Seriously? No mail box?

[Zenaku]

Dude, don't you white knight this thing. The game was obviously released in alpha state. There wasn't an option to organize your inventory. That says it all.
There's no mailing system not because of a fault in design, but because they released the game way way way too early.

And atm I'd rather have them make other gazillion more important stuff its missing than a mail system that'd only good for players who want to use two characters (because anima + trade = mailing system).

What he said is true and top of that i been playing this game sense release and sure a mail system would be great but so far i have not yet needed such a thing and i may not even need it. Never really use it in ffxi only when i'm in a low level class and did not want to take the long airship to jeuno to buy a item so i told a friend to buy it for me and i send the money. But in ffxiv is there a problem like that? nope i can get the airship or teleport and be there within 1sec-5min of my time.

[Rydin]

Earlier FF games created the jobs we know as classic today. With newer FF iterations many of the titles came with ambiguous renditions of jobs, some with no clear job system at all. Some, like XII and XIII, already have new and unique names for some/all of their version of jobs/classes.

So no, it is not new to XIV to present with new names for classes. What matters primarily are the skills and how they are presented. We have staples such as elemental attacks named in the classes FF nomenclature and various others that pay homage to and carry on with skills of previous FF titles such as Cure, Raise, Throw, Pummel, etc. We're further getting job skills such as Jump, Cover, and ancient magic - not to mention the job names are that of classic ones.

How you can insist that the class names FFXIV got was a major detriment to its success is beyond me, what with recent FF titles like XIII sporting names such as Commando, Ravager and Medic. Don't even bring up the FFXIII doesn't count argument, or even try to say it was bad because of those class names.

^^^
This... exactly
Jobs have been mixed... matched... mashed up... added, left out... undefined and redefined in just about every title....
Every final fantasy is someone else' vision of what each job is...
Case and Point: Games that include a summoner, that character is usually also a white mage
Khimari was a dragoon and also Blue Mage
Everyone was a summoner in FFVII
Lightning is a roughly Red Mage only because she is a hybrid of so many different things
Wakka kicked a damn Ball
FFVI had Mimes and Yetis....
Come on people... Im not asking you all to actually think outside the box... I know thats lunacy...
All Im asking is that you don't condemn someone else when they DO think outside the box....

[Sidious]

Classes - perhaps. Even then, their names or even design philosophies weren't a major problem.

Lol, which FFXIV are you playing? Because in the one I am playing, the classes and their design philosophies were so bad that they're having to essentially scrap the whole thing.

Don't even bring up the FFXIII doesn't count argument

It does count-- as a perfect example of what not to do.

[HiirNoivl]

Who gets mail at an Inn?

[NoctisUmbra]

Lol, which FFXIV are you playing? Because in the one I am playing, the classes and their design philosophies were so bad that they're having to essentially scrap the whole thing.

Their designs were bad. Not because of their names. Their naming being non-traditional had nothing to do with it. Currently classes maintain their original names and are much better designed. Nice try lol.

It does count-- as a perfect example of what not to do.

Great opinion there. Reason I referred to it is due to it being a numbered iteration of the FF series, and it predating XIV. While meeting these conditions, it also had names given Roles - to its rendition of classes/jobs - that were brand new.

Set aside the fact that not everyone hated that game, and that it sold quite well as a successful game - and that it's sequel XIII-2 uses the same Roles and is a solid RPG by any standard - any hate and/or disappointment towards XIII did not stem from their coice of names for the Roles. There were reasons to hate that game. The names of the roles were not a legitimate reason for it's failure. The semantics argument is getting old.

[coldviper18]

Lol, which FFXIV are you playing? Because in the one I am playing, the classes and their design philosophies were so bad that they're having to essentially scrap the whole thing.



It does count-- as a perfect example of what not to do.

^ What he said.
Only reason I even mention names of jobs and races is because thats exactly where the problem started. I would put my life on it, that if they just had made this FFXI - 2, with the better graphics, and some new interface and a new world it would have done way better than it did. My point is that they over complicated things from the start which made it undesirable completely. And it all started with naming the jobs and races.

Even though FFXI is old, with new graphics and a new world, I would be head over heals with a new mithra thief with amazing graphics and whole new content to explore. Instead, I have a Miqo'te? Archer thats eventually going to grow a strong desire to sign up for american idol? OK............

[whoopeeragon]

Lol, which FFXIV are you playing? Because in the one I am playing, the classes and their design philosophies were so bad that they're having to essentially scrap the whole thing.



It does count-- as a perfect example of what not to do.

^ Fruitless opinions. Since when did they scrap the whole Armoury System? They're merely tweaking it to suit future needs better; classes are still here. The Job System is just an overlay towards the Armoury System, not a replacement. Their designs were not bad at all; you may as well have called the sub-job system of FFXI equally bad as well, because the Armoury system is essentially the sub-job system except more diverse. The overhaul they did last patch? Was not a 'scrap'; they kept what made the Armoury System unique, and merely changed the abilities, not the concept. And asides from CNJ and THM, the other classes didn't go much of a large reconstruction. They certainly didn't scrap the idea behind classes at all.

And for all it's changes, the FFXIII system worked well in a tactical manner. But....if you set yourself up to hate it, you'll hate it.

[Rydin]

Lol, which FFXIV are you playing? Because in the one I am playing, the classes and their design philosophies were so bad that they're having to essentially scrap the whole thing.

I disagree with saying the launch classes were philosophical disasters
I personally thought they were well conceived but poorly executed. Tweaks were needed but overall I thought they had the right idea
I pose this:
what if each base class stayed just as vague and formless as they were at launch... but had progression trees where they branched into more specific roles

Thaum had low level heals, debuffs, nukes and Dots (I'll admit, they should have versions not nearly as powerful as they were originally given)
In terms of Jobs... what if one branch of Thaum went the way of the Ossuary with Dark Arts... and the other went the way of the Sacrarium, light or Life arts
then the dark thaum branched to DoT specialist or Battle Mage with TP moves
While the light thaum went with either Sacrifice heals or Dia/Holy Nukes
thats 4 specializations that could have each been given a name just from Thaum as a base class

the problem with Jobs is they want to have multiple jobs for each class....
and Jobs specialize. but how can you specialize in something with a job that the classes NEVER did...

If Jobs are indeed a specialization... then classes could have... and in fact... should have been kept extremely general.

I pose this to you... as it stands now... Jobs are NO MORE SPECIALIZED than the current classes....
Glads do 1 thing... TANK..... Paladin will do 1 thing... guess what that is?
Conjurers do 1 thing.... and yea.. you guessed it.. WHM does that same 1 thing....
with the way classes were changed in 1.20.... we don't need Jobs...we just need those 5 abilities
they are not specializations... they are continuations of what we've been doing with the classes

[NoctisUmbra]

^ What he said.
Only reason I even mention names of jobs and races is because thats exactly where the problem started. I would put my life on it, that if they just had made this FFXI - 2, with the better graphics, and some new interface and a new world it would have done way better than it did. My point is that they over complicated things from the start which made it undesirable completely. And it all started with naming the jobs and races.

Even though FFXI is old, with new graphics and a new world, I would be head over heals with a new mithra thief with amazing graphics and whole new content to explore. Instead, I have a Miqo'te? Archer thats eventually going to grow a strong desire to sign up for american idol? OK............

If they wanted XI-2, they would have made XI-2. When they make a new numbered iteration, SE tends to explore new design options.

As for the classes being designed poorly, I won't disagree. It is already accepted XIV had many faults. A lot of ambitious ideas that didn't quite work out. I've simply been responding to your arguments along the lines of their names and or staple designs. Not every FF game has to have the classic, traditional jobs. In fact, most numbered iterations do not.

Well conceived and poorly executed, as Rydin said above me, best expresses my feelings for the state of classes before the changes that patches brought.

[Reinheart]

Just to add to my first post on this thread.

This is from the old dev team from back in November 11th 2010 - http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com...f018ec5fb504d2

Pretty sure some of you forgot about this one lol... anyways in here under Markets and Retainers for first 2011 they did have "The addition of a delivery service" but soon after YoshiP and them took over the team looked over all of the promises the old team have made and made it clear that some features were not possible due to the server structure and mail system was one of them. I thought they mentioned this in Topics as well but can't find it.

Now I look through that list there are some other interesting stuff but I try to ignore for now, personally I think YoshiP and them are doing great on the updates and as long as 2.0 comes out on time I'm cool with it. There was this list + another one but I forget... lol