Removing Gender-locked Poses

[Kidria]

I think some of it also comes from the ideas of 'masculine' vs 'feminine.' In terms of the DRK pose, which seems to be the most brought up example, it appears 'more manly' to have a massive sword slung over the shoulder, held with one hand. It's a display of strength. For a female, having it downward in the ground held with both hands is less aggressive (as in, "manly") and more defensive. To be honest, the male pose (as boring as it seems, and yes it's Cloud's) makes a dark knight look aggressive and dangerous, while the female pose puts emphasis on the 'knightly' or 'defensive' ("Tank") side of it.

That said, the ideas of masculine vs feminine have gone out the door since they gave the bunny suit to males. I don't see a point of gender-locks on job specific poses, as long as it stays to the job.

[Gemina]

I don't really see a reason not to allow these cpose changes, but it also doesn't really matter to me either way. I would actually like to see more cposes added all the way around.

Hairstyles are kind of similar to some of the gear that is locked whereas some of them make sense to have locked, while others don't make any sense at all. For example, a lot of Miqo'te hairstyles are only going to look good on them because their facial structures and ears are taken into account when designing them. However, most-if not all of the race exclusive ponytails can be worn by all races and look just fine.

I think using practicality and aesthetics as determining factors as to what to lock and not have locked complicates things, but the current character customization is reflective of an old school console game rather than a moderate mmo. Updating this and tossing out a free fantasia to everyone would be one helluvan ace SE could use to make everyone say, "THANK YOU SE!!!"

[Xion136]

I think some of it also comes from the ideas of 'masculine' vs 'feminine.' In terms of the DRK pose, which seems to be the most brought up example, it appears 'more manly' to have a massive sword slung over the shoulder, held with one hand. It's a display of strength. For a female, having it downward in the ground held with both hands is less aggressive (as in, "manly") and more defensive. To be honest, the male pose (as boring as it seems, and yes it's Cloud's) makes a dark knight look aggressive and dangerous, while the female pose puts emphasis on the 'knightly' or 'defensive' ("Tank") side of it.

That said, the ideas of masculine vs feminine have gone out the door since they gave the bunny suit to males. I don't see a point of gender-locks on job specific poses, as long as it stays to the job.

I understand the want for masculine/feminine, I do. The Red Mage at ready poses are a good example of the same intent but expressed differently. The dragoon ones don't have the same intent and it then locks out female DRGs from an iconic pose. Even PLD gives an iconic pose in the Lightning stance - which still doesn't stop me from wanting Cecil's.

Not goin lie, I didn't even notice that the 2 gender had different idol poses till about a year ago.

Still good luck and all but me personally not really a big deal but good luck non the less.

For me, it's a big deal because I love screenshots and well, for me - more options means more screenshots!

[Gemina]

For me, it's a big deal because I love screenshots and well, for me - more options means more screenshots!

If screenshots are your thing, improvisation might help. For example the DRK victory pose will have even the females rest their blade on their shoulder in a similar fashion to the male's unsheathed idle stance:



Play around a bit and see if you can discover more!

[Xion136]

If screenshots are your thing, improvisation might help. For example the DRK victory pose will have even the females rest their blade on their shoulder in a similar fashion to the male's unsheathed idle stance:



Play around a bit and see if you can discover more!

I've done a lot of posing to see what I can do xD was taking screenshots for a friend on my Raen, the Au Ra /pose is fantastic for showing off dresses (was in the than wool dress). My issue is coming up to DRG 50 is I'm locked out of the Iconic Dragoon pose due to my characters gender - which is my catalsyt. And no poses let makes use the female idle pose for DRK too :c

Trying to up my screenshot game is hard when I can't make my visions without finagling things x.x

[Astrus]

The one thing I miss about having a female avatar is that DRG pose. I liked it as a dynamic pose.

[TaiyoShikasu]

You'll get people who will be opposed to this in order to keep some sort of semblance of gender/race identity.

Personally, I'd be down for it. Don't care much if my race has a hairstyle others don't. I feel like races and their respective models are already distinct enough.

That argument fails to hold water because there's literally no reason why only female Miqo'te can stand with one heel off the ground. That applies to literally any emote with an animation restricted by race or gender that doesn't involve something specific to that race such as male Miqo'te wiggling their ears when using /joy. That being locked to males of the race makes no sense as they're not the only ones with ears.

In regards to hair, literally every race has hair and racial identity comes from the characteristics exclusive to that race such as Au Ra having scales.

I personally am against this because I don’t like the idea of needing everything being available to everyone. I feel like restrictions/limitations make things a little more interesting. Just my 2 cents though!

Limitations do the opposite of that though.

[Hazama999]

That argument fails to hold water because there's literally no reason why only female Miqo'te can stand with one heel off the ground. That applies to literally any emote with an animation restricted by race or gender that doesn't involve something specific to that race such as male Miqo'te wiggling their ears when using /joy. That being locked to males of the race makes no sense as they're not the only ones with ears.

In regards to hair, literally every race has hair and racial identity comes from the characteristics exclusive to that race such as Au Ra having scales.



Limitations do the opposite of that though.

I'm not entirely sure why you replied to me. I'm for unlocking gender/race-locked gear and I understand the limitations of the arguments against it.

[Kirsten_Rev]

That argument fails to hold water because there's literally no reason why only female Miqo'te can stand with one heel off the ground. That applies to literally any emote with an animation restricted by race or gender that doesn't involve something specific to that race such as male Miqo'te wiggling their ears when using /joy. That being locked to males of the race makes no sense as they're not the only ones with ears.

In regards to hair, literally every race has hair and racial identity comes from the characteristics exclusive to that race such as Au Ra having scales.

In fairness, not every restriction must, nor even should, arise out of a sense of realism. I think the gender-based restrictions are fairly objectively bad (at least given the lore behind races that we currently have), but racial ones help to inform the identity of that race. Miqo'te, as an example, are modeled off FFXI's Mithra, and from a lore standpoint, they're quite aware of their sexuality, and know how to play off this. For that race, 'sexier' sorts of poses are natural, because they've been raised with them. Elezen (Elvaan from FFXI), on the other hand, have absolutely no such racial awareness of their sexuality in either game. Their racial poses almost certainly shouldn't seem intentionally sexy, because it doesn't fit the racial lore.

I'm for unlocking gender/race-locked gear and I understand the limitations of the arguments against it.

I don't think the arguments are limited, per se - I just think they're different. Personally I think XIV should be consistent first and foremost: if they're going to aim for an immersive experience, aim for it. If they're not (and they aren't), then open the floodgates on options without worrying about any impact. That said, there is an impact.

The impact becomes clear to me in examining the different ways I engage with FFXI and FFXIV (well, engaged* for FFXI). In FFXI, I paid attention to people's looks and races. An unusual look might mean particularly exotic gear I hadn't really come across before, perhaps an option for my own character. A Tarutaru meant a less tanky PLD, but one that was ultimately able to handle a higher level of their own healing. So on and so forth.

In FFXIV? I don't really pay attention to other players at all. I don't really notice their race. I certainly don't give a fig about their Glamour. It's all too jumbled-together, too meaningless for me to care. In requesting more and more options for customization, the people who (presumably) are most interested in putting their identity out into greater Eorzea have ironically caused me to simply not pay any attention at all to the efforts.

Obviously this is dependent on the player, but it's worth keeping in mind. I don't begrudge any player their enjoyment in XIV, and I'm glad everyone's having fun with the Glamours and the poses, and wanting more options. That's great - it means a healthier FFXIV. But there are players out there like me, too, who simply throw up their hands at the resulting chaos, and tune out entirely as a result.

[PyurBlue]

but racial ones help to inform the identity of that race. Miqo'te, as an example, are modeled off FFXI's Mithra, and from a lore standpoint, they're quite aware of their sexuality, and know how to play off this. For that race, 'sexier' sorts of poses are natural, because they've been raised with them. Elezen (Elvaan from FFXI), on the other hand, have absolutely no such racial awareness of their sexuality in either game. Their racial poses almost certainly shouldn't seem intentionally sexy, because it doesn't fit the racial lore.

Perhaps, but only if you ignore the individual for the sake of racial identity. While you would expect a Miqo'te to use a sexy pose, that doesn't mean all Miqo'te would be using that exact pose all of the time. It would actually be pretty jarring. Personally I also find it bland when a character's race fully defines them. While FF14 isn't necessarily guilty of this when it comes to race poses since we have change pose with a few options, I don't think any of the poses actually draw connections to the race using them for me. I think you need some kind of adherence to realism (in this case, with every race being more or less human, there is no reason why one race couldn't imitate another's idle poses) or you end up breaking immersion.

There are other factors too, like development time. The dev's can't give us an infinite set of poses. However when you just have one or two stances as we do with job quests, it becomes harder not to break the 4th wall.

The impact becomes clear to me in examining the different ways I engage with FFXI and FFXIV (well, engaged* for FFXI). In FFXI, I paid attention to people's looks and races. An unusual look might mean particularly exotic gear I hadn't really come across before, perhaps an option for my own character. A Tarutaru meant a less tanky PLD, but one that was ultimately able to handle a higher level of their own healing. So on and so forth.

In FFXIV? I don't really pay attention to other players at all. I don't really notice their race. I certainly don't give a fig about their Glamour. It's all too jumbled-together, too meaningless for me to care. In requesting more and more options for customization, the people who (presumably) are most interested in putting their identity out into greater Eorzea have ironically caused me to simply not pay any attention at all to the efforts.

Your opinions are your own, but I'm having trouble working out your reasoning. How can't you notice a player's race in FF14? It's probably safe to say that confusing a Roegadyn for a Lalafell is impossible. Miqo, Hyur, and Aura are a little less distinct but have pretty obvious tells. When it comes to gear, FF14 shouldn't be very different from what you describe. An usual look might very well mean exotic gear that you've never come across which may or may not be an option for your character. I would also expect increased variety to give you more of those moments where something catches your eyes. When a class is limited wearing class armor, that immediately negates a large number of visual combinations. Maybe I misunderstood what you're saying?