Thank you for increased difficulty

[XiXiQ]

Then you get people who are not able to deal with <2 second large AoEs

This was my only complaint in regard to the newer content, I was seeing AOEs displaying for less than a second, and in more than one fight. Latency is a factor of distance, it cannot be magically fixed, and the devs need to keep it in mind.


I'm not really convinced anything about this patch was more difficult than previous ones though.

[van_arn]

What's the point of having a more casual MMO if you're going to lock everything behind the MSQ and then stick a brick wall in the MSQ that prevents people from getting through it? At least with Shinryu, 7 skilled people could squeak by it, if you had a person who couldn't hack it. You can't do that in a 4 man dungeon though.

Then you get people who are not able to deal with <2 second large AoEs being forced to quit because they are unable to progress further until the next expansion when someone can unsync the fight for them.

Please don't get on a high horse, we do not need the MSQ being hard-core or difficult. The MSQ should be easy, to allow pretty much everybody access. If you want hard content, you have it in Savage, Ultimate, etc.

You seem to have misunderstood. I said nothing about requiring the mist dragon to be hard core or difficult, I said people should be able to handle these mechanics at this point or they should not progress.

Considering we're two expansions in, and in the post-expansion, it's more than reasonable to start expecting players to know how to stay out of the fire.

This is not hardcore. This is merely applying some standards so I need to kick fewer underperformers.

[Maeka]

You seem to have misunderstood. I said nothing about requiring the mist dragon to be hard core or difficult, I said people should be able to handle these mechanics at this point or they should not progress.

Considering we're two expansions in, and in the post-expansion, it's more than reasonable to start expecting players to know how to stay out of the fire.

This is not hardcore. This is merely applying some standards so I need to kick fewer underperformers.

This isn't a mere "stay out of the fire", it's "We're going to give you less than 2 seconds to dodge, and if you don't dodge you are almost guaranteed dead" and if that guaranteed dead is your healer, then it's a guaranteed wipe unless you got a RDM or SMN in the group and even then, a party-wide damage spike happened and you're still gonna die unless you're very quick about getting everybody back up.

And that's the problem I have with that fight. It isn't about YOU and YOUR skill, it's about YOU getting put into a good group with ONE under-performer who causes everybody to wipe because the mechanics are that unforgiving. I don't like wipefests, I don't like blowing 30 minutes+ (especially with that insane distance from the 2nd shortcut) on the same fight because the fight allows almost zero room for error.

[SewDough]

... And that's the problem I have with that fight. It isn't about YOU and YOUR skill, it's about YOU getting put into a good group with ONE under-performer who causes everybody to wipe because the mechanics are that unforgiving. I don't like wipefests, I don't like blowing 30 minutes+ (especially with that insane distance from the 2nd shortcut) on the same fight because the fight allows almost zero room for error.

Literally the only problem I can think of in this instance is if your tank is a DRK.

As a WAR/PLD, I can get out of deliverance / sword oath and easily heal myself through the rest of the encounter.
It is about your skill.

[Lorgana]

I'm not saying beat this or quit, I'm saying take this as an opportunity to get better at the game and progress

[Ilan]

Normal content where you have to use your brain? Yes please!

[van_arn]

This isn't a mere "stay out of the fire", it's "We're going to give you less than 2 seconds to dodge, and if you don't dodge you are almost guaranteed dead" and if that guaranteed dead is your healer, then it's a guaranteed wipe unless you got a RDM or SMN in the group and even then, a party-wide damage spike happened and you're still gonna die unless you're very quick about getting everybody back up.

And that's the problem I have with that fight. It isn't about YOU and YOUR skill, it's about YOU getting put into a good group with ONE under-performer who causes everybody to wipe because the mechanics are that unforgiving. I don't like wipefests, I don't like blowing 30 minutes+ (especially with that insane distance from the 2nd shortcut) on the same fight because the fight allows almost zero room for error.

Kick the underperformers, then. This game needs more fights that actually have a chance of failure, because that's the only way people learn they don't actually know anything about their class.

If you just want free wins, there's always fate grinding our potd/hoh to occupy your time. Or you can unsync run things if you really want free wins.

Like I said before, I have no sympathy if people can't handle these mechanics at this point in the game. You've grown up to what, 350-370+ by this point? If someone can't handle mist dragon after a few attempts after playing the literally hundreds of hours to get to this point, they need to take some time for self reflection a kick offers, perhaps reevaluate their desire to play.

Because the time they've spent has been wasted to to this point.

[TheMightyMollusk]

I feel like the strafing attack could use another second or two of warning, especially since it's just this side of instant death. The heavy hit plus dot plus stun gives you just enough time to see what killed you before it actually kills you.

Otherwise I liked it. Even if I had to keep telling the same person to stop attacking the dragon in mist form while the Regard adds were up.

[van_arn]

@van_arn: Again, the problem with the Mist Dragon is not "handling the mechanics".

I know the mechanics just fine.

It's the short time-frames they give you, the insanely short time frames. One spot of lag and he decided to swoop right at me and I'm the healer? We're done. No second chances, no vulnerability, nothing. BOOM, you're dead. Start over from second one and pray you can do the whole thing, start-to-finish, with neither the tank nor the healer having any lag.

Just.......wtf? How is that fair?

I mean, heck, in Raids, you at least have two healers and a lot of times, you CAN recover if one healer lags for a second. Well maybe not Savage, but still.

Nothing you're saying changes the fact that a few wipes due to people failing mechanics are perfectly fine at this point in the game, and if someone is causing a problem for the party then kick them.

[Esp]

Nothing you're saying changes the fact that a few wipes due to people failing mechanics are perfectly fine at this point in the game, and if someone is causing a problem for the party then kick them.

I kinda see where Maeka is coming from slightly here. Again, she's not arguing that the whole MSQ portion is difficult, it's just that the time needed to dodge one certain mechanic is rather tight. In this situation, I am assuming the dive bomb like Line AoE Mist Dragon does.

Again, there is nothing wrong with failing a fight a few times and trying again, getting better each time, but I can't fault a said "underpreformer" for not dodging a mechanic when said mechanic doesn't really give off a indication or hint of where it's coming from, like all fights, raids and trials have taught you up to this point. (For example, some dragons will appear on the outside of the arena, or even if said dragon is invisible, it will AT LEAST appear for a split second before charging up its dive to chomp down on you. Mist Dragon's second dive does none of this.) The first dive will be easily seen, so yea, dodge or die.

The second one however is about 2 to 3 seconds before your a icecube, and can come from basically anywhere. Area is covered in Mist, so if your unlucky, that dragon will be down on you before you know it. There is a reason most people answer how to dodge that with "stay to the sides and pray" xD.

It's hard to not fail a mechanic when said mechanic has, until now, not given at least a indication or hint as to where it's going, until it's way too late especially healers being the unlucky ones, and there isn't a back up raise anywhere in sight. To me, that is far from the requirement of issuing a vote kick.

I have only done the fight twice so far, clearing it without a death on the second try (cause me and the other 3 randoms ran around in circles, screaming "Not it!", having abit of fun only to see said Mist Dragon miss us all by a few inches xD) so if there is a hint I am missing on the second dive, then my apologies, but please if you know, fill us all in xD