Thread: [4.4 Discussion] "Change the Future"

Originally Posted by Cybylt

Some problems there I think.

The Burn is between Garlemald and Othard, not Ala Mhigo.
Cid didn't make that thing, the Sharlayans did, we dug it out of the Gubal Library.
A flood of light, to our knowledge from 3.4, isn't just some big aether explosion.

Some supposition but I think the outcome of the Crooked Coin being overloaded is more like to be like the end of Allagan Empire. It's basically an aetherial electrical grid substation and the vast majority of them were overloaded when Dalamud was hooked up to the network, blew up, and caused the "Calamity of Earth."

Aether does strange things when it blows up in such violent fashion...

It was mentioned in the story that there isn't a refueling station in Rabanastre anymore for the ships. If the Garleans are going to demolish Ala Mihgo with ease as Zelidibus suggests, its going to be by getting airships to make the trip.
It seems strange to me that the House would have that particular rumor from the Dotharl about it, as well as the stated fact that by turning on its aether output will have large environmental effects. Aether does weird things at times, if the Dotharl's rumor and Y'shtola's observation have weight, perhaps an explosion of that same energy across the land would have results akin to the flood.

Originally Posted by Kallera

Aether does strange things when it blows up in such violent fashion...

It was mentioned in the story that there isn't a refueling station in Rabanastre anymore for the ships. If the Garleans are going to demolish Ala Mihgo with ease as Zelidibus suggests, its going to be by getting airships to make the trip.
It seems strange to me that the House would have that particular rumor from the Dotharl about it, as well as the stated fact that by turning on its aether output will have large environmental effects. Aether does weird things at times, if the Dotharl's rumor and Y'shtola's observation have weight, perhaps an explosion of that same energy across the land would have results akin to the flood.

That was all in service to the defense of Doma. Ala Mhigo is west of Ilsabard while Rabanastre is east of it. Judging off the world map, Ala Mhigo is even closer to the Garlean capital than Rabanastre is.

To my understanding of the scenes, The Crooked Coin throughout the Dotharl history was a dammed resevoir of aether that funneled energy away from locations. This could include people who threw themselves upon it. What Y'shtola did was open the floodgate, restoring natural flow of energy.

Then there's the way the Flood of Light happened. By the Warriors' account what they had done was quash all Darkness in their world until all of creation began to de-aspect, that doesn't sound the same as a flood of ambient aether flowing through the world.

Originally Posted by Theodric

There's a lot we know that the protagonists don't, of course...but at this point in time it is the Eorzean Alliance that is the aggressor rather than Garlemald. We also now know that Garlemald's past aggression was the result of Ascian meddling.

No one in the Eorzean Alliance knows that Ascians are directly in charge of Garlemald instead of just working behind the Emperor's back. For all the Eorzean Alliance knows, the Garlean Empire is about to do exactly what Elidibus wants them too; march on Ala Mhigo and overrun it. Again. The protagonists can in no way be blamed for knowing things they have no way of reasonably finding out without breaking the fourth wall.

I mean, what is the Eorzean Alliance supposed to do at this point? Wait for Garlemald to invade them again? Everyone would be complaining about why couldn't they have been proactive about preventing it in some way!

It'd be one thing if the voice told the Eorzean Alliance that spreading that kind of information in Garlemald to cause another civil war would be a bad idea. It didn't. It's as vague about specifics as it can possibly be and until anyone figures out how to verify what it is, nobody has any good reason to even trust what it is saying. Everyone knows that the Ascians love spreading misinformation. They've yet to find any reason this isn't more of the same. The voice is also confirming things the Scions already know, but offering no way for them to solve the problem. In fact, it makes the problem worse. The Scions knew that the signs for a coming calamity were there and were sopped from doing anything with that information. It also in no way stopped the Eorzean Alliance from doing what they had planned to do. They are still going to spread information in Garlemald about Zenos being possessed with the hope to spark another Civil War.

Really, the only new thing the Voice told everyone was that a Flood of Light was coming. But still, what are we supposed to do about it? The last Flood of Light was stopped (assuming this is talking about a different Flood of Light on a Shard other then the First) by getting Hydaelyn's attention and her sending her Emissary to that shard to decrease the amount of light. We (the WoL) really didn't do anything about the Flood. Urianger did. And he's in a coma same as the rest of the Scions.

If the goal of the Voice was to stop the Eorzean Alliance from trying to cause a Civil War in Garlemald, it failed spectacularly. If anything, it galvanized the Eorzean Alliance to try to succeed at it even more given the person who suggested it was knocked out by the Voice.

There are so many unknowns about the Voice that I think getting attached to any one interpretation of what it is and why it did what it did is setting people up for disappointment once we do find out what it going on with it.

How are the Scions succumbing to their own hubris? At least, any more so then they usually do. Everything since 2.0 started (for that matter, 1.0) has been based on the Scions working with whatever information they have available to them at the time. And so far it's worked out pretty well for them. They have very little reason to stop doing what they do.

I think the only time they've "succumbed to their own hubris" as you put it was when Alphinaud created the Crystal Braves. And he's determined since then to not do that again.

Like it or not, the Scions are considered experts in their respective fields by an organization that is arguably the most well educated organization known to the three continents. They are Archons for a reason. If they don't decided to do certain things, no one else in Eorzea is going to because everyone knows the Scions have spent way more time studying esoteric subjects then they have. Anyone else who might have a better understanding of things is back in Sharlayan and doesn't want to insert themselves into making history. Which the game has said time and time again isn't right. The last thing FFXIV has ever treated as a good thing is passivity. I highly doubt it's going to start treating it as a good thing now.

And while the Warrior of Light is powerful, it's highly implied that previous Warriors of Light were even more powerful then they were... And even they couldn't prevent a Calamity! We've seen a good amount of evidence that the overall power of the Warriors of Light has decreased over the eras instead of increased. If anything, I keep thinking the WoL and the Scions will have be doing more rather then less to make up for the power loss over the eras.

Originally Posted by Theodric

As an example, Hingashi was kind enough to open up Kugane to the outside world - something it isn't obligated to do - and yet there's Eorzeans scheming to establish the Isle of Val as a way to evade Kugane's trade tariffs. Despite their supposed aversion to 'imperialistic' moves they seem awfully fond of such things when it's convenient for them.

Is that Eorzea's doing though? As far as I was aware, that's the work of Rowena and the East Aldenard Trading Company. Neither of them exactly being the altruistic working-for-the-greater-good sort, and certainly not the same thing as the Eorzean Alliance trying to set up a trading post like that.

Originally Posted by Iscah

Is that Eorzea's doing though? As far as I was aware, that's the work of Rowena and the East Aldenard Trading Company. Neither of them exactly being the altruistic working-for-the-greater-good sort, and certainly not the same thing as the Eorzean Alliance trying to set up a trading post like that.

Well, they're prominent Eorzean organisations.

Furthermore, it's an example of what I refer to whenever I point out that the Warrior of Light's power is not always used for noble ends. The mystery surrounding the Isle of Val needs to be resolved, there's no doubt about that - but Hingashi does not deserve to be weakened. It's not an enemy. It's supposedly more of an ally.

I'm personally hoping that the Isle of Val will end up in a stalemate that prevents it from being exploited. Perhaps it will be far too dangerous to use as a trade hub even after whatever is sealed there is defeated or bound anew.

Are you kidding? This is the East Aldenard Trading Company we're talking about. You know... the trading company that was trying to bargain with Garlemald back in 1.0? The trading company that is already getting around Kugane's tariffs by dealing directly with the Confederacy? The company that blatantly says it could care less about the Sultana dying if it was good for business? An uninhabited island pops up in the Glass Ocean that no one's claimed yet? Yeah they're going to go for it.

And then there's Rowena who basically runs her own trading empire out of Mor Dhona... No matter how sketchy some of stuff she does is, everyone agrees her business sense is second-to-none and her products are legit. She will provide what people pay her for.

Like it or not, the Eorzean Alliance doesn't have a lot of control over the "frontier" parts of Aldenard. Mor Dhona is almost treated like it's own city-state (run by Rowena) as is Iddlyshire. And the Alliance has been shown to not have a lot of control over what it's larger Companies do either. It's not like Rowena or the EATC took over an island that belonged to Hingashi previously.

On the other side, this is Hingashi. They've all but let the Confederacy take charge of all the shipping in the Ruby Sea for as long as everyone can remember. Rowena and EATC are basically functioning like the Confederacy is, only instead of being between Hingashi and Doma, they're between Hingashi and Eorzea.