to send the community into a tailspin.

[Vahlnir]

We began with end game content and people not doing the minimal (basic) required of their class. Which is understandable. Now we are at lvl 15 leveling (learning) dungeon where novices barely know how to play the game. Interesting. I wonder if you gave that player more than 5 seconds to answer.

How high is that horse you are riding on?

Yeah, there may be legitimate reasons why people can't communicate. When I started on PS3 back in ARR, I bought a keyboard months in advance of the game going live. To some though a keyboard was an afterthought and many simply didn't bother. It might not cross some peoples' minds is all if they play on a console. It should, but sometimes it doesn't.

[van_arn]

Yeah, there may be legitimate reasons why people can't communicate. When I started on PS3 back in ARR, I bought a keyboard months in advance of the game going live. To some though a keyboard was an afterthought and many simply didn't bother. It might not cross some peoples' minds is all if they play on a console. It should, but sometimes it doesn't.

None of what you've listed is a legitimate reason not to use flash when told to use flash in group content.

[Fynlar]

Yeah, there may be legitimate reasons why people can't communicate. When I started on PS3 back in ARR, I bought a keyboard months in advance of the game going live. To some though a keyboard was an afterthought and many simply didn't bother. It might not cross some peoples' minds is all if they play on a console. It should, but sometimes it doesn't.

If you are unable to communicate, you shouldn't invest in a MMORPG and you pretty much deserve whatever you get as a result of trying. Doesn't matter if you're on a console.


I had to buy all sorts of peripheral shit just to get FFXI to work on a PS2, ages ago. Needed to attach this big ass HDD box to the PS2 just to be able to play it. It wasn't cheap, either. I think everyone else can handle a simple USB keyboard.