How would an optional, official parser be toxic?

[Legion88]

*Shakes head.*

It has little to do with what I think is toxic. The developers said they wouldn't implement for their own reasons. People are always going to be jerks and the developers think parsers will give jerks more incentive to treat people poorly. What anyone thinks in this thread is irrelevant.

The koike incident is not based on parsing it were some jerks who planned to harrass a person and streamed it live to the world.
6 people griefed an offical staff member by ridiculing her actions and sexually harrassed her, the mentioning of DPS numbers was just a little part of that and not even more than a sideline.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

*Shakes head.*

It has little to do with what I think is toxic. The developers said they wouldn't implement for their own reasons. People are always going to be jerks and the developers think parsers will give jerks more incentive to treat people poorly. What anyone thinks in this thread is irrelevant.

You realize they went into her party with the intent of harassing her and making fun of her right at the start? They didn't start making fun of her just because "parses". They would've done the same without parses. Also, prove that sexually harassing her was just because of parses.

Can you people just stop grabbing anything you can and attaching parses to it, just so you can say "parses are the demon itself"?

[xMoonshadow]

If you are try to improve, a better tool is to record your fights and see where you are making mistakes. Analyzing a fight to understand where to stand, when to use CDs, how to change your rotation to fit the fight is more help than have a raw parser number. A parser gives you and number , but no supporting supporting data that can help you improve. You could the a fight with the same gear and use the same rotation but get two very different numbers. Why, may you got hit with RNG mechanics that jail you or the boss was position badly so you parsed low. Maybe you got party buff you didn't realized and parsed high. Parses can be helpful , but alone they are not great tool for improving on fights.

[Legion88]

If you are try to improve, a better tool is to record your fights and see where you are making mistakes. Analyzing a fight to understand where to stand, when to use CDs, how to change your rotation to fit the fight is more help than have a raw parser number. A parser gives you and number , but no supporting supporting data that can help you improve. You could the a fight with the same gear and use the same rotation but get two very different numbers. Why, may you got hit with RNG mechanics that jail you or the boss was position badly so you parsed low. Maybe you got party buff you didn't realized and parsed high. Parses can be helpful , but alone they are not great tool for improving on fights.

This is wrong. You are talking about a DPS meter, not a parser.
A parser records every action, position and timing, allignment of buffs and debuffs.
So you get all the same like with a video record, you need just the right interpretation and even for that are tools out there like fflogs and xivanalysis.

[Dualgunner]

If you are try to improve, a better tool is to record your fights and see where you are making mistakes. Analyzing a fight to understand where to stand, when to use CDs, how to change your rotation to fit the fight is more help than have a raw parser number. A parser gives you and number , but no supporting supporting data that can help you improve. You could the a fight with the same gear and use the same rotation but get two very different numbers. Why, may you got hit with RNG mechanics that jail you or the boss was position badly so you parsed low. Maybe you got party buff you didn't realized and parsed high. Parses can be helpful , but alone they are not great tool for improving on fights.

Which is why I advocate not only for an ingame parser but a full ingame battle analysis suite a la fflogs. ACT picks up a lot more than damage numbers, and fflogs shows in a very user friendly way:
Damage done
Damage bursts and falloff
Deaths
Healing per second
Casts
Mitigation
Buffs
Positioning throughout the fight

[JohnSpawnVFX]

If you are try to improve, a better tool is to record your fights and see where you are making mistakes. Analyzing a fight to understand where to stand, when to use CDs, how to change your rotation to fit the fight is more help than have a raw parser number. A parser gives you and number , but no supporting supporting data that can help you improve. You could the a fight with the same gear and use the same rotation but get two very different numbers. Why, may you got hit with RNG mechanics that jail you or the boss was position badly so you parsed low. Maybe you got party buff you didn't realized and parsed high. Parses can be helpful , but alone they are not great tool for improving on fights.

"That website where people upload parses to" lets you analyze all that information. Associating that to a recording of the actual fight would be icing on the cake (improving and acceleratign the analysis process)

[JunseiKei]

So you see your presence here solely as a PSA?

Even if one may have good reason to believe that, like certain other aspects of the game, the above stance lacks comprehensive thought or is in some way errant, it is worthless to discuss such things, even when that falls well within the parameters of these forums' purpose?

This thread is not titled "Is XIV likely to see an official parser?" The question, if one were to interpolate liberally, is whether it should. And the direct question... is the name of the thread.

I get the realist angle. I do. But your applying your fixation to a question to which it is irrelevant.

I ... wouldn't consider myself a public service announcer, just someone who remembers when parsers were "okay" and then suddenly it was turned super hush-hush.

I also wouldn't say it's worthless to discuss things, only an acknowledgement that there are those here that will argue simply for the sake of arguing (which I'm sure some would consider me on that boat) without care of what SE's stance is. It's also an acknowledgement of not entirely wanting to press for something that has come back over and over with a no (with increasing levels of disapproval or otherwise not wanting to address the subject) from SE's side.

To answer the thread's title: the players are what would make the parser toxic, but inherently, it would not be.

The koike incident is not based on parsing it were some jerks who planned to harrass a person and streamed it live to the world.
6 people griefed an offical staff member by ridiculing her actions and sexually harrassed her, the mentioning of DPS numbers was just a little part of that and not even more than a sideline.

You realize they went into her party with the intent of harassing her and making fun of her right at the start? They didn't start making fun of her just because "parses". They would've done the same without parses. Also, prove that sexually harassing her was just because of parses.

Can you people just stop grabbing anything you can and attaching parses to it, just so you can say "parses are the demon itself"?

I'm aware that Koike's incident was not about parsing, but that does not negate the fact that it was a tool that was used to help accomplish that group's goal. It comes down to jerks being jerks and giving them a tool to give them another way to be a jerk. It doesn't matter it was a "sideline" - it was there and it was used in a manner SE is trying to avoid be used.

JohnSpawnVFX, kindly look at the picture as a whole. Whether you want to acknowledge it or not, main focus or not, parsing was used to attack someone publicly. No matter how you intended to look at it, it puts tools like parsing in a very negative light. One that won't be so easily forgotten by the company, especially given it was one of their own staff members.

[Ilan]

A DPS meter wouldn’t make sense in a video game, but I agree with having one somewhere personally.

Back in 2.0 I didn’t know if I was doing well on a savage boss until someone told me I was number 3. Also during a S hunt someone asked if they were number one and the person said no, Stating that I was number one.

It’s a big confidence booster. People telling you your numbers helps you improve so I agree with it. The down side of it was someone telling me my numbers were too low and so I was booted. I’m glad they told me that because I worked on improving myself. If they never told me I would of continued to be even suckeier.

If a dps meter wouldn't make any sense in a video game, where would it make sense then?

[TaranTatsuuchi]

You say that like it's a bad thing...

The hope is that one learns their job, minus the 70 ability's integration into their rotation and priorities, by the time they hit 70. Why should a learning tool be excluded, then, from the vast majority of that learning process.

Because it makes no sense to exclude people in match-made leveling roulettes? True, true, it doesn't. Hmm. One might even figure that's... not a parser's use except in such tightly tuned fights as where developing poor (enrage-insufficient) in-context muscle memory would cause further stress for the party later on or when trialing members for explicitly exclusive statics?

No feelings intended.


I've actually read about people using them as ast to know which of their randoms would make the most use out of their cards.


I think we should all have parsers, obfuscation of our performance isn't helpful in the long run.

I'm just too lazy to deal with setting it up myself.

[Legion88]

I ... wouldn't consider myself a public service announcer, just someone who remembers when parsers were "okay" and then suddenly it was turned super hush-hush.

I also wouldn't say it's worthless to discuss things, only an acknowledgement that there are those here that will argue simply for the sake of arguing (which I'm sure some would consider me on that boat) without care of what SE's stance is. It's also an acknowledgement of not entirely wanting to press for something that has come back over and over with a no (with increasing levels of disapproval or otherwise not wanting to address the subject) from SE's side.

To answer the thread's title: the players are what would make the parser toxic, but inherently, it would not be.





I'm aware that Koike's incident was not about parsing, but that does not negate the fact that it was a tool that was used to help accomplish that group's goal. It comes down to jerks being jerks and giving them a tool to give them another way to be a jerk. It doesn't matter it was a "sideline" - it was there and it was used in a manner SE is trying to avoid be used.

JohnSpawnVFX, kindly look at the picture as a whole. Whether you want to acknowledge it or not, main focus or not, parsing was used to attack someone publicly. No matter how you intended to look at it, it puts tools like parsing in a very negative light. One that won't be so easily forgotten by the company, especially given it was one of their own staff members.

So you should also advocate against the introduction of a forum or better to its closing and for the removing of chat and emotes because they are the main tools for harrassment.