Things to think about before you call someone "Bad"

[Vidu]

Hmm I do ususaly go with a friend or two so maybe that’s it

Most likely - I stopped doing my expert roulettes (or any dungeons for that matter) without my boyfriend. Not so much because we're one of those aweful couples that do everything together, but because I ran into way to many bad DPS as paladin and into way to many bad tanks (you know, the kind that needs a minute or two to gather the courage to pull the next mob) when I went as bard to ensure decent DPS... so, now I only do that kind of content with my BLM.
And we still get people that suck. A lot (both the amount of people that suck and how much they do that).
But its less noticeable, because his DPS can easly compensate for someone whos just rolling their head over their keyboard and if I really have to, I can function as my own healer.

...but is that really the way to go? Only queuing for expert roulette with friends to avoid running into people who dont have their most basic job-functions down? At level 70?
I'd like to believe that this cant be the answer and that the actual answer has to be better teaching and gating done by the game itself.
Until then... I'll get through my dungeons with my BLM, request people to play like they're level 70 in level 70 content by asking them to use their basic toolkit and, if that fails, kick them.

[MoroMurasaki]

...but is that really the way to go? Only queuing for expert roulette with friends to avoid running into people who dont have their most basic job-functions down? At level 70?
I'd like to believe that this cant be the answer and that the actual answer has to be better teaching and gating done by the game itself.
Until then... I'll get through my dungeons with my BLM, request people to play like they're level 70 in level 70 content by asking them to use their basic toolkit and, if that fails, kick them.

A good friend of mine (VanilleFang of now permaban-infamy) enjoys poking fun at me in discord every time I complain about getting bads - I'm just told "You know what happens when you do things by yourself! " but like... okay, yeah, fair enough.

It's also the age-old question when queuing for 24mans in particular; do I heal it for safety, dpsing it for speed/confidence in meeting the dps checks or tank it so that doing the former two doesn't earn me a (deadly) tankbuster to the face?

The game definitely needs to teach people a whole lot more. There are currently several threads going on just on the forums about this same topic.

Personally I feel like with the leaps they've made with having your AI companions perform mechanics (or not perform them, LOOKING AT YOU TATARU D: ) they should redo some of the job quest battles to actually teach you things and use them as gates. Healers actually needing to heal a party, tanks needing to maintain threat and dps having to at least oudtdps those AI xD

[Gallus]

ITT: Calling someone bad is completely acceptable.

Push it just a bit more and this community will end up having nothing to envy to communities like CoD, LoL or Overwatch. Keep up the good work, you are almost there.

[Sigma-Astra]

ITT: Calling someone bad is completely acceptable.

Push it just a bit more and this community will end up having nothing to envy to communities like the ones from CoD, LoL or Overwatch. Keep up the good work.

So, you'd rather have us lie to them that they're doing a good job (whether it be a tank that can't hold hate, a healer who spams Cure 1, or a DPS who pulls 2,000 DPS and stays dead on the floor), give them a gold star sticker for effort, and instead, we should burden ourselves by carrying people who literally don't care about anyone elses time so long as they themselves are having a good time?

But, who cares about the people that don't want to take an hour to get through something that should have only taken 30 minutes or less, right? Who cares if they don't have fun either because some people refuse to improve and instead, weigh down the shoulders of the players that do care, and then they themselves decide to leave because they're tired of carrying bad players?

This community won't turn into CoD, LoL, or Overwatch. It'll turn into a dead game where casuals can't get through content anymore because all of the dependable people left for greener pastures and refuse to put up with it any longer.

Either that or they complain to make it easier towards the point that just logging in gives you crap.

[Vidu]

A good friend of mine (VanilleFang of now permaban-infamy) enjoys poking fun at me in discord every time I complain about getting bads - I'm just told "You know what happens when you do things by yourself! " but like... okay, yeah, fair enough.

It's also the age-old question when queuing for 24mans in particular; do I heal it for safety, dpsing it for speed/confidence in meeting the dps checks or tank it so that doing the former two doesn't earn me a (deadly) tankbuster to the face?

The game definitely needs to teach people a whole lot more. There are currently several threads going on just on the forums about this same topic.

Personally I feel like with the leaps they've made with having your AI companions perform mechanics (or not perform them, LOOKING AT YOU TATARU D: ) they should redo some of the job quest battles to actually teach you things and use them as gates. Healers actually needing to heal a party, tanks needing to maintain threat and dps having to at least oudtdps those AI xD

Oh yeah, a friend of mine does that too - each time I join an EX-primal farm party and get met with people who are clearly not ready to farm yet, but need some more practise. In phase one, when I'm lucky; on their job on a normal day... FUN!

For 24-man-raids I've basically resorted to RDM, even though I'm no expert at it and constantly forget that I have this skill that doubles your mana - I'm very much able to use all my other skills though - and the button to double my mana would hardly get used anyways, considering ver-cure and ver-raise are much, much more needed...

And I have to say that I was a little bit shocked by people complaining about the latest story-instance being to difficult and that this needed to change, because it absolutly does not... maybe its my personal mindset, but I cant wrap my head around their logic - "I failed, this is to hard, it needs to made easier!!" instead of "I failed - I clearly need to improve and try again!"
It just completly eludes me how people like that go through life - blaming every failure on someone else?

I'd like to see stronger gating for all non-story content - I can sympathise with someone who just wants to play the story and I dont even mind carrying someone like that through mandatory story-instances. But for everything else I'd like to see stronger gating, with instances that are cut out for your current job. Wanna unlock Alphascape as healer? Better make sure you keep Cid alive in this instance, while dodging AoEs and handling stackmarkers, while helping Cid and Alpha to beat that monitor!
We need more moderate roadblocks, not more cuddling...

[JohnSpawnVFX]

ITT: Calling someone bad is completely acceptable.

Push it just a bit more and this community will end up having nothing to envy to communities like CoD, LoL or Overwatch. Keep up the good work, you are almost there.

Got any proof of that?

[Vidu]

ITT: Calling someone bad is completely acceptable.

Push it just a bit more and this community will end up having nothing to envy to communities like CoD, LoL or Overwatch. Keep up the good work, you are almost there.

Insulting someone and saying "You suck!" is unacceptable.

Giving a person a legit feedback in regards to their skills or requesting them to play at a level they should be playing at by default, aka: level 70, aka: making use of their full skillset at level 70 is only unacceptable in the sense that no one should ever have to do that, since it should be common courtesy to learn your job before you go into group content.
It should be common courtesy to contribute to a group-effort in a meanigful way and if you cant do that, you opend yourself up to be critised.

Now... how you take that polite critisim will determine wether or not you're truely a bad player.
Did you just not know better? Then you should be happy that someone told you about your errors and be glad you can improve now!
Do you just not care because "its just a game lol"? Then you're not only a bad player but also a bad person.

Do you take the advice and improve? Not a bad player.
Do you pull the "you dont pay my sub!!"-card? Pretty bad and toxic player.

Just noticing that someone isnt playing as well as they (reasonably) should at max level isnt the problem - people playing subpar, not knowing, not noticing and not willing to improve are.

[Connor]

I don’t think in this thread and in the general community is saying that being hurtful or mean to someone else for bad performance is ok. But politely explaining to someone a way that they can improve is different; you aren’t putting someone down, you’re trying to help them up to be even better. I think this is what people are encourage.

It’s easy to see advice as criticism, especially online. But even when it comes across as harsh, just remind yourself that it may be coming from a good place.

I think the best way to deal with this situation is communication. If someone gives advice in a harsh or cruel way, let them know. Apologise for whatever is it you done wrong and let them know that you appreciate the advice (but feel it could be worded differently if applicable lol).

Staying calm can be difficult when you’re in the spotlight being criticised, but approaching it with a clear head and not letting yourself get aggravated is key to avoiding party conflicts, which ultimately just result in the content taking longer or someone dropping

[van_arn]

ITT: Calling someone bad is completely acceptable.

Push it just a bit more and this community will end up having nothing to envy to communities like CoD, LoL or Overwatch. Keep up the good work, you are almost there.

It's never acceptable to call someone bad to their face: you kick them instead and let them come to their own conclusions.

And those boogeyman games you just listed have a bunch of nice people in them, they just have less delicate flowers that wilt when they find out they're holding back their team.

[Ursa_Vonfiebryd]

On the other end of this, you have the people who call the general community trash because they don't know their toolkit on a Savage level. I actually had someone sit out of a boss fight in Rabanstre because they died. I was healing and having to deal with the usual skullduggery associated with gaming with the general public but I had to ask... WTF? I sort of like the challenge of getting through content with non-ideal factors but if you're one of the l33ts who can't handle that their dps was not top tier because you can't avoid mechs well... You're not only bad, you are also just pathetic. :\