This Needs to Be Said

[Deceptus]

. Even pagos isn't that bad despite all the complaining.

You are in the minority with this opinion. Very few people like Pagos. Most just tolerate it. You dont see people making threats describing it's great features.

[KaivaC]

Wait till it actually launches, please. The salt about Pagos wasn't as justified as people thought, and I'm not going to despair about pyros based on a translated line in an interview.

This is one of those 'agree to disagree' moments. I won't go into details about my disagreements over Eureka as a whole, because there are so many countless threads pointing out every single issue. I am not holding my breath, and given the reaction to Pyros, a lot of players are getting sick of this type of content. At some point, enough is enough. Sure, there are players who enjoy this content, I won't deny that. But there should've been alternative ways to get your relic. This shouldn't be the one and only way to do your relic - this shouldn't be so reliant on having players populating an instance, or even relying on the goodwill of other players to rez you or take you in their parties to help the leveling experience go faster if you come in as a low level <---- this should not be the only option.

Again, we'll have to agree to disagree. I'm not here to debate my stance on it.

[Reynhart]

But there should've been alternative ways to get your relic.

The Eureka weapon is exclusive to Eureka as the Savage weapon is exclusive to Savage. You still have the tome weapon if you want a strong weapon that doesn't require you to do a specific content.

[Luna-M]

The Eureka weapon is exclusive to Eureka as the Savage weapon is exclusive to Savage. You still have the tome weapon if you want a strong weapon that doesn't require you to do a specific content.

In HW there was alternatives to build you relic. There is no reason you have to be forced into a poor design like Eureka. I build 3 weapons in Anemos. They will remain there. Pagos was cancer and I have no hopes for next zone.

[Reynhart]

In HW there was alternatives to build you relic.

Yeah, right...farm tomestones, next step, farm tomestones, next step, farm tomestones...Frankly, I'll take a dozen Eureka zones just to not have to farm tomestones ever again.
Still, you have a very decent alternative to both the Eureka weapon and the Savage weapon, you can easily not do those if you don't like them and let those who do enjoy.

In fact, like Ko_ said, it's important that you don't do it if you don't like it, as it's the only way to see if the content is really successful or not, since the people who post here can never speak for the majority wether they praise or complain about something.

If not for relic and AF gear Eureka would have been dead on arrival just like Diadem 1 and 2 were.

If not for weapons and mounts, EX Primals would be dead after the first week.
If not for gear, 8-man and 24-man raids would de bead after the first week.
Claiming that a content is alive only because its reward is attracting is...well, the very core of every content in an MMO.

[Ilan]

The Eureka weapon is exclusive to Eureka as the Savage weapon is exclusive to Savage. You still have the tome weapon if you want a strong weapon that doesn't require you to do a specific content.

And this is what makes it not a relic. With all relics before you had different ways or at least some variety in your quests. But now you are forced into a long designed instanced content with 0 variety. The only reason it didn't die already is because SE threw the "relic" into that and people took the bait.

[Aerlana]

People defending eureka/diadem as they exists now are part of the problem. Yes.

A small part in my opinion.


Diadem failed, did live what... 3 weeks?
Diadem 2 failed² and people ran away after 1 week.
Then, Yoshida said "okay, we understood, stop diadem. And the diadem's team will take the time needed to do a better content for stormblood" (around 17 month from this to anemos release... they had time...)

Same team, nearly same content... nothing surprising would say.

BUT there is 1 big matter. Yoshida mainly watch what people are doing. "oh, they dont go to the feast, have to change things in PvP/Feast" "oh, everyone ran away from gordias, have to rethink the way we work sadic content". Yes people also speaked... But also, lot people did cry with atma step during ARR, do i have to remember what was the first relic stop for HW? (thank to the Zeta-skip \o/)

Atma? A lot people cried (all?) but a lot (all?) did stay doing them to get their relic. then animus, nexus, novus etc etc.

People are going anemos, pagos, pyros, (next will be Mykonos? wouldnt change a lot with what we have). So Yoshida probably think that, even if people are crying, the content is good enough.
Pagos, people was leaving because no fate train = no easy exp = more boring than boring. people running away => paaaaaaatch and return of fate train.

People continue to use any content = this content is good enough, continue

[JunseiKei]

Diadem failed, did live what... 3 weeks?

To be fair, Diadem 1.0 would have probably lived a lot longer had SE not stepped up and changed how the instance works. 1.0a diadem was everyone go to dino island and massive train monsters for chests and spawn NMs. Loot is "shared" (contribution based, much like FATEs are). 1.0b diadem rolled out and now it was completely group VS group to the point that mass training was not possible - no group could score enough contribution on a NM to gain chests. SE's response was "we didn't think players would have helped each other."

We see the same thing pan- out in Eureka. Anemos has a lot of players training NMs and FATEs. Pagos pretty much killed that completely. SE just wants to kill efficiency.

[Aerlana]

To be fair, Diadem 1.0 would have probably lived a lot longer had SE not stepped up and changed how the instance works. 1.0a diadem was everyone go to dino island and massive train monsters for chests and spawn NMs. Loot is "shared" (contribution based, much like FATEs are). 1.0b diadem rolled out and now it was completely group VS group to the point that mass training was not possible - no group could score enough contribution on a NM to gain chests. SE's response was "we didn't think players would have helped each other."

I dont want to say the reason it was finally a fail. not my matter there. Just, Eureka is the newborn from the story begining with eureka 1.0. And a failed content is due to the dev team decisions. (i dislike the "players doesnt play the content the way we hoped" ... )


For the "schedule" matter.
People cried for Anemos. Pagos was wosrt (due to the no fate train) and is finally not really better from anemos...
They can also say "ok, we failed, we admit, we stop eureka for now, and... work it for a real good version in 5.X"
What after for relic in 4.4+ ? Old fashion. They arent worst than eureka (not really better). They lower the farm to each part (and do more parts with 5 ilvl each).

Because what that seems to be for Pyros.. .seems going to go deeper than pagos... (how do they do this? ... )

[Claviusnex]

To be fair, Diadem 1.0 would have probably lived a lot longer had SE not stepped up and changed how the instance works. 1.0a diadem was everyone go to dino island and massive train monsters for chests and spawn NMs. Loot is "shared" (contribution based, much like FATEs are). 1.0b diadem rolled out and now it was completely group VS group to the point that mass training was not possible - no group could score enough contribution on a NM to gain chests. SE's response was "we didn't think players would have helped each other."

We see the same thing pan- out in Eureka. Anemos has a lot of players training NMs and FATEs. Pagos pretty much killed that completely. SE just wants to kill efficiency.

It doesn't just seem that SE wants to kill efficiency but that they don't want groups to help each other and rather see them compete. It impresses me as a kind of PvP mentality without forcing PvP (want to make clear I have no issues with PvP or those that like to play it).